Okay, >> I think we're live. >> We're live. All right, >> Gary, good to see you. This is our Damn it. It's our eighth year in a row we're doing this. >> You know, time flies when you're having fun Jim. >> We haven't changed a bit. >> No, look exactly the same. >> So, listen. I'm I I did not get there. I'm in Cincinnati. It's kind of sort of cold and snowy here. You were out there all weekend. Santa Clara, San Francisco, >> uh and you've been at a bunch of Super Bowls. So, let's start with what was what about this one was different. >> Um, well, I was bitter because I'm a big Jets fan and you know, seeing the Patriots back in the Super Bowl, I don't you know, that that was a little different like just the Well, it was actually not different, but it was it was uh more of the same in the past. Yeah. You know, I would say that um being on the ground, especially Wednesday Thursday Friday Saturday you know, uh San Francisco, I think, was a good host city. >> You know, a lot of activity, a lot of experiential. I you know, I think here's something different, Jim. For sure. Brands are getting smarter and smarter in my opinion of understanding how to get more value out of experiential, >> you know, more thoughtful about bringing influencers there, >> getting them to create content. They themselves are creating content. Um, more uh um thoughtful programming at the experiential events. Uh something we've been hot at at Vayner for a long time of like these events are good as production days for creative and social. And you know this because you grew up in the game. Um there were people always kind of inherently knew experiential mattered but it was expensive. I I would say it used to be a little bit even more B2B. It's now B2B TOC in some ways. So I I would say experiential um thoughtfulness. I was here 10 years ago and I I would say that brands spent five to 10 times more and got five to 10 times less out of their experiential just 10 years ago. That would be the biggest observation pregame, you know, Wednesday through Sunday. >> Of all the activations and experiential things you saw, what stuck out? What stood out? Which brands do you think were really nailing it? >> I think Raising Canes and Fanatics have really figured it out. They've made really cool parties that are content production days. I think those two brands definitely stand out. I can tell you that for the ABC list, you know, uh individuals in town, that was the the big stuff, but it broadened into the amount of content that then hits Gen Pop. >> Yep. >> So, that that really stood out to me. >> So, you had a lot of activities. What was your favorite moment of the weekend? Uh when the Seahawks destroyed the Patriots in the game. [laughter] >> Well, that was kind of obvious early. >> Uh what was my favorite? >> That's a weird game. >> What? They had four first downs going into the third quarter. I mean, it's just >> I was thr I was thrilled. It wasn't weird to me. I thought the Patriots were incredibly They play, you know, you get to Super Bowl, you have to do a lot of things right, but I think uh the ball definitely bounced their way this year. And I I thought what, you know, my prediction all week was 44 nothing Seattle. Yeah, I thought it would be a blowout actually. >> Um, uh, I would say that the individual meetings, you know, you know, just having, you know, one of my favorite things about Super Bowl, and this is a very B2B answer for everyone who's watching. >> I I like Super Bowl, I like possible, I like can, >> I like CES because of the efficiency. You know, everybody can play it the way they want to play their Super Bowl weekend. For me, the one-on-one meetings, the one-on-one meetings, definitely the highlight for me was Wednesday night when we had 15 Vayner X employees together in a private room and just doing family business, you know, and many of them have been at the company for more than 10 years. So, you know, you're doing some team building, right? And then Thursday, there's just a lot of one-on-one meetings with clients and then some group stuff. And then, you know, there's a Vayner X brunch the next day. and we went up and uh Nick Tran did a great job with SRA up in Napa Valley. Pickle ball was a very big theme >> this weekend. You know, that was, you know, as a pickle ball owner in the league, I was very happy to see how often that was being activated and used. And so, um, >> yeah, I think I think for a lot of you that are listening, it, you know, a lot of you that are real operators, you poo poo these events. You think it's people coming to get drunk or not do anything and things of that nature, which is very true for, you know, at these conferences in many different ways, but the real ones really make it incredibly efficient and effective. And so that's what stood out for me. Jim, >> we'll bring in our guests in a minute, but you did a Super Bowl ad again this over the years. Yours got a lot of positive reviews and I think it scored pretty high in the ad meter. I think that's just breaking. So tell us about the spot you did and why you're proud of it if you are. I assume you are. >> I am proud of it, but my team knows and you know I'm funny, Jim. Like I always Here's why I'm very proud this year. I am petrified to >> By the way, it was Will Shhat, right? Raising brand. >> Yes, Raisin Brand. Everyone, I I'm scared to use celebrities. >> I think a lot of people wake up this morning and they're like, "Oh, did you see the Scarlett Johansson ad or did you see the, you know, you know, it just I I get scared about that. the the Grank ad, you know, we're gonna talk to some of the people that used and it'll be interesting to see their insights on it. There's a way to use it and there's a way not. I thought there was somebody who sent a tweet out >> that said a lot of brands are going to be upset this Monday morning on their brand recall, you know, cuz they play second. They pay a lot of money to individuals to play second or third fiddle. Um, but I'm very proud of the team. They felt a lot of pressure from me if I'm just going to be very vulnerable and transparent. I think the team knew that when I heard the idea that I wasn't completely thrilled, which is fun to say because the ad is, you're right, it's universally, you know, it's doing very well by our industry standards. Um, but what I was pumped about was two things. One, the brand really was really well represented throughout the ad and did not play third fiddle. >> Two, I think we masterfully played what we believe in, which is surround sound. Super Bowl surround sound. I mean, we kind of won going into the Super Bowl. It was definitely one of the no question, forget about subjective opinions, you know, uh, objective data. It was just incredibly talked about for the 10 days leading up, including the fact that we seated photos to the press anonymously of William eating cereal while he was driving, which was from the shoot, but was interpreted by the general population as a real photo of him eating cereal while he was driving, which created a lot of buzz. And then that allowed, you know, one of the bar advantages is we have a mouthpiece in me. I was everywhere press-wise talking about the spot. These are all just continued reinforcements. Plus, we had a very simple value prop around fiber, you know, the poop fiber, like it was just very easy for America to digest. I myself can speak to this. I um I sometimes, you know, over complicate things. Obviously, I think my career's worked because I'm good at making complicated things simple, wine, marketing. So, >> I I appreciated the simplicity. I appreciated that Raisin Brand was in it, not like an afterthought. And I really appreciated all the social creative and all the PR strategies we put in place to do Super Bowl surround sound. I'm I'm really proud of the team. I'm I'm happy to publicly say, you know, I think a lot of times an owner will come and take credit, you know, for everything. I where I started to where we ended up. Kudos to the team on executing on you know our two biggest thesis which is don't let the star overshadow the brand and if you do not use social media surround sound for Super Bowl you're you're not realizing it's 2026 anymore. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's good. All right Gary that's a good segue for our guests and we have five of them today and I think they're going to join us out of the green room. Here they come. Hi Gail. So young. Medie, Stephen, Luis, you're all smiling. Rest it. Ready to go. So listen, thanks for joining us. We have two first timers for the Super Bowl and three returning veterans. So, but what I'd like to do, Gary, and I would like to do is have have you go around the room here and that's a basic stuff. name, brand that you advertised in the Super Bowl, so our audience can visualize all this if they're not watching. And what stood out for you this weekend? Something that you did that might have been at your home on the screen, an experiential. So, one thing that popped out from the weekend for you. So, let's start with our two veterans, Steve. Why don't you start? Stephen and Ritz. >> Yes. And Jim, Gary, great to see you again. Uh, so Stephen, I oversee our savory brands, our crackers portfolio at Mondly, and we had Ritz in the Super Bowl. Um, so for me, what was special, I had my full team here in San Francisco, full uh Ritz, all the Ritz people who worked on the ad. >> That was very cool. Honestly, I I think all of us around this virtual table, we all know it's a it's a long intense process. >> Then to be able to experience the culmination of that journey with the people who actually made it happen. Uh that was super rewarding. And for me, you know, a little bit what you were saying, Gary, like between all the events of the big weekend, like for me, it's the family moments that stand out when you like finally just get five minutes to sit down, have a drink, and just let off some steam with the crew. >> And I will tell you, brother, just to jump in on that, like this is real business. You know, I know a lot of you really well and some of you not as much. But like I think one of the things that I continue to pound at the CEO and CFO level about stuff like this is like that stuff matters too. I'm like look how much money you're spending on HR and training and recruiting and retention. To your point, you sitting down with a team member for five minutes and talking about their family might be the reason that person wants to stay at Mandles for another three more years, which has incredible economic impact. And so I think, you know, I the world has become incredibly data oriented. I'm sure we'll touch on AI at some point, but it's incredible how much the value of old school 1950s humanity, right? And and I do find that at events like this, it comes up and I'm I appreciate you bringing that up from your lens as well because I think you're very right and it really matters >> 100%. >> So Stephen, one question before we move on. On a scale of one to 10, 10, 10 being you really nailed it. How did this year meet your goals? >> H uh probably around >> one number eight. Okay, we'll come back and talk about that in a moment. >> Sounds good. >> Okay. So Young, good to see you again. Hi. >> Introduce yourself. Yeah. The brand that you advertised and and something special this weekend. >> So, uh my name is So Young Kang. I'm president at EOS. Um and uh something special this weekend. Um you know, it was just really great to like Stephen experience this as a point of pride both with the team but with also with my family. Um and I think it's absolutely right that uh these things really do matter for our teams. And so, um, investing in something like a big campaign moment, big tentpole moment for your brand, it it's really incredible how motivating that is to the broader organization, um, just as much as many of the other intangible things that we invest in as business people all the time. So, really, really proud of the work that the team put into it. >> On a scale of 1 to 10, 10, really, you nailed your goals. What would you say? >> You know, I'm gonna give myself an eight, too. Um, and only because you always have to leave a little room to reach for next year. Yeah. Okay. Sounds like a returner again next year. >> Okay. Gail, we'll bring you into this. >> Hi. >> Hey guys. >> Gail at Novar. So, tell tell us about your weekend. I mean, you're the second year coming back. I think last year was amazing. This year, in my opinion, you really crushed it. But >> tell me tell us what stood out for the weekend for you. For me, what stood out was the Super Bowl fan experience and and building a little bit about what you and Gary were saying at the beginning, the experiential aspect and how the general public was experiencing the Super Bowl is really exciting to me. Families, thousands of people going through the Super Bowl experience. We had a uh on-site activation and experiential activation. And we believe very strongly in building platforms that can be um stretchy and and go into experiences. So, we had something called the relax zone, but I just loved experiencing, you know, I thought Uber Eats did a brilliant job. They had David Stark, an event designer who you would normally see, you know, doing things like the Met Gala or something like that, but um did the Uber Eats activation. So, the care and the craft of these experiential activations that like not that long ago were sort of like card tables with people handing out premiums. So, people really going deep into it. We did. and you're really engaging the the general public. So, that was that was for me a highlight seeing all of these experiential activations as Gary and you were talking about. >> Super. How did Were there any tight ends in your relax zone? >> Um, they we we did have some folks come by, but um yeah, it was it was a really fun campaign. >> So, scale of one to 10 for you, Gail? >> You know, for for us it was a 10. I mean, because we wanted to show up as an integrated platform um and really capture both kind of um the attention of the general public and get people to make behavior change. So, we did a lot of also other on-site activations. We did something with the 49ers um with Claire KD, George KD's wife, did a coffee and and so we really surrounded the campaign um the Super Bowl activation. So, I'm going to give I'm going to give her a team of 10. I I if I may, um Gail, I just I thought it was so well done. Like I I this is exactly what Super Bowl's for. I personally as a human now understand and know that there's a shot. I think that's bananas. I I think it is I actually think it's one of the things brands miss too much of like actionoriented. This goes back to the Coinbase bouncing QR code. I continue every CPG that's listening free advice don't need to work with us though none of my clients take me up on it so I'm not sure if this is going to land but I think trial and sampling should be happening at Super Bowl at scale through the spot itself to a destination everyone cries about the cost of fulfillment yet we waste money on everything in our industry so but I I you know I've known you a very long time and I have a lot of love for you this is very fun to give you flowers. I think it I think it was the best. >> Thank you. A lot coming from you. >> It's really fun though. And listen, by the way, some of us are selling cereal or crackers. It also is they were in the And this is something for all businesses to think about. Board members pay attention closely here. CFOs pay attention. They had the best ingredients to do something. They're aware that none of us knew this. This is something they have. awareness is exactly what Super Bowl's for a lot of times. And um so they also were in a position, you know, just on the I'm I'm sure they have better data than I have, but I'm good at this game. Almost no one knows that now shot and we can loosen up our rear ends. And now everyone knows shot that's as good as it gets. that I would say B2B companies, B2G companies, B to A company like B TOC, excuse me, company like this this misunderstanding or not aware of is the first people that should be doing Super Bowl, especially if there's something you used to know and now there's something you need to know. Wow, that's just like incredible. >> And it had a great opening. I mean, how can you not watch? You know, the first three seconds were incredible. And as an XP ander, I was happy to see Side by sides return, right? We had Coke, Pepsi, we had Enthropic against everyone else. >> Anyway, hey Lis, we'll bring we'll bring we'll bring you into this, Luis. You're a first-time, a rookie. So, introduce yourself and what was special this weekend. >> Yeah, Luis Garcia, CMO at Nera International, overseeing brands. Uh, one of the brands is Tree Hut. So, uh, very excited. First of all, good to see you, Jim, Gary. This panel is just fantastic. My favorite mon moment actually wasn't on Sunday which is interesting. Uh it started with it started on Monday. Well, it's like really looking our community and our employees react. We posted on social media. Uh we didn't have celebrities. We had creators and for them they are celebrities right in their own ways. And they started to really feel that pride that I'm in a Super I'm going to be in a Super Bowl ad. Then that was continued on Friday with our employees and I think Stephen as you were mentioning just that moment with your people. I had a we had a company on Friday. We all were in our treehouse shirt super bowls and uh and and the energy in the room of 120 people wearing the same shirts like the smiles. It was just moving. So seeing that pride, that excitement, the messages uh then that started and then on Sunday all the messaging that started like Slack, everything everybody like tears jumping video. So moments like this is what really reinforce that your people and your community are your most important assets and I think when they feel that proud that the brand is building, it just creates a a momentum that you can't really manufacture any other way. >> I love that. Medie, let's bring you in. Introduce yourself. You had a lot of firsts this weekend, and we'll talk about that later when we come back to you, but introduce yourself uh the brand and what was special uh for you. And maybe it was around Times Square. I don't know. You have you'll have to tell me. >> Yeah. No, definitely guys, pleasure to be here. Um thank you for having me. It's an honor to be here uh to to speaking with you all. But uh first, Ahmed Ball, friends call me Medi. Um here from the Cadillac Formula 1 team. Um and uh it's it was a very special weekend. And I think the first thing for us, and you guys talked a little bit about it before, is making sure that there's a strong plan going into the weekend and coming out of the weekend, for us it was more about making a statement of how Formula 1 does delivery reveals. And our hope was to innovate and change the way liver reveals are done forever. Um, and so what we did is we ran the Super Bowl spot and and we ran a 30 secondond spot. While we produced a 60, the 30 was really just focused on the livery itself. And in Formula 1 world, this is really where the season kicks off where you get to see the first expression of identity of a team and it's taken very seriously. There's a lot of um there's a lot of pageantry to it. And I think we took it to the next level and we married it to not just the spot, but doing a physical activation. And we did that a little differently as well. Instead of doing an invite only event in a warehouse somewhere, um we actually focused on putting it in the most accessible place possible in a city that doesn't have a race, but a city that's a global crossroad, right? It's a global sport that we're trying to ramp up awareness and excitement in America. So, Times Square, home of all countdowns. We brought a countdown to delivery reveal there. So, we matched our Super Bowl commercial to a physical reveal in Times Square. >> You're so good. We'll talk about that more later, but beautiful, beautiful car, by the way. Incredible. >> Thank you. Thank you. Now, we're excited about it. >> So, listen. Now, what we're going to do is we actually went out on LinkedIn and asked our community for questions, and we got a fantastic response. We're going to integrate some of those questions into our into our conversation as Gary and I have done for eight years in a row. We're going to sort of go to each person for a few minutes to talk about what you did. Welcome all of you to come into that conversation and then toward the end if you have a burning question for each other. We'd love to open it up to that. So Luis, you you might want to ask Soy Young something, you know. So So we'll come to that. And Gary, you feel free to jump in anytime you want as you always do. >> Say, >> and it's always good. It's always good. So, interruptions are welcome. And we're going to start with the the veterans and then go to the rookies. So, and Stephen, I think we're going to come back to you. So, you returned to the Super Bowl this year uh and to a round table. You were in a round table this time last year. And since we've been together, you've been promoted to president. So, congratulations. >> Thank you so much. >> That must have worked last year. >> See what the Super Bowl can do for you >> and the round table. >> Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. >> So, listen. I listened to our show last year at this time and this was your first time advertising for Ritz and you said you had three goals. >> You wanted the consumers to reappraise the brand. You wanted to make Ritz a more modern exciting brand and you wanted to introduce the salty club as a campaign platform. So let's start there. Any different goals this year? Any evolution of those goals or the same goals? >> Uh so first Jim I would say excellent recap of the goals. Um, this year the overarching goal did not change. We're on this journey to modernize the brand. Uh, and that's a commitment over the long term. So, for sure, we're also really sticking to Salty as a platform. It's working really well for the brand, but it's something that consumers love about the product. This, you know, salty, buttery flavor. It gives us a bit of an edge, which we were really lacking as a brand. It also matched an aspiration because we want to put this brand on the map, not just as number one cracker, but as a major salty player. So that works really well. I think what changed for us is we wanted to dial up the energy of the creative, expand that salty world and be a little bit louder, if you will, to really break through in all the noise of the Super Bowl. Uh, and I think the other thing in terms of surround, we had more runway in in store. That's a really big focus for us. Obviously, it's the full 360, but in store is really where the magic happens. Uh, so we had a really big focus there. And this was all based on the learnings from last year. So last year was successful. You know, we reached our our brand goals, household penetration, etc., but also our business goals, which is really the first thing we look at specific specifically market share. Um, but then we also saw that we have more runway and we can lean in a little bit more. And this is working for us, but you know, don't play it safe and just go all in. >> Stephen, you know, I I brought up earlier my concern of one celebrity. You guys, you guys I have a funny feeling they were not a couple of dollars each. >> You know, and there was many of them. >> Yeah. >> You know, thought your personal thoughts. I mean, easier for me. I know there's no board. I don't have bosses. So, easier for me to be 100% transparent, but I'm just genuinely curious. Is that a concern at times both from a cost standpoint and again, how do you not make it the Scarlett Johansson ad? Right. Yes. >> How do you make it about salt? It it's an excellent question, Gary, and it's definitely something we take very seriously. The reason why we went that direction is for us, we go back to the objective, right? They really do bring cultural relevance. They also just fantastic comedians and actors that just nail the comedic timing and that specific salty humor that we're aiming for. >> Like, so that's massive. But >> so the humor, the humor was the framework that you were the lens you were all thinking through. Exactly. And then this Yes. So we had three, but then the fact that they have the chemistry between them, you know, amplifies the delivery of the humor as well. But then you mentioned brand recall. And so that's really how we're thinking of offsetting the risk of this being the Scarlett Johansson ad for sure. So we we are very intentional about starting with the product and the brand. That's I go back to Saltiness's platform. That why it's worked so well. And the payoff also has to really resonate um in terms of what the brand stands for which is to bring people together whether they're salty or not, right? And then we are very deliberate about having all the right branding cues all throughout the spot. So, you know, making sure that people actually attribute what we do to RITs and so far from what we're seeing, you know, so so far so good. That's really important to us. >> So, you said you'd give yourself an eight out of 10 when we opened it up. How what would you do to get it to a 10 out of 10? >> I think it's year over year. I almost think it was like you have the creative at the core and then you have the surround, right? We're trying to amp up the creative and dialogue that energy, etc. We have a little ways to go there also. But specifically in terms of the surround, there's more for us to do. Gary, you mentioned experiential. I think that's that's still wide space for us to be perfectly honest. >> And and for you, right, I'm sorry to interrupt. Sure. if you decide to do LA just for everyone. I mean, to me, it's like, if you're going to do the soup bowl like that, like, I don't know, give away a drillion Ritz crackers. Like, literally let no human in Los Angeles not consume it during that three, four day window because I I really do, you know, as a marketer, I say this, and this might be a little wild, but I think a lot more money should be put into trial and sampling and not at the not at the grocery or retail level because they're going to tax you to death. More just like experiential. I think Super Bowl is one of those places like if I go to LA next year and just like Ritz crackers are being handed out by 40,000 people they hired for the weekend, I'm gonna be very happy because I think it's right. I think it's it's a way to reinforce and trial is incredibly underrated by us consumer package good people. Like just like once you know there's a lot of people haven't had a Ritz in seven years and they're like wait a minute this is salty >> 100%. And you know next year is Super Bowl 61 so maybe we do 61 million crackers or something. We sell 32 billion crackers each year. So, >> for the record, I have lots of Rits at my house, Stephen. I have lots of Rits because I have granddaughters now and it's a perfect cracker for a baby. >> Yeah, >> you know, it's delicious, buttery, it crumbles. So, anyway, we got lots of them around here. And by the way, Melissa Nemire at Deoid had thrown in a question for you and it was about how did you build off last year's learning to reach your success? And I think you've I think you've talked that you've nailed that. So, I want to bring in So Young to this. You're also a podcast alum. You got promoted to president last year as Stephen did. And by the way, here's trivia. >> You You two got promoted the same month. >> There you go. We need a We need a club celebration Stephen. >> You need to do something about that. [laughter] Yeah, >> it sounds like more people need to get on your podcast. It sounds if they're podcast guests, they get promoted. >> That's right. >> It's It's definitely an accelerator. Thank you, Gary. So listen, you also came back two consecutive years like Ritz. Um and I want to channel you know Melissa's uh question from Deote. Last year you went out. What did you learn? How did you apply that? And I think what's interesting for you is you have a very different creative execution this year whereas Stevens I think was in the same platform. So let's start with that. Let's look back. What did you learn last year and how did you apply it this to this year? Sorry. >> Yeah. I mean, I think I think what we learned last year was um first of all that um the Super Bowl is a very unique period in time when you have this sort of collective attention of so many people that if you have the right creative and you have the right strategy and you can make that moment incredibly impactful, it it it is an it's an unbelievable ROI that you can get. And we do know that through all of like the measurement that we did um and we saw actual instore sales lift um in our product for weeks after airing that spot last year. And so we were looking to kind of recreate that magic, but we really felt like, you know, sort of similar to the comments that Stephen made that we could create more surround sound opportunities around that singular moment so that you can make that investment last a bit longer. Um, so this year we um, you know, we did this partnership with with Mikey Day and with the is a cake franchise. The whole the whole insight within it was that EOS products make you smell like a cupcake. And so we took that a bit further and said, well, what if people couldn't actually tell the difference between you and a cupcake? Um, and placed that within the context of the is it Cake franchise. Um, and so even leading up to the Super Bowl, we we had um the surround sound elements like we had EOS cakes that actually look like products that we were selling through a partnership nationally um and created that like buzz and that excitement around EOS. Like you really can't tell the difference between EOS and cake. So that drove a lot of social engagement. Um, so we saw this lift in social engagement across all of our platforms and gave us the best possible launching pad for entering into the into the big game. Um, I think that the uh, while the creative may have shifted, I think that insight is something that we're always looking for in any of the work that we do where we look for something that we learn directly from our fan base and then we know it's true. If it's not coming from us, if it's something that we're hearing from the outside in and then we can create a strategy around that and anchor our creative around that, we feel really good that it's anchoring in a human truth in this cake in in this case that EOS makes you smell like a cake. Gary, do you want to smell like a cake? >> I I do smell like a cake, Jim. I smell like a cake 247. So, I've been on this kick for a while. You know, I tend to be on trend early. So, which I smell like different cakes at different times, Jim. But yes, I I not only do I want to, I've been on this kick for about seven to eight years. >> You're a trend better, Gary. >> Thank you. >> Of course he is. So uh so before we leave you uh Stephen talk about the retail activation and how that works so well for them and could you talk a bit more you referenced that a bit more about how you've activated this outside you know the confines of the weekend. >> Well it we're a slightly different category because I I actually believe um and I agree really strongly Gary with you that sampling and trial is incredibly important. Um, and for us though, our product actually is to some extent sampleable in store in a way that, for example, you can't open up a package of Ritz crackers, but we often see that consumer behavior in store for our product is they open up the bottle, they take a sniff, and if they like it, they'll purchase it. And so, um, for us, that drive to store and that stickiness to actually get into stores and try the product is incredibly important. And the the one thing that we need to be able to deliver as a as a marketing team is that confidence among our retail and retail partners so that they know that we are going to have that kind of pull to be able to push uh consumers to to get into the stores to try the product. So for us it's really about getting that footfall across um into into our customers. >> So Gail, we're going to move up to you. You've been at Novartis four and a half years as CMO and chief experience officer. Last year you leaned into breast cancer screening with a spunky, direct, excellent execution. I think you did it again this year on prostate cancer prevention, the blood test, just excellent work. So you thread a tough needle two years in a row with tough topics in in the creative showcase of the year, right, the Super Bowl. So could you talk a bit about what kind of culture process you have at Novartis that yields this kind of amazing creative work that I that I suspect you'll tell us has quite an impact? >> It it does have an impact and and thanks and and you know behavior change at scale there's nothing harder and particularly with health health behaviors um really really tough but um what we've done is we've built a really strong foundation at Novartis. I had the good fortune to join and was given the remit to um build a a strong central marketing function. We had been a decentralized marketing function. So strong marketers but no central core approach and I don't believe work like this is possible without some of those foundations. So we built our own sort of system. We call it the elements of marketing. We were all trained and we've been really doubling down on creativity. I myself come from more of the creative side of the business. I started in in media um and worked at brands like you know Martha Stewart and InStyle. Um so an unlikely road for me to be um here at a pharma company but bringing all that I learned and all the best practices around um consumer engagement and really building off an insight. So um like like the colleagues on on this podcast, we really start with the insight. What is it? What and then what is the behavior behav behavioral barrier? What what are we trying to change? Last year, you know, the the insight was really simple. Breasts are adored but ignored. So, women spend a lot of time a lot of people spend a lot of time thinking about women's breasts, but not necessarily when it matters most when they need to make a proactive health decision. Um, you know, uh, one in two women skip their annual man mammograms in the US and that's for a variety of reasons. But in this case, women know they should get, you know, they should get screened, but they get that life gets in the way. Uh access gets in the way and other things. So, we put together um something that we felt met the moment. You know, you talk about the Super Bowl um 50% female audience or 47% female audience, the whole Taylor Swift effect. So, we thought it was the right place to have that conversation at a broad scale. But you're right, it's a it's a really fine line in threading a needle in order to be humorous, get get into culture, but not um you know, strike strike, you know, not be too provocative, but really get have the focus be on the message. And what I was excited to see and what we were really encouraged by is that through our own tracking and reports from our advocacy partners like Susan G. Kman, for example, women were taking that step. they were, you know, expressing intent to be screened. Millions came to the website to get reminders to be screened and to nudge their friends. So, we we had great confidence that this was a platform that could work. But was interesting is last year we had not announced our NFL partnership. So, we were not NFL partners. So, we kind of uh worked with um the cheerleading community to um bring that message to the Super Bowl. In the subsequent months, we announced an NFL partnership. as we thought about leaning into proactive uh health choices for men this year and and prostate cancer screening and really, you know, digging into why why men aren't getting screened. We really wanted to lean into our NFL partnership and the football community. So that's sort of the the the two pieces led to um this uh you know we did a lot of behavioral and insights research and got to the insight around um men are avoiding the the getting screened because of either fear or misunderstanding or lack of knowledge about the DR the digital rectal exam. So >> um this idea that you can just start with a blood test and it is it is a starting point. You may you may need a DR if if something is uncovered but the point is >> wait a minute. >> Yeah. [laughter] I'm kidding. >> It's an important tool on once you get screened, but the point is you can get screened and and get peace of mind uh as an initial first step. So, we kept the message really simple. Um I think the other thing that's important is to have authentic storytellers. So, when you talk about celebrity Gary and we did use Grank, >> it was about that relationship with coach Arians and that player coach relationship and the authenticity of that. >> I'm sorry to interrupt that. I just you just got me so excited. It was such a deep cut. But you also had an audience of 30 million men, you know, they got way more men, but I'm going to say 30 million, maybe 40 million men that knew that that was his coach, you know, and probably another 25 to 30 million that recognized some of the secondary and tertiary celebrity tight ends. But for but in in a lot of ways, this is real. This was super interesting. what went through my mind I appreciated that you used and by the way I'm big on this lower cost you know you know sometimes it's awareness you you did both things right Gail you guys did full awareness I you know which is obviously Super Bowl important but I will say that one of the hardest things in television commercials and why I struggle with them outside of this platform is you tend to go vanilla and you're trying to be everything to everyone and you end up being nothing to no one. So, relevance is incredibly hard in a 30- secondond video, right? It's just hard. Um, and I thought the way you did it, Gail, and obviously, you know, I know you know there's an audience watching, so you go to Grank where everyone knew, you know, and knows here, but like Vernon, like you used very nerdy, you know, and again, that's the right spot. You've got a lot of diehard football fans and I app I personally as a human appreciated some of the other characters that were the other tight ends that were in it and I think some of those were very good cost ROI if you negotiated well enough that I think you should have based on where their personal brands are right now. I thought that was really well done. >> Yeah, thanks. We and we it was really important to us to have a mix of current players and um of legends and so with KD and KBY and it we have team deals with the Rams and the 49ers. So there are a lot of layers to this because really what we're trying to do is is build awareness to the point but then activate where people are taking action. So we're doing screening events uh throughout the year. We've worked in in fact in connection with the Super Bowl, we did an amazing event with the 49ers where people are actually getting screened or have the opportunity to get screened and they are. So it's not just the platform, but it's how are we enabling simplicity so people can take an action and um that that the work with the NFL is so important. We share that proactive health, you know, that that same value of of getting people to make proactive health decisions and then leveraging the team and the current players as well. as the legend. So there were a lot of layers in it, but I go back to we built um a marketing philosophy at Novartis and a and a set of tools that help us get to these deep insights, but then activated scale with creative at the core. I really believe so strongly in real people, real storytelling, real world experiences and that's our we have a create platform and it's central to that. >> It was beautiful storytelling. By the way, Bad Bunny's halftime show was beautiful storytelling. So, there was it was a great night of storytelling on many fronts. And speaking of storytelling, Medie, we're going to bring you into this. Now, this was a first, right? This first Super Bowl spot for C Cadillac's F1 brand. First time, as you said, a Formula 1 team has advertised in the Super Bowl and revealed a car at the same delivery at the same time. And I think you were only hired in October. Do I have that right? >> Yeah, end of October. Yeah. >> Right. [laughter] >> And I think you did not walk into an idea that was fully baked. You walked into hey >> we're going to be in the Super Bowl. Get to work. >> Yeah. >> Absolutely right. >> So, you did it. Congrats to you and your team. But start out with, are you happy with how everything went? Yeah, honestly, um I've had the good fortune in my past career to sit, you know, on the side and and watch a Super Bowl campaign at Audi that I've talked to Gary about in the past get created. Um so I know the process a little bit, right? But that's a four to five month process if you're lucky. Um and you can plan against it and you're usually building off of a brand narrative that's already been placed. So here, yeah, we come in, you have 90 days to figure it out. uh don't have a marketing team, don't have an agency on board, uh don't have an idea, just know that we want to innovate, livery, reveal. So, um while learning F1 and and then getting a team together and getting an agency on board, it was it was like everything else this amazing team is doing, it's a race against time, right? The same way the car is being built, the same way the team is being built, the Super Bowl campaign was being built. So, um it was a lot. It was a lot of work. And to to your point, I think we're really really happy with the outcome this far. We actually have more to come. We're not done yet. Uh we actually for the next couple days, you're going to see some more stuff that connects because um really by coincidence, we got really lucky. The we had the Super Bowl spot and and the livery reveal connected. That was very much so planned and our control, but the very first time the delivery will be on track in preseason testing is actually starting today in Bahrain. And so we were like we couldn't miss this opportunity to do um let's call it a curtain call and do something interesting to say hey as a as a user as a consumer or a fan you see the car you know first you see it in a in a TV spot then if you're in New York and you know you see it in person and then you see it in an out of home program now you see it running doing sprints in Bahrain on the track and so from a fan perspective it's like well you get all this amazing content in you know 3 to 4 days and so we wanted to make sure we connected all those dots so to answer your question. I couldn't even do a 1 to 10 yet because we we I got to get to Wednesday afternoon. Um and I'll be able to give you a proper answer, but there's there's a lot that had to be done in a very short amount of time. Um but you know, as I'm learning the world of F1, everything happens under a lot of pressure at the the last minute. >> So tell us about this idea. How did it happen? I mean, I get it. Going to the Super Bowl. I you know, I get But then you said, "Okay, we're going to do a parallel reveal." >> So what was the birth of that idea? Tell us about that. >> Yeah. So, I mean, first Dan and Cassidy Towers had the idea back in August that they wanted to change the way livery reveals were done. This is the first one of the team. So, we needed to make it big. We needed to make it important. So, the Super Bowl spot idea was there. Um, then, you know, moving a little bit down the line, it's like, okay, well, is that enough? Right? Are people going to get it? Are people going to watch, you know, the 130 million people that watch Super Bowl every year, are they going to see a spot of a Formula 1 car and understand why they should be paying attention and why they should care? And I think that started the conversation of okay well we should probably invest more from a content perspective and like Gary said you know like raising canes does they create these environments and where it's really fun to be there in person but really the goal isn't to make it the most fun in person the goal is to make it the most fun digitally and that's to create a lot of great content um to create that moment and so that was a conversation we had internally is is this too much to do a second event do we have the bandwidth or does this feed into the same goal of what we're trying to do um and at the end of the day it was let's come up with an idea a that innovates the way this is done, but also changes the sports accessibility, right? Um, and F1 is a very, you know, it's a luxury sport. It's an elevated sport. It's the pinnacle of racing. There's only 24 races and they're they're in cities all across the globe, but so many of the fans across the world don't get a chance to either go to a race or experience it. So, we wanted to think about accessible ways to while still remaining elevated, accessible ways for people to experience the team. And to me, that comes through physical experience outside of off the track. um but also great digital experience and a level of transparency that we can bring people in. And I think that's what we're endeavoring to achieve um with the experience in Times Square and what you'll see coming um I think Cat's kind of out of the bag. We we we ran the you know ran the headline that we are partnering with Apple on a shot on iPhone campaign um around the Bahrain execution which yeah which will be which will be running. So, the goal really is to find all different mediums to bring the sport and the team to new fans while paying homage to the core fandom, right? I I would hope the the core F1 fans see this and they're like, "That's cool. They're changing the way liveries are done." While at the same time, new fans that may have just seen the F1 movie, maybe watch Drive to Survive, maybe are just getting into it because they have a favorite driver are like, "Oh, that's really cool. They're bringing it to me in a platform I like. They're bringing to me in a place I'm comfortable and they're starting to pull me into their world." And and that's really the thought behind it. >> Cool. >> Gary, you must love it. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I think the the thing that I would say is the thing that most caught my attention in in that beautiful rant was I hope brands are starting to realize like everything's a production day. >> And I think once we understand that like I just it wouldn't be a a session with me if I didn't rail on the old way of doing things. Because I mean this idea of paying companies to come up with ideas on retainer just feels very antiquated and then to pay and then the second part that's antiquated is we spend an enormous amount of money to do a production in a fake environment. It just feels like there's a better way and I think we're starting to get there and it doesn't and it doesn't even require the Super Bowl. It just becomes a day-to-day way of life. And I think um whether it's sampling, whether it's experiential, >> whether it's business meetings internally, I know weird stuff that I would you know that as you know Jim, people made jokes of me about or even when I you know called you out of the blue and said you should do a CMO podcast. To me it's the podcast is a production day for the social media clips. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Right. So um yeah, I hope I I hope brands start getting more bang for their buck. >> Well, Luis, let's turn to you. I think you know how to get bang for your buck, right? >> Yes. >> So, so this is the this is your first year. >> Uh let's start with that. What compelled you to make that decision? >> We looked at Tree Hut, right? And we clearly realized that the brand is behaving like a big brand. I mean, we're we're we're a challenger brand, right? We're smaller social first brand but culturally which is very very important. We're behaving sometimes even better than some of these bigger brands right and that's a moment that we realize okay we don't have a big mass media moment but we need to amplify what we currently have. We have this momentum with our community, with our creators, building that product love, right? And at some point it was really more than the belief that we had internally and say like we need to share this with the masses and scaling the belief is what we aim to do. >> So I have a question from one of our community Melanie Seabboard actually at the research company humanology. She asked, "What gave you the confidence that the unca uncontain yourself creative idea and the integration of your creators was strong enough would work be compelling in that environment of the Super Bowl? So talk a bit about that. How when did you get and how did you get the confidence to do it?" >> I think the confidence came from knowing that we were not going to change the brand, right? We're going to continue to remain authentic to who we are, remain through the really knowledge of our creators, our OGs as we call it, right? We started in social media. So, we wanted just to amplify that platform, right? Knowing that we will continue to do what we do best, but now we're going to add it to the biggest stage in the world. That's what give us the confidence that there's nothing that could could be could be go wrong, right? Some people actually didn't understand the ad. Not very few. There's an article out there. It's like they they didn't get it. And that's exactly what we wanted to. It's like I want you to not understand what happening because you don't know these brand. The people that know these brands love the brand so much that it amplifies and grows and they take to social to speak for us. So it's a whole momentum. So knowing that really drove the confidence for us. >> Was there was there fear in that? you know. >> Yeah. >> Meaning in that you're confusing the audience. It might just be confusing and it's expensive to do Super Bowl like that. I I give you a lot of credit to take that risk. >> Yeah. It it was a risky move. So if I mean to to answer Jim's question, this was an 11 for us. We achieved everything we wanted to do, right? uh from a social perspective again because we we looked at the Super Bowl as a tactic on a full campaign rebrand which is not many people look at that people prepare everything to culminate at the Super Bowl moment. We basically started on Christmas day and Super Bowl although a very expensive tactic we were timing it just to have to it's part of that amplification that was it but our game wasn't social uh the content creation has been grown substantially and getting then our content creators on the big screen that's where the magic started to happen so we just remain really confident of what we wanted to do >> all right now I want to open it up to this beautiful panel You you all have great stories. Uh you all you all feel very confident and happy about your effort, proud of your team, celebrating it internally. So did anything happen in this conversation that compels one of you to ask one of you a burning question. >> I have a question. >> Yeah. >> If you don't mind for for you, Maddie. >> So I think it's very cool very cool what you did and the car does look amazing. So clearly like you wanted to disrupt the way the car is revealed. Is that gonna be your identity going forward in F1? Like, are you gonna continue to disrupt this world? >> Yeah. I mean, it's funny. The first thing I wanted to do coming in, because I don't have a full F1 background, is let me bring in all the experience I have and innovate at every nook and cranny that I can. And I think what I've quickly realized is while that would be fun and exciting, there's there is a high level of importance to keeping some foundational excellence and and give, you know, give the the discipline of Formula 1 the respect that there's some things that need to stay just foundationally excellent and you do the foundations correctly, but you know, innovating with intention. So where are the moments that we can change things? Delivery reveal, is that something we can change? You know, when it comes to offtrack entertainment and hosting, is that something we can change? Collaborations and the way that happens, right? So absolutely um and the and the purpose and the northstar will always be there. So it's not innovation for the sake of change itself, but how can we make something more modern? How can we make something better as a consumer experience and a fan experience and how can we make things more accessible, right, for more fans because the the bigger the fandom grows for the sport, better for every team. And I think that's that's really going to be something for me to personally focus with our team. >> Nice. >> Yeah. >> Anyone else have a burning question? Yeah, Mie, go ahead. >> Yeah, I have a question for the group. Especially in the world of social um you know one of the things we talk about is building fandom at the team right that's our north star is how do we build more fans and in a world where in social we've moved away from you know the social graph into a content graph world and people are less likely to follow brands but more likely to stay tuned into their algorithm and views are now you know elevating in in importance and engagement is elevating importance. How are you guys talking about that shift internally? Right. Are you guys still thinking about >> that's better? You know, like like somebody following you or signing up for your newsletter doesn't mean they're an actual fan. >> Right. >> Right. By the way, I am literally I don't I don't literally sign up for the Jets newsletter, nor do I actually think I follow the Jets on every social platform. I will kill people for the Jets. >> So, so Gary, question for you then, right? It's like how should a sports team be looking at calculating fandom? How should brands be looking at calculated fandom? Yeah. >> Ticket selling stuff, you know, showing up for like impact, right? I think we you know the I don't know why this industry is addicted to proxies to the punchline, you know, let's let's me measure the punchline to your point. And and what's really interesting, brother, is now that we're in an interest graph, not a social graph framework, it allows all of us to finally double down on what we've all been missing, which is more relevance with more different consumer segmentations to drive our actual businesses, right? Like we like Gail wants every type of guy, you know, at a certain age group. You can imagine that if you're, you know, my father is a Russian immigrant that spent his first 25 years in the Soviet Union, grew up in the liquor business, grew up in Jersey. that piece of creative to compel him to be aware, you know, is going to be very different than a Cuban 50-year-old who was born third generation Miami family versus, you know, a guy in Iowa who's, you know, and I I think I'm so excited for all of you that were in this era because I think we have overvalued proxies and I think weirdly the social media algorithms are forcing us to a very fundamental place in marketing. It's crazy that the new things are reinforcing the most important thing which is relevance leads to consideration which leads to purchase. We're just not accustomed on this call. We grew up in an era where we were vanilla top down matching luggage. Let's roll the dice because we were forced to like it was a TVcentric world. There was no technology to really measure creative irrelevance. These algorithms happen to just align with us as marketers. They want to keep all of us on the platform for as long as possible. Thus, they play only on relevance. If we now play on that same game, we win, right? So, you know, I think fandom is only executed in the end. The hell am I doing with this, >> right? This is measurable for them. >> Your Jets t-shirt, >> but it's not going to be based on do I follow them on Snapchat. Like, I I know for a fact actually that I'm not subscribed to the Jets on YouTube, right? So, I think there's I think we're heading in a really fun direction that I think is going to help. And I think um Super Bowl is the awareness supernova, but I think for all of you, how you how you post game from now to win on relevance to different demos, ages, gender, races, income levels, and interest graph. It's almost like we're going to go into this world where the big boulder comes, but it's going to be all those pebbles that you do across the year. And I would argue done best um and not o not always the way we do it at Vayner but done best it's it's pebbles at scale all year and the golden pebble becomes the brief and becomes the framework of the Super Bowl at the end not the reverse. We continue to do our best in here with all our talents to guess it based on insights and things that nature but guess it on the creative. I think we're all going to wake up within the next half decade and do it the reverse. It's going to be the pebbles at scale of relevance all year that come September, October, November, December, if you're late, uh will become the brief. And I will actually predict here now because you guys know me well enough to know I'm going to want to clip this in six years and be like told you. Um, I am going to predict that within the next 5 years, there will be a Super Bowl spot that is the exact replica of the social media post that got 100 million organic views by a brand. Literally black bars and all aired in its full natural sense. I think between now and then there's an opportunity for a lot of the brands here to use the insights of their winning social media organic like organic because when you start using paid to cover it up you're back in television land on social which is double bad. Um so that's where I think things are going. >> So young comment on that you've built a beautiful business you on those principles. Yeah, I mean we also um our our category has the luxury of having pretty immediate data availability from a consumption perspective and so we see very very highly correlated when we see social organic social engagement with organic search volume with actual consumption and pull through on demand. It all tracks one to one. It's like really an incredible thing to see. And I I guess to to just build on what Gary just said, for us, what that means in terms of how we build relevance is to build a highly attuned um always on reactive content creation engine within the team that has its ears to the ground all the time and is constantly turnurning things out all the time. Because the more at bats we have, the more shots we have at getting the algorithm to do the work for us and deliver our content to as many people as possible. And for us that means things that are t like tiny in scale that you never would have placed your bets on sometimes deliver outsized results. It's really an incredible thing to see. >> It's called advertising. You know just you know when everybody hears shots on goal, right? And the algorithm is just people's interest. It's just relevance. But this whole shots on gold that is demonized by our industry. We've done print ads and direct mail and billboards and radio for 100 years. We do day-to-day marketing for a hundred years. This concept that has been completely grounded in companies that can't deliver on creative day-to-day, demonizing it, and wanting to talk about fidelity and all this stuff that is not tangible. We We must stop demonizing volume in our industry. We've been doing volume. When I met Gail, she had unlimited FSIs and couponing every week in [laughter] the she was in. That wasn't bad. That was good. And you know this concept of 30, 40, 70, 150 social media ads a week, it's called advertising. It's 2026. This is not bad. I promise you that she and her team, and I can speak for our company, and we're at scale now. None of it is spray and prey. None of it is throw against the wall and see what sticks. None of it's even test and learn. It's we have consumers we're trying to reach. This is our best belief that this will work. Luckily, we're spending so little on the production of that creative that we can make a lot of it. And when the quant and qual is clear data, then we can start the process of what we want to do next. Whether for some brands send it to the lower funnel and do performance or some brands send it all the way up to the Super Bowl. >> I think >> all right, we're running time. Last word to our guest. one piece of advice, very short piece of advice for someone considering doing a Super Bowl experience next year. You've all done it. Some of you have done it more than once. What's your one or two sentence of of advice to someone considering for next year? >> Yeah, I mean, Jim, I'll just say build an experience. I mean, we we all sort of said it in different ways, but um the the the Super Bowl activation or the tactic is just part of the experience, and you really need to think about that long and hard and support it throughout the a year. It's not a one moment. It's it's it's a it's a debut or a moment to get attention, but then it's what you do with it afterwards. >> I would say in two words, be bold. Fortune favors the bold. >> Beautiful. >> I'd say uh be remembered. Make sure it's your brand that's remembered after. >> I would say um radical clarity internally. Make sure before you go into war on this thing, you have radical clarity of what you want to get out of it. um and use that as your true north star throughout the the pressures of of building this campaign. >> Yeah. And then remain true to your brand, right? Like don't try to change it just because it's a Super Bowl. Don't get out there. Just do what you do best and you'll be successful. >> Those are all great pieces of advice. I don't know what we get there, but it was beautiful. Gary, last word. >> Yeah, last word on advice for marketers that are watching is what you said. Please connect with all of these incredible marketers on LinkedIn and message them and extract the secrets. >> Love it. Love it. >> Hey gang, it was so good to see all the smiling faces. Congratulations to everyone for the great work. It's very inspiring. Thanks for joining us. Very helpful for our community. Gary, thanks again. Eight years in a row. Maybe we'll do nine. We'll see. >> We will. Nine's a good number. Take care everyone. >> Good. All right. Bye now.