[0:00] I might get sued for this, but imagine
[0:03] you made a YouTube video about a phone.
[0:05] You get it out the box, you test it, but
[0:07] you feel like something's off. So, you
[0:10] tell your viewers, but then you receive
[0:11] a court order. You're legally forced to
[0:14] take your video down. You're banned from
[0:15] ever saying anything negative about that
[0:17] phone again, and so is everyone else.
[0:20] And suddenly, it all erupts into what
[0:22] can only be described as a war within
[0:24] the tech community. That would be crazy,
[0:26] right? Right. This is one of the most
[0:28] fascinating, alarming situations that
[0:31] I've ever seen on my 15 years making
[0:33] YouTube videos. And it's also currently
[0:35] a very real active legal case. So, the
[0:38] YouTubers involved are not allowed to
[0:40] comment. But I will. I've got the
[0:42] products. I've got the receipts. I've
[0:44] consulted the experts and people at the
[0:46] very heart of the situation. And if
[0:48] anyone wants to sue me, I'd love to see
[0:50] them try.
[0:54] Quick context. India is the second
[0:56] biggest smartphone market on earth with
[0:58] over 700 million users. But at least
[1:00] twothirds of the phones sold there from
[1:02] brands like Xiaomi and Vivo and Oppo are
[1:05] Chinese, which has created this massive
[1:07] opportunity for someone to come in and
[1:09] make a phone in India. Partly for the
[1:11] same reason that Brits love their made
[1:12] in Britain logo and Americans like to
[1:15] buy American. It would help Indians to
[1:17] support the economy of the country they
[1:18] live in, but also compounded by the fact
[1:20] that India and China don't have the best
[1:22] relationship. Long story short, lots of
[1:24] border clashes and a lack of trust. So
[1:26] over the years, a bunch of companies
[1:28] have tried. You've had Carbon, you've
[1:30] had Microax, you've had Lava, all
[1:32] leaning into this national pride,
[1:33] plastering their marketing campaigns
[1:35] with this promise of made in India. But
[1:37] they've all failed to capture any kind
[1:39] of meaningful market share. Because
[1:40] ultimately, while their products might
[1:42] be assembled in India, they're still
[1:44] designed in China. And if you're going
[1:46] to buy a designed in China phone, then
[1:48] you might as well just buy it direct
[1:50] from a Chinese company like Xiaomi and
[1:52] get it even cheaper.
[1:57] Which sets the stage for July 2025 when
[2:00] a new brand called AI Plus launches with
[2:03] the pitch of delivering India's first
[2:05] fully sovereign smartphone.
[2:06] >> Expertly engineered and meticulously
[2:08] built in India. And they went one step
[2:10] further than the rest to say that it
[2:11] even
[2:12] >> prioritizes your privacy and secures
[2:14] stores your data in India.
[2:16] >> So any of your data that has to go
[2:17] online they're saying will be securely
[2:20] stored
[2:20] >> in Google Cloud India regions.
[2:23] >> This built-in India strategy is
[2:24] absolutely central to the entire case.
[2:26] So, it's important to stress just how
[2:29] much they leaned into it. Like how it
[2:31] literally spells out on the boot screen
[2:33] of my AI plus phone here, "Your data
[2:35] stays safe in India." Or how they said
[2:37] their phones are so secure that they
[2:39] are, and I quote, "certified for
[2:41] government, all amplified by the CEO
[2:43] firing shots at other companies for not
[2:46] holding themselves to the same
[2:47] standards." Referring to other Indian
[2:49] brands, he said, "Made in India means
[2:51] little if software and updates come from
[2:52] abroad." and then referring to the
[2:54] abundance of Chinese phones. This
[2:56] foreign dominance raises critical
[2:57] concerns about data privacy. And if AI
[3:00] Plus hadn't already made their stance
[3:01] extremely clear, then nothing summarizes
[3:04] it better than what I can only describe
[3:06] as their comic book strip of an advert.
[3:09] It starts with this poor Indian man
[3:10] who's woken up to find that someone's
[3:12] taken a large loan in his name without
[3:14] his consent.
[3:17] >> Oh, right. Yeah, it's this Chinese guy.
[3:21] Chinese not safe
[3:29] >> AI plus smartphone.
[3:31] >> I think I've read fortune cookies with
[3:33] more nuance, but you get the point.
[3:39] So, you might be wondering who is this
[3:40] AI plus CEO? This Indian hero who's
[3:43] about to show the Chinese who's boss.
[3:45] Mav Sheth, a man with a very colored
[3:48] history of making phones. He was a sales
[3:50] director for OPPO in India. He then
[3:51] co-founded and became CEO of Realme. He
[3:54] ran that company for 5 years and by the
[3:56] time he left in 2023. It was the fourth
[3:58] biggest smartphone brand in the country.
[4:00] Then he went off to lead Honor in India
[4:02] hopped over to Alcatel to do the same
[4:04] until finally deciding to build his own
[4:06] phones with AI Plus. So two things jump
[4:09] out to me. One that with work experience
[4:11] like that, I can't think of a single
[4:14] person more qualified to start their own
[4:16] tech company. Then second is for someone
[4:19] who's seemingly so vehemently against
[4:21] China, he sure has spent a lot of his
[4:24] career working for Chinese companies.
[4:27] >> Chinese not safe.
[4:29] >> Now to be fair, got to hand the mouth of
[4:31] guys flowers. The prices of the products
[4:33] that he's launched, they seem really
[4:35] reasonable. Amongst other products,
[4:36] there were two phones. The Pulse, their
[4:38] 4G phone, starting at 4,499 rupees, and
[4:42] then the Nova, their 5G phone, starting
[4:43] at $7499. Right now, that's equivalent
[4:46] to $47 and $79.
[4:49] So, like, how wrong can this go?
[4:56] Well, the first crack appeared when
[4:58] YouTuber Gan Therapy got his hands on
[5:00] the phone and posted a video. He
[5:01] highlighted that this supposedly brand
[5:03] new built-in India software, which the
[5:05] brand calls Next Quantum OS, does seem
[5:08] to look awfully similar to Realme's
[5:10] operating system, which is definitely
[5:12] not built in India. doesn't prove
[5:14] anything. But it does make me wonder, if
[5:16] you were actually building a new Android
[5:18] skin from scratch for this brand new
[5:20] company you started, why would you not
[5:22] make it look different to what's out
[5:24] there? Especially when what's out there
[5:25] is the company that you used to run and
[5:28] are now competing against? And then Gon
[5:31] Therapy found three apps on the phone.
[5:33] Clean Assistant, Phone Clone, and Mobile
[5:35] Butler. Which, by the way, I also have
[5:36] on my phone. Clean Assistant, Phone
[5:38] Clone, and My Mobile Butler is called
[5:40] Phone Manager, presumably because it's
[5:42] been updated since. These apps came
[5:44] pre-installed. You can't disable them or
[5:46] uninstall them. And he asks, "How could
[5:49] they keep your data in India if they are
[5:52] actually Chinese apps?" Why would he say
[5:55] that? Well, because when you pop into
[5:56] the privacy policy of Phone Clone, who
[5:59] else but a China based company, Sprocom
[6:02] Technologies, who's very clearly spelled
[6:04] out as the service provider. I screen
[6:05] grabbed the entire policy and made it
[6:07] public in case you fancy a very long
[6:09] read. But the point is, you don't have
[6:11] to scroll very far for it to raise some
[6:14] eyebrows. We may collect your personal
[6:16] information by one, information you
[6:18] provide directly to us, two, information
[6:20] we obtain automatically during your use
[6:22] of this application, and three,
[6:24] information we obtain from other
[6:26] sources. And then for the other two
[6:27] apps, there isn't a privacy policy, but
[6:29] we managed to extract the app files,
[6:31] ping them off to a very smart Android
[6:33] researcher who's chosen to remain
[6:34] anonymous. And this is what he said. All
[6:36] these three apps are built in China for
[6:38] sure. They just change the package name
[6:40] to make it look like they are built from
[6:42] scratch as part of next quantum OS
[6:45] followed by all the screenshots proving
[6:47] this fact. Now, does this mean that your
[6:49] data is going to be sold to the highest
[6:51] bidder and the Chinese triads are about
[6:53] to knock on your door and ransom you to
[6:55] get it back? Probably not. Most apps
[6:58] collect data. But the point is, can this
[7:00] app guarantee that not a shred of your
[7:03] data leaves India, which is what's being
[7:06] promised in no uncertain terms here.
[7:08] Well, that feels less certain. Now, I'm
[7:11] going to be confronting MV himself about
[7:13] these apps. But for now, what you need
[7:15] to know is that for saying what he said,
[7:17] Yan Therapy received a legal notice from
[7:19] the AI Plus company and his video has
[7:21] been geollocked, meaning that I can
[7:23] still watch it here in the UK. But if we
[7:25] VPN over to India, you can see that you
[7:27] straight up can't there bear. This is
[7:29] already pretty unheard of for a tech
[7:30] review. But this isn't the shocking
[7:32] part.
[7:37] I was curious about this whole Sprocon
[7:39] thing. I never heard of the company, but
[7:41] I also couldn't help but feel like they
[7:42] were part of the bigger picture here.
[7:44] So, I had a browse and I don't think
[7:46] I've ever seen a load of nonsense quite
[7:48] like it. There's pages and pages of
[7:50] stuff like connect with mind. Connect
[7:54] with mind. Again, I've never read a more
[7:56] generic sounding company profile. And
[7:58] their company culture connect with mind.
[8:01] Well, of course. And then their
[8:03] corporate mission is supposedly
[8:05] connected intelligent
[8:08] intelligental.
[8:11] So, what on earth could this China based
[8:14] company that can't even spell
[8:16] intelligence have to do with our made in
[8:18] India smartphone that literally has
[8:20] intelligence in its name? I was about to
[8:22] quit, but then I stumbled into this
[8:23] page. Oh, Sprocom do make phones. And
[8:27] while this is not exactly this, it's
[8:30] pretty hard to ignore the similarities.
[8:32] How aligned the camera module and the
[8:34] camera positioning is. How from the side
[8:36] and the bottom, these two feel like a
[8:38] mirror image. Not to mention how almost
[8:40] every spec, including the display, looks
[8:43] identical. So, here's what you need to
[8:45] understand. There are two ways to get a
[8:47] tech product made. You can either
[8:49] ideulate it, design it, and own all the
[8:51] rights to it yourself, like Apple, for
[8:53] example, who then just hands over the
[8:55] brief to a contract manufacturer to do
[8:57] the building for them, to Apple's exact
[8:59] spec. But the other option is to go to
[9:01] an ODM or original design manufacturer.
[9:05] This is a company who builds the
[9:06] products, but has also done the
[9:08] designing, the ideation, and often owns
[9:11] the rights to their designs, too. And
[9:12] so, all you do as a customer is request
[9:14] slight variations, get your logo added
[9:17] to it, and brand it as your own. And so
[9:19] Sprocom, according to an official
[9:21] business report, is a Chinese ODM, which
[9:25] you know is not in itself unusual, but
[9:27] it does cast even more doubt on just how
[9:30] much of the imagining and building that
[9:33] AI Plus is actually doing themselves. To
[9:35] give you an idea, within just half an
[9:36] hour of digging, I managed to find four
[9:38] other supposed clients of this Sprocom
[9:40] company, and all of their phones look
[9:43] remarkably similar to ones on Sprocom's
[9:45] site. So, when you look at this, how
[9:47] much does it look like Sprocom's clients
[9:49] are really researching and developing
[9:51] themselves? And how much does it look
[9:53] like they're largely just taking what
[9:54] Sprocom gave them?
[10:00] And um I've come to learn something else
[10:03] about Sprocom through a conversation
[10:05] with someone who's let's just say very
[10:07] high up and very involved in the Indian
[10:09] supply chain.
[10:10] >> Basically, you have different tiers of
[10:12] ODMs. So up there you have ODMs in the
[10:14] likes of Long Chair. They work with
[10:16] brands like OPPO, Vivo, Samsung. Then
[10:19] you also have good ODMs. They work with
[10:21] brands like nothing or Moto.
[10:24] >> Yeah.
[10:24] >> And then you have low tier ODMs. And
[10:26] those ODMs are known for making very
[10:28] very cheap products. This includes ODMs
[10:30] like Procom.
[10:32] >> There is no R&D involved. The product
[10:34] exists. What you do is just you
[10:36] customize slightly the back of the phone
[10:38] so that it looks a bit different. They
[10:40] cut a lot of corners. The way they make
[10:42] things very costefficient is having a
[10:43] very cheap supply chain. They use a lot
[10:45] of like secondhand components. The
[10:47] biggest opportunity is when it comes to
[10:48] the memory chips. For reference, for 64
[10:51] GB memory, you'll probably get around as
[10:53] low as $20 versus $60 if you are buying
[10:56] it new.
[10:57] >> So people are buying a new product, but
[10:59] actually the memory chips inside are
[11:00] from used products.
[11:02] >> Exactly.
[11:03] >> Given that in India specifically, there
[11:04] are tons of phones in that lower price
[11:06] bracket. Would you say that's probably
[11:07] the case with most of them?
[11:09] >> No, that's the thing. If you look this
[11:11] year, whether it's like OPPO, Vivo, they
[11:13] haven't been launching any phones in
[11:15] that price point. Those players are the
[11:17] ones kind of working with the tier one
[11:18] ODMs I mentioned because they don't do
[11:20] this type of like more dirty work.
[11:22] >> So, my takeaway from this is there's
[11:24] actually two layers of dubiousness. On
[11:27] top of AI+'s already debatable claims
[11:29] about how Indian their products are,
[11:31] according to this insider, by buying a
[11:33] phone sourced from Sprocom, you're also,
[11:36] ironically, getting a lower quality
[11:38] product than the Chinese companies that
[11:40] AI Plus is trying so hard to separate
[11:43] themselves from.
[11:48] But if everything we've seen so far has
[11:50] felt sus, then AI Plus's wave 2 is where
[11:54] this situation just explodes. Because
[11:56] now we move into this year, 2026, where
[11:58] AI Plus launches their second set of
[12:00] products. One of them being the Pulse 2.
[12:02] That's actually the one I'm holding
[12:03] here. And this time, clearly the
[12:04] YouTubers are ready because one of them,
[12:06] Techweiser, drops a video titled, "This
[12:08] Indian phone is a marketing disaster."
[12:10] Now, this video got taken down
[12:12] completely. It's part of the evidence
[12:13] being used in the court case. I'm
[12:15] getting to that, but he accused the
[12:17] company of a few things. One of them
[12:19] being how it's just a bit strange that
[12:20] the CEO has gone on the record to brag
[12:22] about the lack of bloatware. First and
[12:24] foremost, no bloat wares.
[12:26] >> The bloatware still exists. It existed
[12:28] on his phone. It exists on my phone.
[12:30] It's hidden from the app drawer, so you
[12:32] can only tell when you open up this game
[12:34] space hub. But this absolutely counts as
[12:36] bloatware by my definition. It's
[12:39] preloaded. The games are spammy and
[12:41] adfilled. Many people will not want
[12:43] them, and yet they are still taking up
[12:45] storage space. Again, Mardev has his own
[12:47] defense for this, but we're getting to
[12:49] him. More concerningly than bloatware
[12:51] though, Techwise's other claim is that
[12:53] you know the Chinese apps that were
[12:54] present on the first AI Plus phones that
[12:56] caused the entire scandal. Well, he said
[12:58] that all of those apps were actually
[13:00] still on the new phone. Two of them had
[13:03] now been hidden, but just by plugging
[13:04] into a laptop and entering a quick
[13:06] command, he could reveal them again. And
[13:08] then he finished off this video by
[13:09] recapping all the companies that
[13:10] Mardiff's worked at, explaining that
[13:12] each one has deserted customers in some
[13:14] way and concludes that the biggest
[13:16] reason to not trust this phone or trust
[13:19] this entire company is the founder Mard
[13:22] of Sheth. 5 days after that, a second
[13:25] bombshell drops. This time from another
[13:26] channel, Techbar. And he goes even
[13:29] harder because as well as the AI Plus
[13:31] Pulse 2, one of the other new products
[13:32] launched was the Nova Flip. And Techbar
[13:35] says that this phone is exactly the same
[13:37] phone as the Chinese ZTE Nubia Flip 2.
[13:41] He says they have the same battery
[13:42] processor, that the camera seems the
[13:44] same as a ZTE, and I can see why he'd
[13:46] say that. He didn't actually have the
[13:48] phone in hand when shooting his video,
[13:51] but I do. And in fact, I can tell you
[13:54] this is a ZTE phone. I can see all sorts
[13:56] of apps and sensors with clearly labeled
[13:59] ZTE identifiers. And here's the thing.
[14:01] If anyone were to argue that maybe the
[14:03] links to China are fairly minor surface
[14:05] level on the pulse phones, I don't think
[14:07] that can be argued for the flip. The
[14:09] compass app ZTE, the AI engine ZTE, the
[14:12] fingerprint service ZTE, and we should
[14:14] probably at this point just register the
[14:16] 20 to 30 and sometimes more permissions
[14:19] given to these services.
[14:22] Anyway,
[14:24] Techbar then goes on to say, "If you
[14:26] think it took me a lot of effort to find
[14:28] this flip phone example, it's not like
[14:30] that." He says, "Look into any of their
[14:32] products and you'll find a Chinese
[14:33] copy." And credit where credit's due, I
[14:36] too found one in about 3 minutes of
[14:38] soouththing. Their website has a
[14:40] download section here. So, that takes
[14:41] you to, I guess, the support page. Need
[14:44] help setting up your device? Well, screw
[14:46] you because that button doesn't work.
[14:48] Good start. In fact, the one link on
[14:50] this page that actually does work is a
[14:52] link to the app for the kids watch that
[14:54] they sell. You click download Lee Fine
[14:57] Technology. Lee Fine Technology
[15:01] doesn't sound Indian. So, let's search
[15:04] that up. Oh, would you look at that?
[15:05] Based in Shenzen. And it's not just a
[15:08] software thing. Yet again, the hardware
[15:10] on the Leifine website looks identical
[15:12] to the hardware that AI Plus is selling.
[15:14] So, very likely another ODM to add to
[15:17] the list. But then the most curious
[15:18] example that tech bar gives is the
[15:20] wearbuds. The AI plus also launched.
[15:22] This watch that contains earphones
[15:24] inside of it which MV have said at the
[15:26] launch event were also
[15:27] >> this is the design which we have
[15:28] designed in India patented in India.
[15:30] >> Techbar claims this product too is in
[15:32] fact clearly just this product made by a
[15:35] Chinese company AI power. What on earth
[15:37] is happening here? And this is super
[15:39] weird. If you go on to the official
[15:41] verified Instagram page of this Chinese
[15:44] AI power company, they actually posted
[15:46] about the AI plus launch event with the
[15:48] caption wherebuds watch great
[15:50] cooperation with AI plus brand. If this
[15:53] product was designed entirely in India,
[15:55] why would a Chinese brand, and yes, I
[15:58] know they're a Chinese brand because I
[16:00] asked them and they told me, say great
[16:02] cooperation. And while we're at it,
[16:04] doesn't this AI power logo look a little
[16:07] familiar? As a matter of fact, I've
[16:09] actually cut out the AI Plus logo here,
[16:12] and you can watch me live as I show you
[16:13] that you can place the AI from AI Plus
[16:17] exactly on top of the AI and AI power.
[16:20] Does that strike you as two companies
[16:21] who have nothing to do with each other?
[16:24] How many Chinese partners can this one
[16:26] anti-Chinese company have?
[16:32] 14 days later, both of these videos
[16:35] disappeared from the internet. The Delhi
[16:37] High Court in India granted AI plus an
[16:39] exparte injunction against the YouTubers
[16:42] which means that without hearing them
[16:44] first techiser and tech bar were now
[16:46] restrained from publishing disparaging
[16:49] content about AI plus or M of chef. And
[16:52] there's one more wrinkle a third person
[16:53] was named John Doe. This is the court's
[16:56] way of also saying unnamed future
[16:59] critic, which means it's the two
[17:00] YouTubers, but also anyone else that is
[17:03] banned from and could be charged for
[17:06] speaking against AI Plus. This clause
[17:08] has already led to legal action against
[17:10] at least 10 other YouTube videos. That
[17:12] is a drastic response. So, I decided
[17:16] it's time to call in the eagle.
[17:21] So, could you clarify what exactly an
[17:23] exparte case is? Exparte is where you
[17:26] are the only side going in front of the
[17:29] court. Only one side is presenting their
[17:31] case. And you can imagine in an
[17:33] adversarial system that relies on both
[17:35] parties being there that if you're the
[17:37] only one in the court, it's a whole lot
[17:39] easier to present your case than it is
[17:40] that the other side is contradicting the
[17:43] things that you are saying.
[17:44] >> Right. That makes sense. But then in
[17:47] what kinds of contexts are you expecting
[17:49] to see exparte?
[17:50] >> For example, a domestic violence
[17:52] restraining order. uh often happen
[17:55] exparte because there are presumably
[17:58] real safety risks if both parties were
[18:00] there. So that's an example of something
[18:02] where an exparte procedure is used more
[18:05] often.
[18:06] >> Yeah, that's what's confusing me. This
[18:08] isn't that at all. This is a tech review
[18:10] where the reviewers have been critical
[18:12] to the brand but also the guy behind it
[18:14] >> in the context of seeking an order
[18:17] preventing the disclosure of tech news
[18:21] or a tech news related thing that would
[18:23] be basically unheard of.
[18:24] >> He explained that expartate at least in
[18:26] the US would require you to show
[18:28] irreparable harm and that if in this
[18:30] context any damages created could be
[18:33] solved by just paying someone money i.e.
[18:35] financial loss, then that wouldn't count
[18:38] as irreparable.
[18:40] But that's the US.
[18:41] >> I do know that the laws are very
[18:42] different between the United States in
[18:44] particular and India. In the United
[18:46] States, you basically cannot be held
[18:48] liable for defamation if what you're
[18:50] saying is true. The laws in India are
[18:54] much more plaintiff friendly and they
[18:56] are much stricter to the point where
[18:58] sometimes even saying something that is
[19:01] true can give rise to a defamation
[19:04] claim. Okay, got it. All right. Thank
[19:08] you very much. Appreciate it. So, given
[19:11] that I'm not in India, I'm going to give
[19:14] you my opinion, which is allowed here. I
[19:16] think that if you own a company and
[19:18] people are criticizing that company and
[19:19] you, then they're entitled to that. If
[19:22] you disagree with them, I don't think
[19:24] you should be able to go for an
[19:26] emergency gag order like this. That
[19:27] doesn't mean you sit in silence. I think
[19:29] you should just make your own video.
[19:30] Explain why and that message will find
[19:33] the audience that it needs to. In fact,
[19:34] you know what? That's exactly what Carl
[19:36] Pay does whenever people roast his
[19:38] nothing products. And I rate him for
[19:40] that.
[19:44] Okay, I feel like we've established how
[19:46] the product isn't as Indian as we've
[19:47] been led to believe. How this CEO has
[19:49] gone to an unprecedented extreme when
[19:51] called out for it. But before we take
[19:54] this all to the big man himself, I've
[19:56] been trying to figure out cuz this is
[19:57] very important when you're assessing how
[19:59] guilty someone is. Does this company
[20:02] deserve our benefit of the doubt? Yeah,
[20:05] it's a no from me, Chief. It's just
[20:08] interesting how on YouTube these phones
[20:09] were getting absolutely cooked, but on
[20:11] AI Plus's own website, every single
[20:13] phone seems to have a flawless five-star
[20:15] review. And then you click into those
[20:17] reviews and you realize it's a fivestar
[20:19] review no matter what people are saying.
[20:21] Some people are literally just filling
[20:23] out support forms seemingly with
[20:24] questions like, "Where I buy now? Can
[20:26] you please guide me?" Yeah, that's a
[20:28] glowing five-star review if I've ever
[20:30] seen one. And then you realize, oh wait,
[20:32] it doesn't even matter if they're
[20:33] actually saying it sucks. Like this
[20:35] comment here, it's a five-star. A lot of
[20:37] the reviews on Flipkart are just as
[20:39] organic. The screen quality is great and
[20:42] the camera performs well. The display
[20:44] looks great and the camera is reliable.
[20:47] The display is sharp and the camera is
[20:49] solid. It's almost as if some of these
[20:51] reviews are generated, but no, surely
[20:55] not. Not from the company who has ended
[20:57] their official terms and conditions
[20:59] section with, "Let me know if you'd also
[21:01] like a downloadable version, a version
[21:02] for your Shopify website's policy page,
[21:04] or tailored clauses for international
[21:06] customers or B2B transactions." Oh, you
[21:10] guys starting to get the same picture
[21:11] that I am about this brand? Or how do
[21:13] you remember that borderline racist
[21:15] advert with the loan and the Chinese
[21:17] man? Does it feel just a little bit
[21:19] ironic that with an ad like that, this
[21:21] AI Plus site also reads, "You while
[21:24] providing your personal information over
[21:25] the platform, consent to us and other
[21:28] third parties like credit bureaus to
[21:31] contact you through SMS, instant
[21:33] messaging apps, call and/or email." And
[21:35] worse still, if we smack this same link
[21:37] into the Wayback Machine, it used to
[21:39] specifically spell out personal loans.
[21:43] Whoops. I could keep going. A lot of the
[21:45] marketing material appears not entirely
[21:47] original. They've posted photos claiming
[21:49] to be taken on their phones that every
[21:51] photographer I have sent them to has
[21:53] confidently said is basically not
[21:55] possible. But ultimately, I decided we
[21:57] have enough questions now that we need
[21:59] to take them to the CEO himself. Now, I
[22:02] have actually called Mardov once
[22:03] already, but what he said was so
[22:05] confusing. It felt like he was
[22:07] constantly changing his mind as he was
[22:08] speaking. So, I've taken everything he
[22:10] said. I've distilled it down to the key
[22:12] things that I think really matter in
[22:14] this case. And now it's time to lay it
[22:17] all out in front of him to really
[22:19] properly in one go confront him.
[22:26] Right. Let's do this.
[22:28] >> Yeah. Great. Great setup, huh?
[22:30] >> You're getting the full BTS here.
[22:32] Yesterday, I think the AI Plus website
[22:34] went down. Did that have something to do
[22:36] with our conversation?
[22:37] >> Yeah, I'm removing everything. I'm
[22:39] redoing it. I put up after your
[22:41] feedback, I put up about a special team,
[22:43] hired a website agency on the weekend.
[22:46] >> Well, I noticed when the website was
[22:48] launched again, the reviews section was
[22:51] gone. I was happy to see that. So, the
[22:52] website did suck, but at least he's
[22:54] taken the feedback and started actioning
[22:56] it pretty quickly between our first and
[22:58] second conversation. We were off to a
[23:00] good start. One of the main reasons your
[23:01] brand exists is you're trying to, you
[23:03] know, build things in India from now. A
[23:05] part of it from what I understand is
[23:06] that you've also expressed a lot of
[23:08] concern about Chinese phones. What
[23:10] exactly makes these Chinese phones a
[23:13] risk in your mind?
[23:14] >> Chinese phones are not a risk in my
[23:16] mind.
[23:16] >> Okay,
[23:17] >> let's divide economy and consumers
[23:19] first. They are not risk to the
[23:21] consumers. I'm talking about the economy
[23:23] wherein the revenues and the technology
[23:25] transmit the technology knowh how from
[23:27] last 10 years intentionally or
[23:28] nonintentionally has not been
[23:30] transferred to India.
[23:31] >> Okay. But then this advert it's implying
[23:34] very strongly that Chinese phone not
[23:36] safe AI plus this advert is made for a
[23:39] consumer right?
[23:40] >> Yeah there were 300 Chinese apps which
[23:41] are banned in India and it was a app
[23:44] which was basically for small loans or
[23:47] for a fintech loans and there were a lot
[23:49] of suicide cases around it. So if you're
[23:50] talking about an particular ad I'm just
[23:53] an 8 months old brand. I would have made
[23:55] a lot of mistakes and I admit to the lot
[23:56] of mistakes which I would have made it.
[23:58] So would you say this advert is an
[24:00] example of a mistake?
[24:01] >> I would not say that that's a complete
[24:03] mistake. You stand by the ad.
[24:06] >> Yeah.
[24:06] >> You stand by it. Yeah. Okay. So he says
[24:08] the ad is fine because it's based off a
[24:10] bunch of real Chinese apps that did
[24:12] cause people to lose money. But still
[24:14] for more reasons than one, I don't think
[24:16] this is the kind of messaging that
[24:17] anyone should be doubling down on.
[24:19] Moving past that though, in our first
[24:20] interview, we asked Mavv about the three
[24:22] Chinese apps that the YouTubers found on
[24:24] their phones. Were they real? and he
[24:26] said
[24:26] >> yes there were but that was not on the
[24:29] Indian version that was on the global
[24:31] version for Nepal for Indonesia and for
[24:33] Sri Lanka and every other countries
[24:35] which I'm testing
[24:36] >> so you're saying that no one who buys
[24:38] one of these phones in India will get
[24:40] any of these apps but I need to ask you
[24:44] that because I'm holding one of them
[24:46] bought in India and I have these apps I
[24:48] feel like as soon as I revealed that I
[24:50] too was holding the phone Marv kind of
[24:53] pivoted
[24:54] >> which version are you holding it in That
[24:55] is what I have to check. I'm again
[24:57] saying you yes I'm not saying no. This
[25:00] were probably the initial testing units
[25:02] not at all possible.
[25:04] >> So specifically in a really concise way
[25:06] what are you suggesting has happened
[25:08] here? Why do I still have these apps on
[25:09] my phone?
[25:10] >> See I just have to check the kernel
[25:12] source has been picked or not. I do not
[25:14] have the device with me. I do not know
[25:16] what exactly has happened until unless I
[25:17] see the device.
[25:18] >> What do you think has happened given
[25:20] that I can guarantee you this phone has
[25:21] come out of the box. It's been booted up
[25:23] and it's been connected to Wi-Fi.
[25:25] >> See, I'm again telling you I really need
[25:27] to check the software and version five
[25:30] you are saying is a December 25 software
[25:32] which is from some small account which
[25:33] was never a software which was ever
[25:35] there. That is the reason I have to
[25:36] check what has happened is it been
[25:38] tweaked
[25:39] >> but you're saying that and you've told
[25:41] me this before as well that launch
[25:43] devices don't have these Chinese apps on
[25:45] them. Is that right?
[25:47] >> Yeah. All the current devices which have
[25:50] been launched they do not have any
[25:51] Chinese apps. Pulse 2 as well. Nova 2.
[25:54] >> I'm talking about Ultra which I just
[25:56] recently launched.
[25:57] >> What about the Pulse 2? Does that have
[25:59] Chinese apps?
[26:00] >> No, they don't not have 110%. They
[26:03] should not have it.
[26:03] >> Okay. So, what would you say then if I
[26:05] say I've got mountains of evidence of
[26:08] your own customers on Flipkart who all
[26:11] show images of these apps on their
[26:13] phones including
[26:16] >> reals, content from all over the place,
[26:18] YouTube tutorials.
[26:19] >> That's what I'm trying to tell you,
[26:21] right? I'm not sure that you know again
[26:23] I have not gone through that content
[26:25] what you're saying what I said
[26:27] guarantees about Nova 2 and Nova ultra I
[26:30] definitely guaranteed that right
[26:31] >> I want to show you something right now
[26:33] so I didn't tell him this but as well as
[26:35] the Pulse 2 and the Nova flip phone I
[26:38] also have one of the Nova 2Os that he's
[26:41] so insistent is completely spro free yes
[26:44] I hired someone on Fiverr to buy a lot
[26:46] of phones for me but guess what first
[26:47] time I booted it up it had all three
[26:50] Chinese spro Procom apps installed. Now,
[26:53] there was an update and sure enough,
[26:54] when I installed it, the apps did
[26:56] disappear. But him sitting there acting
[26:58] like I'm absolutely crazy for suggesting
[27:00] that these apps were on at least some of
[27:02] his phones at launch when I've seen them
[27:04] across like 30 different sources at this
[27:06] point is not the problem that I thought
[27:08] I'd be having. Not to mention that even
[27:10] with those apps gone on my Nova SPRO
[27:13] weather clock, I wonder what SPRO stands
[27:16] for.
[27:16] >> Can you just do me one favor? If you can
[27:18] just tell your person to buy a new
[27:20] device in India and open up and check it
[27:23] because I also want to understand
[27:26] >> is that very real? Yes or no? I'm more
[27:29] than willing because I also want to go
[27:30] through it. If I made a mistake, I will
[27:32] admit it.
[27:33] >> But do you understand why that's quite
[27:34] hard for me to get behind given that
[27:36] this was the predominant message in the
[27:38] YouTube videos that have been forced to
[27:40] be taken down, right? Is that these
[27:42] Chinese apps exist? You're definitely
[27:43] aware of this situation. Why is it that
[27:46] now you're telling me, "Oh, if this is a
[27:48] problem, I'll look into it."
[27:49] >> No, I was also telling the same thing to
[27:51] them. It was not that it was only about
[27:53] the Chinese apps. But at the same time,
[27:55] what phone software which you are
[27:57] telling me right now, that version was
[27:59] never existing, which you are telling me
[28:01] right now. It has never been existed.
[28:02] I've checked all the records. It has
[28:04] never been existed.
[28:04] >> What does it mean for software to have
[28:06] never existed before? I will spare you
[28:08] the full conversation here, but
[28:10] basically I spent 15 full minutes trying
[28:12] to see if I can get Marv to admit that
[28:14] just something is wrong here that needs
[28:16] internal investigation. It's blatantly
[28:18] obvious to me, but he just kept
[28:20] insisting that the software on my phone
[28:23] didn't exist. And I still don't
[28:25] understand what that means. Of course it
[28:27] exists. I'm stuck on it. Now whether or
[28:29] not this is the reason for the lack of
[28:30] updates, this absurd inconsistency
[28:33] between what he seems to think is on the
[28:35] phones versus what actually is does line
[28:38] up very well with what something that
[28:39] the industry insider warned us about
[28:41] >> because the biggest issue is also on the
[28:43] quality control. They will be okay with
[28:45] a certain level of defects. When you
[28:46] handle secondhand components, you know,
[28:48] when you kind of realize that one
[28:49] component or one phone has a defect, you
[28:51] cannot trace the initial batch to
[28:53] understand where the problem is from and
[28:54] how you can fix it. I myself have bought
[28:56] one of these phones from Flipkart to
[28:58] test it and I'm not seeing any kind of
[29:00] software update. They're telling us that
[29:02] there should be some sort of March
[29:03] software update. I've only got December.
[29:05] Could this lack of quality control be
[29:07] the reason that some people are not
[29:09] getting the software update which should
[29:11] get rid of these Chinese apps?
[29:13] >> Oh yeah, of course. I mean 100%.
[29:15] >> Oh, also do you know how Marv asked me
[29:16] to buy another device to check? Well, I
[29:20] did. I bought two more on his request. I
[29:22] asked our Fiverr contact to get one from
[29:23] Flipkart and one from Amazon in India.
[29:26] And would you believe it, even those
[29:28] phones, both of them bought in India,
[29:30] set up in India, had all the Chinese
[29:32] apps still there and no update
[29:34] available. So, the last thing I'm going
[29:36] to say about this Chinese app situation
[29:37] is either Marav is incredibly alarmingly
[29:40] unaware of the state of his own devices
[29:43] or he's gaslighting me and I don't know
[29:45] which one is worse. Anyway, in the last
[29:47] call, I also brought up the topic of
[29:49] bloatware. Now, one of the main selling
[29:50] points of this phone, you've talked
[29:52] about it in your podcast quite a bit, is
[29:53] you're trying to kind of erase bloatware
[29:58] free.
[29:58] >> When you go into the game space, you do
[30:01] see a bunch of preloaded games. And I
[30:03] wanted to ask,
[30:05] my friend, I I don't think so is there
[30:07] the final version anymore. It's not
[30:09] there. During the December, we were
[30:11] testing multiple hundreds of softwares
[30:14] and games on a particular device. you
[30:16] will see some bloodware free only as of
[30:18] now right and we like to keep that way
[30:21] itself there's no gaming app there's no
[30:23] nothing
[30:24] >> you said to me and tell me if I'm
[30:26] understanding this right that on launch
[30:28] software all the bloatware is gone
[30:30] >> yeah everything has gone out
[30:31] >> it's worth mentioning to you that I have
[30:33] also found you know all these flip cart
[30:36] customers again they also have game
[30:38] space and this is on the second
[30:40] generation phone
[30:42] >> I'm again telling you which version is
[30:44] it I want want you to pick up a new
[30:46] version. You've been speaking again and
[30:48] again. Repetitive.
[30:50] >> It's repetitive cuz I don't understand.
[30:52] How can he keep denying something that's
[30:54] so obviously there? Gamespace, including
[30:57] all the bloatware games, exist on my
[30:59] Pulse 2 phone. It exists on other
[31:01] people's YouTube videos. It even exists
[31:03] on my Nova 2 phone, which has had the
[31:05] latest update. Anyways, we weren't
[31:07] making progress here, so I decided to
[31:08] move on. In our first call, Mardav also
[31:11] gave a very confusing answer as to what
[31:13] it means for his products to be made in
[31:15] India. If everything is expertly
[31:18] imagined in India,
[31:19] >> this product is not just made in India.
[31:21] It's confidently imagined
[31:23] >> and yet you're saying you're an ODM,
[31:26] then is this not imagined in China
[31:28] originally? The Pulse Swan was imagined
[31:30] in China, just to be clear.
[31:31] >> Yeah.
[31:32] >> Okay.
[31:32] >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And basically, because
[31:34] that's when I learned from it. On the
[31:36] last call, you talked about how the
[31:38] pulse one was imagined in China and that
[31:41] you learned from it. Is that right?
[31:43] >> I did not say then I what did I say then
[31:47] that pulse one is a basic form. You do
[31:49] not need to design on it because there
[31:51] are ready solutions around it for the
[31:52] basic 4G and the basic 5G phones. So for
[31:55] me to imagine over there or imagine over
[31:56] here is one and the same thing.
[31:58] >> I guess I just want you to understand
[31:59] that the reason there is so much
[32:01] scrutiny in this case is just because of
[32:03] how much you leaned into it in that
[32:04] launch event. I think going forward from
[32:07] the next launch event I think I'll be
[32:08] more specific
[32:10] >> on what exactly which components are
[32:13] buying from which country which no brand
[32:15] has done it. I want you to buy my flip
[32:17] phone also from India and see
[32:20] specifically from day one I have given
[32:22] credits to ZT on the boxes.
[32:25] >> All right let's talk about ZTE shall we?
[32:28] So, I had asked Mardiff about how the
[32:30] flip phone resembles a ZT on our last
[32:32] call and he confirmed
[32:34] >> it is from ZTE only.
[32:36] >> This is still pitched as an AI plus
[32:38] branded phone. You've got your own name
[32:39] for it. You've got your own branding for
[32:41] it. If I was an AI plus fan because of,
[32:43] you know, what I've learned about the
[32:44] company, I would think, oh great, you
[32:46] know, a phone that's keeping my data in
[32:47] India.
[32:48] >> I never deceived AI plus users by saying
[32:50] that this is something which I've
[32:52] designed in India. This I very
[32:53] categorically say that this is the phone
[32:55] which also has a ZTE label on the phone
[32:57] box.
[32:58] >> He thinks it's enough that the thing has
[32:59] ZTE on the box. I disagree since this
[33:03] tiny footnote is the only reference to
[33:05] ZTE on the box. And having sat through
[33:07] the entire launch event, I can confirm
[33:09] that the name ZTE was not mentioned once
[33:12] during it. But now is where I think I
[33:14] started to really push his buttons.
[33:16] Okay, so near the end now, but I just
[33:17] wanted to ask you this AI power company
[33:19] that we talked about last time. When did
[33:21] you start working with them?
[33:22] >> So I would say it would be 2022 end or
[33:25] 2023 early where I started interacting
[33:27] with them for buying a brand name. Air
[33:29] power is a good name to have it.
[33:31] >> What I want to clarify then is with
[33:33] bbuds for example, did they make the
[33:35] product? Did you make the product or was
[33:37] it co-developed?
[33:38] >> It was co-developed together. Would you
[33:40] still count that as like designed in
[33:42] India if you're saying you've
[33:43] co-developed it with a company where
[33:45] >> already I filed a patent for it alone?
[33:48] >> That's okay. You can have the patent. I
[33:50] believe that but it's just you know the
[33:51] co-founders of this company are Chinese.
[33:53] The HQ is in
[33:54] >> I'm again telling you I have the patent
[33:56] not only in India but I have a patent in
[33:59] about 60 countries for that. So I have
[34:01] the patent with me for the technology
[34:03] and I invested in the technology. Hence
[34:05] I know that you know basically I was
[34:07] able to buy that patent for it. Now, the
[34:09] reason I'm pushing so hard is what he's
[34:11] saying doesn't make any sense to me.
[34:13] He's told us that he started working
[34:15] with this company in 2022, 2023, right?
[34:18] There are hundreds of pieces of content
[34:20] showing that were buds as a brand and
[34:23] series of products existed years before
[34:25] that. So, is it possible that Marv had
[34:28] some input into the design of this
[34:30] latest generation of Wearbuds? Perhaps.
[34:32] But do I think it's fair for him to then
[34:34] claim that his product was designed in
[34:36] India?
[34:37] >> No.
[34:38] No, I don't. The way I see it, this is a
[34:40] bit like if I went into Apple. They've
[34:42] already been making iPhones for 20
[34:44] years, but just because I potentially
[34:46] suggested some things for the iPhone 18,
[34:49] I call the iPhone 18 designed by Aaron.
[34:52] But now it was time to bring up the
[34:53] elephant in the room. When I asked him
[34:54] before why did he feel like it was right
[34:56] to order those YouTube videos down, he
[34:59] said,
[34:59] >> "They put up a video, so we reached out
[35:01] to them
[35:02] >> that can we resolve your queries? We
[35:04] reached out to them, but they did not
[35:06] respond to it. If you are not able to
[35:08] hear my point, let me at least get an
[35:10] injunction. We just said that please put
[35:12] our viewpoint also. You can put your
[35:15] videos back up along with a follow-up
[35:17] video that this is what the brand is
[35:19] also saying and we open for it.
[35:21] >> And as well as this idea of needing to
[35:24] hear the brand out first. He also kept
[35:26] referring to how the YouTuber's videos
[35:27] contained unverified claims. It was
[35:30] based on unverified claims having no
[35:33] third party validation or any audit
[35:36] validation. See we have just launched a
[35:38] phone
[35:39] >> and I would invest in maybe more than 20
[35:42] to $30 million to just to bring that
[35:44] particular phone and if after investing
[35:46] an huge amount of money to bring two
[35:49] devices back without putting even my
[35:51] side of the story I would have been
[35:53] completely geoparadized my entire sales
[35:57] and the launch.
[35:58] >> Okay. So, I can understand the feeling
[36:00] of investing tons of money into your
[36:02] next big venture. I can understand the
[36:04] pain of people criticizing it and then
[36:06] the panic that you might feel if they
[36:07] don't respond to you when you reach out.
[36:09] But what I don't understand is this idea
[36:11] that if they're not responding, let me
[36:14] at least get an injunction. As if that's
[36:16] just a normal thing to do when people
[36:18] don't say what you want. Because you got
[36:19] to remember, there's a power dynamic
[36:21] here. This company is worth tens of
[36:23] millions of dollars. They can sue
[36:24] YouTubers if they want and create this
[36:27] dystopian situation where only their
[36:29] side of the story is the allowed truth.
[36:31] I've seen firsthand the emotional
[36:33] turmoil that this has caused people. And
[36:35] so, what creator, especially the smaller
[36:37] ones, are going to risk everything to
[36:39] challenge a company like this if core
[36:41] orders become the precedent? That's just
[36:43] not on the freedom for reviews to be
[36:45] authentic without fear is crucial.
[36:48] Thankfully, and I have no idea if this
[36:50] is in response to how hard I pushed back
[36:52] or something completely unrelated,
[36:54] between our first call and our second,
[36:55] MV seemed to have had a change of heart.
[36:58] >> I was thinking over this weekend, I
[37:00] don't think so that probably I should
[37:01] have been so harsh in putting up a case.
[37:03] It's a community which I think I should
[37:05] respect even more. I did something in
[37:07] Jiffy. I think I should uh have not done
[37:09] it and probably I think I'm even willing
[37:12] to, you know, just take it back. Do you
[37:14] feel like it is is reasonable to expect
[37:16] any YouTuber, any journalist to have a
[37:19] third-party audit and to like approach
[37:22] you first before pointing out issues on
[37:24] your devices?
[37:25] >> I would not uh say that, you know, they
[37:28] should approach me first.
[37:29] >> Okay.
[37:29] >> But if I'm trying to approach them, at
[37:31] least be responsive to it. I'm willing
[37:34] to see and improve and learn from it.
[37:36] >> Okay.
[37:36] >> But being nonresponsive made me more, I
[37:39] would say, in a jify situation. But my
[37:41] actually the fight was not with any of
[37:45] the YouTubers. The fight was with an
[37:48] agency who was in between trying to then
[37:50] manipulate towards creating more
[37:52] misunderstandings between brand and
[37:54] YouTubers.
[37:55] >> So for the record, you don't agree that
[37:57] companies should take down or behave in
[38:00] the way that you did.
[38:01] >> Yeah, I agree. I I completely on records
[38:03] I agree that I think I did something in
[38:06] haste which I think probably I should
[38:07] not have done it against the creators.
[38:10] I'm again saying my fight is against the
[38:12] agencies.
[38:12] >> What he means by agencies, by the way,
[38:14] is the agencies that manage YouTubers,
[38:16] the ones that companies like AI Plus
[38:18] would contact presumably to arrange
[38:20] brand deals with creators. So, I'm
[38:22] really glad that he said that he's made
[38:24] a mistake and he's likely going to try
[38:25] and reverse it, but has he convinced me
[38:28] that he genuinely sees the error in his
[38:30] ways?
[38:32] No, he has not. This feels a lot more
[38:35] like he's seen the error of what it
[38:38] means to get on the wrong side of every
[38:40] YouTuber ever, which is, I'm guessing,
[38:42] why he's now deflecting to blaming the
[38:44] agencies. And this point, he's made
[38:46] crystal clear with a follow-up third
[38:48] phone call and message to clarify. But
[38:51] what's just come to light makes this
[38:53] feel, to me, at least like far too
[38:55] little too late. Because Techweiser just
[38:57] had their first hearing in court. This
[38:59] is the first time they got to present
[39:01] their side of the story and they claimed
[39:02] that the only reason Marv was able to
[39:04] get this ex party order is by using
[39:07] tricks. So remember I said that one of
[39:09] the defendants named was John Doe. Well,
[39:11] turns out that Marv named John Doe as
[39:13] the main defendant. What that means is
[39:16] while you usually have to serve notice
[39:17] to a defendant so they have a chance to
[39:19] defend themselves by making the main
[39:21] defendant not a real person, the court
[39:24] accepted that you can't warn them in
[39:26] advance. So you put John Doe there only
[39:28] so as to to obiate the need and to to
[39:31] ensure that nobody appears on day one to
[39:33] defend what they've done. And then on
[39:34] top of that to cover themselves even
[39:36] when they did contact Techiser with the
[39:38] legal order they sent it to an email
[39:40] address that Techweiser says doesn't
[39:43] exist. Even though AI Plus has
[39:45] Techiser's real email and has used it
[39:47] multiple times before to contact them.
[39:49] By sending the court order to this
[39:51] supposedly fake email where they knew
[39:53] Techweiser wouldn't see it, it meant
[39:55] that the YouTuber wouldn't know about
[39:56] the court case until it was too late.
[39:58] >> He knows who I am. He knows all details.
[40:00] He knows my reputation and my
[40:02] credibility, but strangely can't find my
[40:04] email ID to which he just corresponded 2
[40:06] days before he filed the suit.
[40:07] >> And in doing all this, AI Plus in a way
[40:10] have created their ideal outcome.
[40:12] They've already successfully suppressed
[40:14] the negative coverage for weeks. So it
[40:16] almost doesn't matter if they lose the
[40:18] case when it ends in August or later and
[40:20] the videos come back online
[40:21] >> because by then the content would have
[40:23] been off in this critical juncture
[40:25] coinciding with the launch of their
[40:26] product.
[40:27] >> So now with that context MV now telling
[40:29] me that he wants to rescend his core
[40:31] order doesn't really mean anything and
[40:34] so upon hearing this and seeing the
[40:35] evidence the judge has decided that Mav
[40:38] has to be summoned into court to answer
[40:40] for himself.
[40:41] >> Who is the plaintiff in this?
[40:42] >> Hello Mr. Madav set I believe has signed
[40:45] for the plaintiff.
[40:46] >> Please have him here after tomorrow. We
[40:48] need some answers permit but this kind
[40:49] of a thing we are not going to permit
[40:51] let nobody be under this impression that
[40:53] they can put full wool over our eyes. We
[40:55] want to dispel this notion.
[40:56] >> Despite Mav's noble words to me, he
[40:58] failed to show up in court meaning that
[41:00] the next hearing has been pushed to the
[41:02] first week of August. The YouTuber's
[41:04] videos are still down while new
[41:05] marketing campaigns to promote AI plus
[41:07] products are still coming out. The final
[41:09] decision awaits, but I know where I sit.
[41:12] And by the way, I think there's a decent
[41:14] chance that AI Plus or someone tries to
[41:16] geollock this video to block it in
[41:18] India. If that happens, use a VPN like
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