[0:00] you would never shoot a video and just
[0:01] load it without editing it but that's
[0:03] what many people are doing in their
[0:04] lives is there a scientific way to spark
[0:06] creativity on command nothing sit there
[0:09] and suffer what exactly is YouTuber
[0:11] burnout how do you know when you're
[0:13] burnt out the more public you are the
[0:15] more of a personality you are the more
[0:17] you are completely working against
[0:20] anything Evolution ever anticipated for
[0:22] you today on the Colin its Mir show we
[0:24] talked to Dr Peter AA about one of the
[0:26] biggest challenges facing YouTube
[0:28] creators burnout this is something that
[0:30] Samir and I and a lot of our friends
[0:32] have dealt with many times in our career
[0:34] we're no stranger to burnout my friend
[0:37] that's what I'm saying we've we've we've
[0:39] had some really tough times and I think
[0:41] uh you know there's been times where we
[0:43] compare being a Creator to being an
[0:45] athlete but we don't treat ourselves
[0:47] like athletes we don't think about our
[0:50] physical and mental well-being in the
[0:52] context of Peak Performance but that's
[0:55] what this conversation is all about we
[0:56] got to sit with Peter back in the
[0:57] beginning of the year at spotter Summit
[1:00] where we got to host a fireside chat
[1:02] with him in front of a ton of top
[1:04] creators and it was one of the most
[1:06] engaged sessions because you realize
[1:09] every Creator is trying to operate at
[1:12] their Peak Performance and Peter is not
[1:15] like other doctors he has a different
[1:17] perspective he's a cool doctor he's a
[1:19] cool docor he actually is really cool
[1:21] he's a cool guy yeah he is not only an
[1:24] expert in wellness and Longevity but he
[1:27] is a Creator himself right so he has an
[1:30] understanding of what it is like to
[1:32] press publish to put out multiple
[1:34] episodes and how to deal with the career
[1:39] not only that he's studied this for a
[1:40] long time he's like one of the leading
[1:42] experts in longevity he wrote a book
[1:45] called outlive which is a New York Times
[1:46] bestseller and one that you gifted me
[1:49] thank you um you're welcome but he's a
[1:51] guy who has really studied longevity and
[1:54] how not only do we live a long life but
[1:57] how do we live an enjoyable life
[2:00] and that that's something that I just
[2:01] really love about him the first time I
[2:04] ever had the chance to speak with Peter
[2:06] AA I left feeling like my life had
[2:08] completely changed yeah I will always
[2:11] look back on and remember and I'm
[2:12] excited for all of you to have a similar
[2:14] type of experience in this episode we
[2:16] sourced questions from three different
[2:18] creators for Peter and also at the end
[2:21] of this episode Colin and I come back
[2:23] and do a debrief so after Peter leaves
[2:25] the chair we sit down and give you our
[2:27] takeaways from the episode so stay tuned
[2:30] for
[2:30] [Music]
[2:35] that petera welcome to the show thank
[2:38] you for having me sir should I have said
[2:39] Dr petera no just petera okay great um
[2:45] although have you seen uh you guys are
[2:47] probably not old enough to remember meet
[2:48] the Meet the Parents no of course you of
[2:50] course you are yeah come on how old do
[2:52] you think we are I mean come on didn't
[2:54] that movie come out in like 2000 we're
[2:56] maybe older than we look yeah yeah so
[2:59] remember the scene in it with the the Dr
[3:01] Bob yes he's like please call me Bob MD
[3:04] so anytime I'm with my wife and someone
[3:07] calls me like Dr I'm like please call me
[3:09] Peter she goes
[3:11] MD so
[3:14] embarrassing um well man we we
[3:16] absolutely loved the conversation we got
[3:18] to have with you in January in Montana
[3:20] and I I think i' I don't think I've ever
[3:22] seen a room of creators that engaged
[3:24] like that that was a pretty I think we
[3:28] all could have sat in there for another
[3:30] two hours with you just raising our
[3:31] hands and asking questions so and
[3:33] multiple creators took notes there were
[3:35] Google docs on top of Google doc that
[3:37] got sent out after that talk yeah so
[3:40] that I think uh after that experience I
[3:42] think we we took a step back and we were
[3:44] like we should really have that
[3:45] conversation on the show because scaling
[3:47] that and and spreading that like I think
[3:50] the connection
[3:51] of Health creativity and also just work
[3:55] our relationship with work as creative
[3:57] people um it's just not something that
[4:00] we're discussing that much um so I
[4:03] wanted to start with just even asking
[4:06] you the question of uh this term burnout
[4:08] you know we used it a lot a lot of
[4:10] creators use it is there like a is that
[4:13] a conversation that's happening from a
[4:15] medical perspective or like how do you
[4:17] define what is
[4:19] burnout you know I don't know that I
[4:20] have a great definition for it but it is
[4:22] definitely it's one of those things that
[4:24] uh you know I don't know if it was the
[4:25] Supreme Court that said this but you I'm
[4:27] sure you've heard it it's apocryphal
[4:28] about you know it's it's hard to Define
[4:30] pornography but you know it when you see
[4:31] it I think the same is true for for for
[4:33] Burnout um so so apologies to the
[4:37] sociologists or behavioral psychologists
[4:39] who who probably actually have a
[4:40] technical definition for it um but it is
[4:42] a topic in medicine especially in
[4:44] primary care but frankly all over
[4:46] medicine uh physician burnout is you
[4:48] know it's just it's just a mammoth
[4:49] problem you know many Physicians have to
[4:51] operate in a paradigm where they they
[4:52] have to see a certain number of patients
[4:55] a day their their visits and
[4:56] interactions with the patients are very
[4:58] transactional and you've got you know
[5:01] somewhere between 10 and 15 minutes per
[5:02] patient and you're going to run through
[5:05] 10 hours of this every single day and so
[5:07] what you don't have time for in that
[5:09] situation is you don't have time to talk
[5:11] to the person you don't have time to
[5:12] strike up a rapport so that clearly
[5:14] leads to this phenomenon of burn out
[5:16] you're kind of losing the reason you did
[5:17] this thing because there's nobody who
[5:19] said I want to go into medicine because
[5:21] I want to push as many charts as as
[5:22] humanly possible in a day and come up
[5:24] with as many diagnostic codes to make
[5:26] sure that we get reimbursed etc etc
[5:28] that's not that's not really why people
[5:29] go into it
[5:30] I I think the difference between like
[5:33] doctors and creators when it comes to
[5:34] burnout is that a doctor is very much on
[5:36] the clock right like there is it's very
[5:38] long hours but there's an extended
[5:40] period of time where it's like it will
[5:41] end at some point YouTube creators and
[5:44] content creators we like make our own
[5:46] hours right so we will go and go and go
[5:49] and go and that often leads us and has
[5:52] led us to burnout what are I I wish I
[5:56] knew this in my early 20s but what are
[5:58] some of the like sure fire signs that
[6:01] you are burnt out and should take a step
[6:05] back and sort of reassess you know again
[6:07] I think there are there's probably a
[6:08] real clinical answer to this but I would
[6:10] say some some things that likely sit on
[6:13] that list would be just a a a lack of
[6:15] desire to do the thing right like if the
[6:18] Joy from the from the thing you're
[6:19] supposed to be doing is gone um that's
[6:22] that's probably a sign that you're
[6:23] burning out um so I know for me when I'm
[6:26] sort of feeling that way um like for
[6:29] example like I I sort of do you know I
[6:31] have like five different jobs um but
[6:33] like one of those jobs is the podcast
[6:35] right is content creation if I'm not
[6:37] enjoying preparing for a podcast if I'm
[6:40] feeling like I'm not prepared and you
[6:44] know all of a sudden I've lost the plot
[6:45] of why do I even want to talk to this
[6:47] person tomorrow like you know this is
[6:49] something that's been arranged for
[6:50] months and now I've lost why I'm doing
[6:52] it because I feel lost in my preparation
[6:54] it's usually a sign that I'm going too
[6:55] fast if the joy is gone then I'm I'm
[6:58] probably on that path to burn out I
[7:00] would just say if it's sort of creeping
[7:01] into other areas of your life you know
[7:03] if you know you guys are married I don't
[7:05] know if you guys have you guys have kids
[7:06] not yet not yet yeah so I think if
[7:09] you're distracted around your at least
[7:10] for me if I'm distracted around my kids
[7:12] if I'm not able to kind of if I set
[7:15] aside time to do something with my kids
[7:17] if I'm sort of being pulled into
[7:19] something else um that's that's just
[7:21] generally a bad sign for me or at least
[7:22] a warning sign that's you know it makes
[7:24] me say hey what what's going on and why
[7:26] is this happening there there's a uh
[7:28] definition of the the term that was that
[7:30] we heard from Casey nead who's like
[7:32] obviously like a storied Creator um he
[7:35] said it's burnout is creative output
[7:37] without Direction and I actually think
[7:40] it's it's interesting that you mentioned
[7:42] that of like if you lose the
[7:45] initial impetus for why you did the
[7:47] thing and I I I remember hearing that
[7:50] and recognizing that there was a lot of
[7:51] time in our career over the past 13
[7:53] years where we were just trying to work
[7:56] through the stress or work through the
[7:59] ch
[8:01] and we didn't have an end point of where
[8:03] we were going and I think that actually
[8:06] today the the platforms are can be
[8:09] designed for that where it's just about
[8:11] the next as long as you can get to the
[8:13] next upload and they keep you on the on
[8:16] the uh on the treadmill really well
[8:18] right because you're rewarded for that
[8:20] dopamine hit when you do press publish
[8:22] when something does work um you want to
[8:24] feel it again and if you don't feel it
[8:27] then you're chasing that next time that
[8:29] you do feel it your kind of time window
[8:32] shortens to your next upload and I think
[8:35] the broader macro Direction can get lost
[8:37] really easily how much have you studied
[8:40] or or you know with you even as a
[8:43] content creator yourself studied the the
[8:45] impacts
[8:46] of these kind of dopamine hits that
[8:49] we're
[8:50] receiving through the internet um I
[8:53] think about it a lot actually um I I
[8:56] recently uh interviewed a woman named
[8:58] Anna l
[9:00] in fact she wrote she's a Stanford
[9:01] psychiatrist wrote the book called
[9:03] dopamine Nation so you know really wrote
[9:06] a great book that gets into the science
[9:07] of how how dopamine works and how
[9:10] certain types of external stimuli can
[9:11] kind of hijack us right so this can be a
[9:15] really positive thing or it can be kind
[9:17] of a negative thing so it really depends
[9:19] on the nature of um how how the dopamine
[9:23] system is is sort of hijacked so let's
[9:25] start with kind of a positive example um
[9:28] so first thing is understanding that in
[9:30] every system the body really wants to be
[9:32] in equilibrium so so one of the things
[9:34] that is kind of amazing about biology
[9:37] and in human biology is realizing how
[9:39] many systems are in place to keep us in
[9:42] this point of equilibrium so take for
[9:43] example temperature the body has to be
[9:46] at 98 and A5 degrees Fahrenheit that's
[9:49] really the optimal place for every
[9:51] enzyme in the body to work plus or
[9:53] minus5° so basically 98 to 99° F
[9:58] obviously you'll get outside of that if
[9:59] you have a
[10:00] fever you're going to be 101 102 that is
[10:04] not optimal but your body's making that
[10:06] tradeoff to get rid of and kill a
[10:08] virus but what happens if you get to 104
[10:10] 105 you're dead similarly what if you
[10:13] get down to 94 93 well if you're there
[10:17] for too long you're dead so again body
[10:20] has incredible systems to keep you in
[10:23] that range regardless of the external
[10:24] temperature H okay let's think about
[10:27] something like pH so again not to get
[10:29] two sciency on it but pH is a marker of
[10:31] acid balance our bodies exist at a pH of
[10:34] 7.4 if you get much above about 7.8
[10:37] you're dead if you get below 7.1 7.0
[10:41] you're dead so regardless of what is
[10:43] going on in your body your kidneys and
[10:45] your lungs will work like crazy to
[10:48] buffer the acid in your body I could go
[10:51] on and on and on but basically every
[10:53] system in the body works this way
[10:55] whether it's the regulation of glucose
[10:57] sodium hemoglobin you name it we're
[11:00] these incredible equilibrium machines I
[11:02] think it's one of the most amazing
[11:03] things about the human body is its
[11:04] capacity for buffering anything okay so
[11:07] now let's talk about how dopamine
[11:08] factors into that so our body wants to
[11:11] sort of preserve a certain level of
[11:15] homeostasis within um kind of the way
[11:17] our brain works so when you do something
[11:21] that is actually quite uncomfortable
[11:23] that causes pain um your body will
[11:27] actually start to produce more dopamine
[11:29] to offset that so an example of that
[11:31] would be exercise so why do people most
[11:34] of the time feel actually quite good
[11:35] after Hard Exercise well it's actually
[11:38] because when you exercise really really
[11:40] hard and you're hurting yourself and I
[11:42] don't mean like in kind of a dangerous
[11:44] way but like you we were talking earlier
[11:45] when you came in you were doing dead
[11:46] hangs you were doing Farmers carries
[11:48] clearly that hurt yeah yeah so your body
[11:51] started to actually make so the pain is
[11:54] coming on your body actually has to
[11:55] start making dopamine to offset that
[11:58] pain when you stop doing that thing when
[12:00] you are done with your dead hangs and
[12:02] farmer carries you still have some of
[12:04] that dopamine lingering around you feel
[12:05] pretty good yeah but it's not obscene
[12:08] amounts such that there's a crash after
[12:10] it's just a slight elevation that kind
[12:12] of gently comes down the same is true
[12:14] actually for cold plunging um and this
[12:16] is not true for everybody there are some
[12:17] people who just get pain with no
[12:19] pleasure but most people actually get
[12:21] kind of quite a bit of pleasure after
[12:22] the fact certainly for me that's the
[12:24] caseit I get an incredible High that's
[12:27] not like out of this world but it's just
[12:29] it's almost like a beautiful Buzz of
[12:30] pleasure for a couple of hours after a a
[12:33] you know 10 minutes at 40° or something
[12:36] super
[12:37] frigid of course there's the negative
[12:39] side to this so what is it about
[12:40] gambling social media alcohol all of
[12:44] those things well those things actually
[12:46] produce the dopamine high but they do it
[12:48] at such a high level that your body now
[12:50] does the opposite it says I need to
[12:52] actually lower this I need to offset
[12:54] what's going on in the other direction
[12:56] and so now when that stimulus goes away
[12:58] you're actually in a depressed
[13:00] state so I I think being aware of this
[13:05] kind of helps you understand at least
[13:07] for me I work well when I have an
[13:10] understanding of the system so by
[13:12] understanding that I just limit the
[13:15] amount of time that I'm doing things
[13:18] that are producing intense
[13:20] stimulation um I try to get my dopamine
[13:24] I hate to use this word but I try to get
[13:25] it more naturally right that's why I
[13:28] like using cold plunge I like using
[13:29] exercise I I don't like to use social
[13:33] reinforcement I don't like to use social
[13:36] media which is not to say I don't have
[13:37] social media I just don't like to look
[13:39] at it very much as as a validation right
[13:43] I like to look at it for entertainment
[13:45] so I'm not you know I have Instagram on
[13:46] my phone I'm always scrolling looking
[13:48] for funny videos and baseball videos and
[13:50] like the things that I like but I spend
[13:53] virtually no time looking at the
[13:55] response to my content because I know
[13:58] that that's going to create that honic
[14:00] cycle where I'm going to need it and I'm
[14:02] going to be disappointed when it's not
[14:03] there and even if it is there it's just
[14:05] going to fuel the next
[14:07] high that's not an easy thing to do no
[14:10] that's incredibly challenging especially
[14:11] when it's connected to your other
[14:13] currency evaluation which is money yeah
[14:16] it's also like just not good for
[14:18] business like I wouldn't recommend a lot
[14:20] of professional creators to just not
[14:21] look at their analy no I think what you
[14:23] can do is you can have others you so
[14:25] first of all you can look at the
[14:26] analytics NE without necessarily just
[14:28] getting mired in the details of every
[14:31] comment right the other thing is you
[14:33] know you can have others who are less
[14:35] emotionally attached to it kind of help
[14:37] with some of that stuff so yeah by all
[14:40] means we should understand how content
[14:42] is performing and what's doing well and
[14:44] what's not um but in particular I think
[14:48] kind of you know getting getting um
[14:51] attaching your validation to to to
[14:55] whatever it is the number of comments
[14:56] the number of views I I think is
[14:59] slippery slope and and and honestly like
[15:00] I don't know if you're going to win I
[15:02] think you have to ask the question like
[15:04] even if it's going really well if you're
[15:06] attaching your validation to
[15:09] that you're never really going to be
[15:12] satiated there there may not be a
[15:14] scientific answer to this but I'm
[15:15] curious I was speaking with uh a Creator
[15:18] yesterday and she's a comedian and we
[15:19] were talking about how you end up seeing
[15:23] comments by accident yeah a lot of times
[15:25] you're not looking for a comment but you
[15:27] see a negative comment yeah and it can
[15:29] about your appearance it can be about
[15:30] your performance and even if there are
[15:31] 2,000 positive comments you see that one
[15:35] and it impacts you so much and for some
[15:36] reason the 2,000 positive comments are
[15:39] not able to balance out the negative one
[15:41] for sure why is that like why am I not
[15:44] able to sort of separate in a healthy
[15:46] way the one negative from the 2000
[15:48] positive yeah so whoever told you that
[15:50] is absolutely correct and he or she is
[15:52] not alone um it's called negativity bias
[15:55] and there is actually a scientific
[15:56] reason for it at least we we believe
[15:58] there is and ution would have favored
[16:00] this so think about how we evolved right
[16:02] we evolved in tribes and these tribes
[16:05] were pretty small right so probably we
[16:09] we banded together in groups of I don't
[16:11] know 20 to 100 people and that was about
[16:13] it so now think about think about how
[16:17] natural selection would have selected
[16:19] for people who were attuned to the
[16:22] negative response of others that's a
[16:24] really important feature to have so
[16:27] imagine we go back back in time it's
[16:30] 200,000 years ago we're just chilling in
[16:32] our tribe and I'm a complete
[16:36] prick it would be so important that I
[16:39] quickly figure out you guys know that
[16:42] and don't like me and I have to course
[16:43] correct my behavior CU if you guys kick
[16:46] me out of the tribe right I just died
[16:49] humans cannot survive in isolation for
[16:51] more than a couple of days so there's
[16:54] this incredible pressure to be very
[16:57] attuned to when people don't like me the
[17:00] converse is not true it's actually not
[17:02] that important that I know you like me
[17:04] from an evolutionary perspective now we
[17:06] could argue for all the reasons today it
[17:09] would be wonderful if I knew that you
[17:10] loved me and it would be so validating
[17:12] to me and it would but evolution doesn't
[17:14] care about that Evolution cares about
[17:15] survival and procreation and that's it
[17:18] and that's what's hardwired into our
[17:20] genome so that that's the reason for
[17:22] this phenomenon we are absolutely
[17:25] hardwired towards a negativity bias so
[17:28] it's explains phenomenon explains why we
[17:30] like negative news more than positive
[17:32] news um it's a great example of how
[17:35] something that
[17:36] was absolutely essential for our
[17:39] survival as a species has become so
[17:42] maladaptive in the current environment
[17:44] that negativity bias is a really
[17:46] interesting one in the context of
[17:48] survivalism I really yeah just think
[17:50] about like what it would have been like
[17:52] yeah in a tribe if you couldn't perceive
[17:55] others negative feelings towards you I I
[17:58] wonder also if like our tribes now were
[18:02] were like from an evolution perspective
[18:04] we were never meant to have such big uh
[18:08] tribes we were not absolutely tribes of
[18:10] millions of people which is what you
[18:12] have on YouTube which is what you have
[18:14] on social media right the more public
[18:16] you are the more of a personality you
[18:18] are the more you are completely working
[18:22] against anything Evolution ever
[18:24] anticipated for you now it's not to say
[18:27] if our species doesn't survive another
[18:29] 100,000 years that we won't figure out a
[18:33] way to evolve into that so then why why
[18:36] in the context of like burnout and um
[18:40] you know enjoyment of the thing is
[18:42] something that we're talking about yeah
[18:44] purpose is a thing that can keep you
[18:48] healthy why is that is there any studies
[18:51] around like why purpose and uh
[18:54] connection to your why or like enjoyment
[18:57] of that thing
[18:59] does like it's kind of interesting to me
[19:01] that that would play into a fact of like
[19:04] Evolution or even like human
[19:07] biology so again I I think you know
[19:10] Arthur do you guys know who Arthur
[19:11] Brooks is yeah Arthur Arthur's a great
[19:14] friend and and someone I spend a lot of
[19:16] time thinking about this subject with um
[19:19] so Arthur would argue that Evolution
[19:21] didn't actually care about your
[19:24] happiness um so happiness is um is like
[19:29] many things that we care about today
[19:31] that we just can't look to Evolution for
[19:33] guidance on things that are easy are
[19:36] things that Evolution has selected for
[19:38] right it's easy to eat it's easy to
[19:41] notice negative comments it's easy to go
[19:44] to sleep every night might not want to
[19:46] but you know like eventually you're
[19:47] going to have to sleep every night like
[19:49] those are the things that are hardwired
[19:51] into our genome but this other thing
[19:53] about how do I maintain a sense of
[19:55] purpose how do I you know preserve my
[19:58] pass like that just wasn't part of the
[20:00] purview of natural selection and
[20:02] therefore it will for different people
[20:04] require different degrees of expenditure
[20:07] and effort um so again there there are
[20:10] some people for whom I think these
[20:11] things come easier than others and that
[20:13] doesn't mean they're less important just
[20:15] you know there's some people like for me
[20:17] exercise comes very easily again
[20:19] Evolution didn't tell us to exercise
[20:21] like we didn't have to we were active
[20:23] naturally so anybody in the modern era
[20:25] who's going to make time to exercise is
[20:27] making a conscious decision to not be
[20:30] lazy technically Evolution wanted you
[20:32] sort of sitting around as much as
[20:33] possible conserving energy right so if
[20:35] you weren't out getting food or you know
[20:38] moving or doing something else you it's
[20:40] not like you know natural selection made
[20:43] it for your desire to carry kettle bells
[20:46] around the the campfire um but some
[20:49] people have an easier time doing it than
[20:51] others that's fine that's a question
[20:52] that I wanted to ask you specifically
[20:54] because I I often feel very
[20:56] discouraged uh at my lack of exercise or
[21:00] lack of action as it compares to the
[21:04] level of inspiration that I get in my
[21:06] life so whether that's inspiration
[21:08] through what I see on social media to
[21:10] eat this way act this way or even
[21:12] sitting with you uh at spotter Summit I
[21:15] left being like my whole life just
[21:17] changed I'm going to hang I'm going to
[21:19] cold plunge I'm going to sauna I'm going
[21:21] to eat this way I'm going to get an
[21:22] eight sleep everything is going to
[21:24] change and you know I was telling you
[21:27] I'm three4 of the way through your book
[21:29] I listen to you a lot on shows and I'm
[21:30] like I have the inspiration I have the
[21:32] motivation but I have a hard time
[21:33] staying consistent and taking action
[21:35] what advice do you have to to start
[21:37] taking those steps to be uh more active
[21:41] yeah no I think that's a great question
[21:42] Colin I think um not overdoing it and
[21:46] starting with something small that
[21:47] you're going to get a win and and some
[21:49] success with right so it might be that
[21:51] in February when we first met you you
[21:54] came away with too much ambition right
[21:56] you were like oh my God I got to change
[21:59] the way I sleep the way I eat the way I
[22:01] exercise the way I manage this that that
[22:03] well that's pretty overwhelming right
[22:05] especially for someone who's really busy
[22:07] right so it's not like you're working 9
[22:09] to5 um so what I would do is I would
[22:13] sort of you know sit down with you and
[22:15] sort of go through where you are right
[22:17] now on all the metrics so if we if we
[22:20] were to say look in an Ideal World this
[22:22] would be kind of your exercise program
[22:24] this would be how long you would sleep
[22:25] this would be how much time you devote
[22:26] to meal planning and eating um this
[22:28] would be your your mental health
[22:30] practice all these other things first
[22:32] question I want to know is where's the
[22:34] biggest opportunity so where are you
[22:36] furthest from what we might consider
[22:38] ideal and then I would marry that to
[22:42] what one thing are you willing to try
[22:44] doing first so start with a bit of
[22:46] desire and let's just assume we did that
[22:48] exercise and we realized well you're
[22:50] barely working out and as a former
[22:52] athlete I mean you played lacrosse in
[22:54] college so it's not like you're you know
[22:56] it's not like exercise is foreign to you
[22:58] um would you be willing to do 30 minutes
[22:59] a day of exercise no other change right
[23:02] let's not worry about your sleep right
[23:04] now it's not that bad let's not worry
[23:06] about all these other things and then it
[23:07] sort of just comes down to Habit
[23:09] building and I think I tal I might have
[23:11] talked about this in February but um
[23:13] when it comes to additive habits versus
[23:15] subtractive habits so subtractive habits
[23:17] are I want to quit smoking I want to
[23:19] stop eating junk food etc etc additive
[23:21] habits are I want to exercise I want to
[23:23] go to bed earlier those kinds of things
[23:25] um so on an additive habit I think the
[23:27] key is building success small and
[23:31] consistent and so if a person's not
[23:33] exercising at all I would say could we
[23:36] do 15 minutes of something a day where
[23:38] by the way at the beginning it might not
[23:40] even be going to the gym it might be
[23:41] going for a walk but if can I pull you
[23:44] away from whatever it is that's keeping
[23:46] you from exercise so if it's TV social
[23:48] media work even family time like
[23:51] whatever it is that is preventing you
[23:52] from exercise let's just create a
[23:55] circuit break that says go outside and
[23:57] walk for 15 minutes yeah and after like
[24:00] a week of that you're like huh that's
[24:02] like seven straight days where I've
[24:03] walked for 15 minutes okay great could
[24:05] we make it 20 the next week 30 the next
[24:08] week well at some point it's actually
[24:10] going to become something that you've
[24:12] just accepted like I work around this
[24:13] because remember work expands to fill
[24:15] available time never forget that work
[24:18] expands to fill available time so don't
[24:20] ever act like I just need more time to
[24:22] go and do this thing no you got to do
[24:24] this thing and then the work has to fit
[24:25] around it wait say that again work
[24:27] expands to available time work expands
[24:29] to fill available time fill available
[24:31] time yeah wow that's really interesting
[24:34] yeah it's either that's either Peter's
[24:35] principal or Parkinson's principle I
[24:36] can't remember it's one of those two uh
[24:38] but it's it's a well-known principle
[24:40] right which is um if you give a person a
[24:43] task and give them six hours or give a
[24:44] person a task and give them four hours
[24:46] it's always going to take six hours or
[24:47] four hours there's no scenario by which
[24:50] work somehow gets compressed it will
[24:52] always it's like a gas it always fills
[24:54] the room it's in so that feels like the
[24:56] opposite of working out for me like if I
[24:59] have available time it's not filled with
[25:02] that's my point so you have to take you
[25:03] have to put the workout in it because
[25:05] it's just going to compress the amount
[25:06] of time you're working anyway so that
[25:08] that note actually hits me in a really
[25:10] interesting way
[25:11] of it's very hard for me to fill
[25:14] available time with anything else like I
[25:17] I am very committed to exercise that's
[25:19] something I've been committed to since I
[25:20] was I was I was young so that's like a
[25:23] non-negotiable for me but in any other
[25:26] time I'm basically constantly fill it
[25:30] with work MH and the thing that I
[25:32] struggle with with our work and being an
[25:34] entrepreneur is that there's an
[25:36] unlimited amount of work there there's
[25:39] always an opportunity I think it was one
[25:41] of our friends um erak who was who was
[25:43] there in January as well but he said um
[25:46] we're only capped by our willingness to
[25:49] work as entrepreneurs and YouTube
[25:51] creators right like as as YouTube
[25:53] creators this ever expanding environment
[25:55] of the internet where it's like we
[25:57] always could be doing
[25:59] something to progress our careers that's
[26:02] the thing I struggle with the most of
[26:04] like how do I set those boundaries
[26:08] around that thing because I'm just I
[26:10] just am the guy who wants to if I have a
[26:13] moment I'm gonna open up my laptop and
[26:15] go what can I progress right now yeah
[26:17] and and look I don't want to be the pot
[26:19] calling the kettle black because I'm an
[26:21] entrepreneur as well I'm like I said I
[26:24] kind of have like four or five different
[26:26] businesses I'm running yeah so there's
[26:28] never a minute when one of them is not
[26:31] in desperate need of my attention um but
[26:35] because I am completely and intimately
[26:37] aware of this principle that work
[26:39] expands to fill available time I just I
[26:42] know that that's exactly what's going to
[26:44] happen if I'm not deliberate so then
[26:47] what I have to say is what are my other
[26:49] priorities what are the things that I
[26:51] can't let slip and for me that list is
[26:55] different than what it might be for you
[26:56] or what it might be for you and that's
[26:58] okay
[26:58] but I know what my list is right so for
[27:00] me exercise can't slip time with my kids
[27:04] can't slip time with my wife can't
[27:06] slip um does it Flex at some points it
[27:10] does like the past week has been brutal
[27:13] the next two weeks are going to be
[27:14] brutal um it means I'm not going to you
[27:17] know I actually didn't have date night
[27:19] with my wife this week which is unusual
[27:21] we always have one night to go
[27:23] out um you know I only got to see one of
[27:26] my kids games or practices I'd like to
[27:28] see two you know like there are certain
[27:30] things that they got squeezed but I have
[27:33] a pretty clear sense during the week of
[27:35] what has to get done and those things
[27:37] are immovable because if they're not if
[27:39] I try to put them in after the fact
[27:41] they're not going to
[27:42] happen yeah so what is it so if I put
[27:45] those immovable objects in place then
[27:48] it's not the end of the world if a
[27:50] little extra work Creeps in right
[27:52] because I've already taken care of my
[27:54] foundational stuff so your found
[27:58] foundational stuff is going to change
[27:59] like you guys don't have kids yet when
[28:01] you have kids you will have more
[28:03] foundational things that are going to
[28:05] matter to you um someone listening to us
[28:08] might be single that's great so they
[28:10] have fewer foundational things they
[28:12] don't have a relationship they need to
[28:13] tend to um you know maybe at some point
[28:16] your parents are so old that you
[28:18] actually need to put time into taking
[28:20] care of your parents which is probably
[28:21] something the three of us don't have to
[28:22] do any of today so you see what I mean
[28:25] like you have to be somewhat malleable
[28:27] in this but the frame work is understand
[28:29] what the non-negotiables are and account
[28:32] for those first now then there's also
[28:34] strategies for how to do that I never
[28:36] exercise late in the day do you know why
[28:39] it's way too easy for me to kick it down
[28:41] the road if I if I if I say I'm going to
[28:44] do my workout from 4:00 to 6:00 p.m.
[28:47] there's always an overflow of a call
[28:49] that didn't quite get done there's
[28:50] always a chance that my kid is going to
[28:52] want to go and hit baseballs and
[28:54] honestly I'm going to be really
[28:55] struggling between do I want you know of
[28:56] course I want to go hit baseballs with
[28:58] but I got to work out okay what am I
[28:59] going to do but by throwing that for me
[29:02] throwing those workouts in the morning
[29:04] there's always a time when it's set to
[29:06] get done and you know shy of a
[29:08] ridiculous crisis it's going to get done
[29:11] and by ridiculous crisis I mean
[29:12] something that's only going to happen
[29:13] like once every six months like it's not
[29:15] this isn't like oh it's on the weekly
[29:17] I'm going to miss that sure um
[29:20] so you know having a standing date night
[29:23] with your wife where it's just it's on
[29:24] the calendar and it's like you're not
[29:26] you're not you know you're not going to
[29:27] break that reservation
[29:28] hours ah of time because you want to
[29:30] keep it's there it's already there it's
[29:33] planned I think that's actually
[29:34] extremely important is like the standing
[29:37] Frameworks I've noticed that with
[29:38] friendships that as you get older and as
[29:41] you're being an entrepreneur it's really
[29:43] easy to let friendships and social kind
[29:46] of get pushed to the side but if you
[29:48] create Frameworks where it's like every
[29:50] Wednesday morning we meet and do this
[29:51] workout class together and have
[29:52] breakfast after which I which I have
[29:54] with with two of my friends um you got
[29:56] to drag this friend with you yeah that's
[29:58] true good luck uh but it's even if we
[30:03] cancel it you have to take an action to
[30:04] cancel it rather than having it be
[30:07] standing right and you know the other
[30:09] thing I've been thinking about is we've
[30:10] been doing this career for 13 years
[30:11] together I think about the factors that
[30:14] we've been collaborating with in each of
[30:17] the chapters of our career like in our
[30:18] early 20s the biggest Factor was kind of
[30:21] this drive for
[30:22] validation uh from others from ourselves
[30:25] this like we wanted to make something
[30:27] out of ourselves and that's a
[30:28] collaborative factor in the early stages
[30:31] of this career of being YouTubers as you
[30:33] get older like now we're collaborating
[30:35] with the fact that we have wives and we
[30:36] want to spend time with our wives we're
[30:38] collaborating with um all these other
[30:41] factors and that'll change continue to
[30:42] change over time and that's the thing I
[30:44] have been thinking about quite a bit of
[30:46] you know obviously you study longevity
[30:51] and I thought about that coming into
[30:53] this conversation around like I want to
[30:55] do this career for a long time but I'm
[30:58] have to be very aware of the different
[30:59] factors that we are collaborating with
[31:03] if I want to do this for the next couple
[31:05] decades so I I was I wanted to get into
[31:07] that subject matter of longevity how you
[31:09] define that and then dive into some of
[31:12] the the factors of it and I assume you
[31:14] mean not physical longevity but career
[31:16] longevity I guess I I tie those two
[31:19] together I think like and you tell me if
[31:21] you do or don't but we had a
[31:23] conversation with an executive one time
[31:24] who called himself a work athlete and
[31:26] that was the first time I took a a step
[31:28] back and I was like oh my physical and
[31:30] mental health similar to an athlete are
[31:33] directly correlated to my success in my
[31:37] career as a
[31:38] Creator and so I I guess when I heard
[31:40] you talk about longevity I thought about
[31:43] that being directly correlated to my
[31:45] career longevity um yeah I I think about
[31:47] it as you know if I get up before one of
[31:50] these interviews I get up early I work
[31:52] out I eat right I will have a better
[31:54] interview I will also be happier when I
[31:57] get home with my partner like they're so
[31:59] tied together I'll work better with
[32:01] Samir because I feel better about myself
[32:04] yeah so I guess for me personally I take
[32:07] that part for granted because it's such
[32:09] a high priority regardless of what I'm
[32:11] doing in other words regardless of what
[32:14] my where I am in my career because I've
[32:16] had a lot of careers right so I've my my
[32:19] life has
[32:20] been a bizarre path that has made no
[32:23] sense like you know how they say like
[32:26] all the dots connect in retrospect yeah
[32:28] even in retrospect it's kind of hard to
[32:31] draw the dots I was actually listening
[32:32] to you on Rogan talk about like the
[32:34] mortgage crisis yeah and I was like wait
[32:37] what part of your career was that yeah
[32:39] we we I can tell you the story but my
[32:41] point is like independent of what I'm
[32:43] doing in my career or if I if I retired
[32:46] tomorrow the physical cognitive like the
[32:49] health part of my longevity would always
[32:50] be a high priority so I agree with you
[32:53] completely that like if a person needs
[32:56] any more motivation
[32:58] for taking care of themselves then the
[33:01] future which is I want to live as long
[33:04] as I can and be as healthy as I can the
[33:07] present should be motivation enough so
[33:09] what you're really saying is is there a
[33:11] performance benefit in the present from
[33:14] being healthy and the answer is
[33:15] unequivocally yes and to to the point of
[33:17] the person you interviewed um we we use
[33:20] the term athlete for life you need to be
[33:22] an athlete for life um so life is your
[33:24] sport so how do you train for life
[33:26] that's that's what we think about a lot
[33:27] and practice um I think the harder
[33:30] problem and maybe the one I think more
[33:33] about because I don't take this for
[33:34] granted is will I still be doing this in
[33:37] 10 years and if so what needs to be true
[33:41] with respect to my excitement level for
[33:43] it where because I get bored so easily
[33:48] um what what has to be true about what
[33:50] I'm doing for me to want to be doing
[33:52] this in 10 years um that's the question
[33:54] I think a lot about that's a great
[33:56] question a really good prompt yeah we I
[33:58] mean we even uh on a more micro level
[34:01] when we're talking with aspiring
[34:03] creators we'll often tell them like
[34:05] whatever the first version is of your
[34:07] Channel or your Endeavor make sure you
[34:09] really care about that Community or the
[34:12] value that you're providing and the way
[34:14] that you're doing it your process of
[34:16] course your process can improve but if
[34:18] what you're doing works if you find a
[34:20] way that it works and it succeeds
[34:21] whatever that process is whatever that
[34:23] community that you're providing value to
[34:25] if you want longevity you're going to be
[34:26] doing some version of that that looks
[34:28] very similar in 10 years right y it's a
[34:31] very similar type of thing C can you
[34:34] define uh I really liked this the first
[34:36] thing I wrote down from from talking to
[34:38] you was the difference between lifespan
[34:39] and health span and I really liked that
[34:43] distinction can you define those two
[34:44] terms yeah lifespan is the easier of the
[34:47] two to understand it's the it's the how
[34:49] long you live so it's it's binary right
[34:51] it's it's uh uh you're alive or you're
[34:53] dead um like so that's kind of call it
[34:56] death certificate death right
[34:58] um Health span is a little harder to
[35:00] Define um but it I mean there's a
[35:03] medical definition to it which is sort
[35:05] of not that helpful which is the the
[35:06] period of time in which you are free of
[35:08] disability and disease but I I think a a
[35:10] better definition is is really just
[35:12] around the quality of your physical life
[35:15] your cognitive life your emotional life
[35:17] I think those are kind of the three
[35:18] pillars to it now two of those decline
[35:22] inevitably with age the physical and
[35:24] cognitive peace decline with age uh the
[35:26] emotional peace does not it's not it
[35:28] doesn't have to I mean it can but it
[35:30] doesn't need to so so you have these two
[35:32] pieces that are uh linked to biology and
[35:36] that invariably go down and then you
[35:38] have one that is not as linked to
[35:40] biology uh and and at least not Linked
[35:43] In A declining way and doesn't have to
[35:45] go down and and honestly if you play
[35:46] your cards right I think can go up so um
[35:50] and that's not binary right that's
[35:52] that's that's analog as opposed to
[35:54] digital um and it's also very malleable
[35:58] right there's a lot that we have control
[36:01] over there uh with respect to that more
[36:04] more so than on the lifespan side by the
[36:06] way we still have a lot of control in
[36:07] the lifespan side more more than people
[36:09] realize so genes play a very important
[36:11] role in extreme lifespan when you talk
[36:15] about people who live to 90 or 100 a lot
[36:18] of that is genetic um but for most of us
[36:22] even if we're not bestowed with ultra
[36:25] longevity genes we can still do a lot to
[36:29] reduce the risk of dying you know before
[36:32] the age of 80 or something like that I I
[36:35] thought about that and whether or not
[36:37] this is how it's meant to be thought of
[36:39] because we think about our career quite
[36:40] a bit I I was writing in my journal
[36:42] after we we talked about okay there's
[36:45] one version of this of how long can we
[36:47] have this channel last like how long can
[36:50] this format this content that we're
[36:52] creating last and then that's like the
[36:54] lifespan version of our Channel and then
[36:57] Health span version is and how long will
[36:59] I enjoy doing it yeah is kind of how I
[37:02] thought about it or another way to think
[37:03] of it is how because it's not directly
[37:06] tied to but it is quite correlated to
[37:09] the first point is how long will it
[37:11] continue to provide incredible value to
[37:13] the
[37:15] listeners that's that's good yeah I
[37:18] think that's like uh that's a really
[37:20] important one and how you stay on that
[37:24] track um without fear I think fear
[37:27] Creeps in quite a bit in this career
[37:29] very quickly fear of death of the
[37:31] channel right like so you you start is
[37:33] it fear of death of the channel or is it
[37:35] fear of decline of the
[37:37] product I mean and again those are
[37:39] linked what's the what's which one's
[37:42] actually coming first isn't isn't the
[37:44] death of the channel just a consequence
[37:46] of something else going wrong yeah yeah
[37:50] I think it's fear of decline of the
[37:51] product but I and I think a lot of that
[37:53] has um a lot of it is linked to process
[37:58] of creating the product and so I I think
[38:01] about that quite a bit of like the
[38:02] question you asked of like what has to
[38:04] be true if I want to be doing this in 10
[38:06] years you know one one thing that has
[38:08] been true about the last the last 10
[38:12] years is a lot of the job is a um
[38:17] relatively sedentary job meaning like we
[38:19] are sitting and working long hours on
[38:22] either editing um or working on
[38:26] pre-production
[38:27] uh traveling like it's a very hard job
[38:30] or at least we've experienced it to date
[38:33] um for a lot of creators to sink into a
[38:35] healthy routine because sometimes when
[38:39] you're experiencing like a creative
[38:40] moment that's going to take you late
[38:42] into the night and impact your sleep
[38:44] that's going to then you know turn into
[38:46] a morning where you're not going to work
[38:48] out that's going to turn into the next
[38:49] day where you have to meet this deadline
[38:51] and you're going to sit all day and edit
[38:53] and so that that is some of the stuff
[38:55] that I look at and I think as like our
[38:57] fellow creators would be interested in
[38:59] like how long can we do that how long
[39:02] can we make some of those trades and are
[39:05] should those happen in Sprints or how do
[39:08] we think about that as
[39:11] creatives well you know I mean I think
[39:14] it's all relative and I and I and I
[39:15] suppose that
[39:18] um the the younger you are the more you
[39:21] can get away with like I when I did my
[39:23] residency in surgery that was age
[39:29] 208 to 33 so from ages 28 to 33 I made
[39:35] you know enormous sacrifices to my
[39:37] health primarily through how little I
[39:40] slept and it wasn't by choice obviously
[39:42] it was like I didn't have a choice you
[39:44] were going to
[39:45] sleep I probably
[39:47] averaged 30 hours of sleep a week for
[39:50] five years so it's hard to be healthy
[39:53] when that's going on um wasn't eating
[39:56] well you know you're sort
[39:58] drinking inures at the nurses station
[40:00] eating whatever crap they have at the
[40:03] hospital um the one thing I made room
[40:05] for was exercise because that was just
[40:07] still something I was going to have to
[40:08] do regardless um but but many things in
[40:11] my life got compromised now you know
[40:14] once I was done with that I was able to
[40:16] sort of you know get get you know get
[40:19] get my life back together um but could I
[40:23] do that again today definitely not I I I
[40:26] couldn't make that s sacrifice again if
[40:28] I had to um it you know 20 years later
[40:31] that's just not something I could do
[40:35] so I I I do worry a little bit about the
[40:39] idea that we're g to just do this for
[40:41] now just do this for now just do this
[40:43] for now because that's a very slippery
[40:46] slope and you can blink your eyes and
[40:48] wake up tomorrow and you're it's 10
[40:50] years from now and you're still doing
[40:52] the same thing and I meet a lot of
[40:55] people who have traded their health for
[40:58] wealth and when they realize it it's a
[41:01] little too late to buy it back and
[41:03] obviously at some point you can't right
[41:05] at some point you know take an extreme
[41:07] example right if you take a person in
[41:08] the final decade of their life who's got
[41:11] all the money in the world and all the
[41:13] success and all the recognition and
[41:15] every Accolade you could have it doesn't
[41:18] really serve you that well when your
[41:19] health is gone so I know that's not the
[41:22] same as saying look someone who's in
[41:24] their 20s is doing a couple of all night
[41:26] Sprints to get content done so I'm not
[41:29] suggesting that one shouldn't do that if
[41:30] that's what's necessary but I'm
[41:32] suggesting that people take a step back
[41:34] and ask to what
[41:36] end what what what where is this
[41:38] actually going like is this really
[41:40] something I can convince myself as just
[41:42] something I got to do a couple times a
[41:44] year or is this very quickly going to
[41:46] become something I'm doing every week
[41:48] and if I'm doing it every week I really
[41:49] have to question some of the assumptions
[41:51] here why is this happening like why do I
[41:55] re am I understaffed do I not have
[41:57] enough people on my team am I not good
[42:00] at
[42:01] planning what there there has to be a
[42:03] reason that I'm staying I'm pulling two
[42:05] allnighters a week to get content done
[42:08] and and I and I would kind of dig into
[42:10] the process of why that's happening and
[42:13] what's solvable what resource can I put
[42:14] after this because our most precious
[42:18] resource is time not
[42:19] money time is everything um money is
[42:24] fungible time is not h
[42:27] so if someone's listening right now and
[42:29] they're you know the version of myself
[42:31] in my 20s which is basically editing
[42:34] very late into the night eating pretzels
[42:36] and chips and not working out and you
[42:39] know going out on the weekend sometimes
[42:41] but really not taking anything seriously
[42:43] when it comes to sleep nutrition
[42:45] exercise how do you rank those three
[42:48] sleep nutrition exercise if someone's
[42:50] going all right now I'm going to start
[42:51] to get
[42:52] serious how do you look at those three
[42:56] well the I mean honestly all of those
[42:58] things really matter for cognitive work
[43:01] and that's what you guys do right like
[43:04] you guys aren't getting paid for how
[43:07] strong you are how fast you can run how
[43:09] high you can jump like that's not what's
[43:11] paying you you're being paid for the
[43:13] quality of your cognitive processes
[43:16] these are creative processes uh but
[43:18] they're you know they're also uh
[43:21] processes of of problem solving and
[43:23] other things that go beyond just
[43:25] creativity but the point is the the
[43:27] brain has to be sort of well fueled so
[43:29] what do we know about this well we know
[43:30] that sleep deprivation right if you take
[43:32] a person and you sleep them six hours a
[43:34] night instead of eight hours a night
[43:36] chronically you know that's the
[43:38] equivalent of being legally
[43:41] drunk now you might say well that's okay
[43:43] because I work really well when I'm
[43:44] drunk but I think people would argue
[43:46] they probably don't right you're
[43:48] probably taking a hit to the quality of
[43:51] your work um if you have a blood alcohol
[43:54] above 008 again that doesn't mean like
[43:56] you're hammered and you're
[43:58] but it means that you are not at your
[44:01] best um now the good news is when you're
[44:05] 25 you're still at the peak of your
[44:08] what's called fluid
[44:09] intelligence right so you have you're
[44:11] you're peaking in fluid intelligence so
[44:14] you know memory processing speed all of
[44:17] those things so you might not take that
[44:19] much of a hit of course when you're my
[44:21] age you will because I'm long past the
[44:23] peak of my fluid intelligence I'm now
[44:25] climbing this second peak of crystal
[44:27] ized intelligence which is more judgment
[44:29] experiential
[44:30] based um so for me like not sleeping is
[44:35] a non-starter it just like it does it
[44:38] literally doesn't matter how bad the
[44:40] world is crumbling around me I am not
[44:43] going to let myself have two consecutive
[44:46] nights of six hours of sleep it does
[44:48] happen on the occasional night you know
[44:50] I've got a 4 a.m. flight or I mean a
[44:51] 4:00 a.m. departure for the airport for
[44:53] a 6 a.m. flight and I can't get to bed
[44:55] before you know 10 o'clock yep I'm gonna
[44:58] only be sleeping five and a half hours
[44:59] that night and it sucks looking at him
[45:01] because we have a 400 am. departure to
[45:03] the airport tomorrow morning yeah I had
[45:04] one yesterday so so it's like I get it
[45:07] um but that's not going to happen two
[45:08] nights in a row no way the price I will
[45:11] pay for that in terms of my quality of
[45:13] work is totally unacceptable and and
[45:16] let's be clear like I get paid for my
[45:19] brain no one pays me for how good I look
[45:21] or how bad I look no one pays me for how
[45:23] much I can dead hang or how many kettle
[45:25] bell swings I like nobody cares about
[45:27] any of that stuff every dollar I get
[45:31] paid is because of what's between my
[45:32] ears there's no chance I'm compromising
[45:35] that so that comes down to how much
[45:38] alcohol am I going to let myself drink
[45:40] how do I manage sleep how do I manage
[45:42] nutrition how do I exercise I mean
[45:44] exercise and sleep are probably the two
[45:47] greatest nutrients for the
[45:50] brain so can't I just can't sacrifice
[45:53] those so so I think even if you come at
[45:55] this through the lens of perform perance
[45:58] forget longevity who cares right when
[46:00] you're 25 what could you possibly care
[46:02] about that is 60 years away you don't
[46:05] and I wouldn't ask you to it's too
[46:06] abstract but if you think about it
[46:08] through the lens of
[46:10] performance it's to me that's that's
[46:12] reason
[46:13] enough that yeah I mean I think that
[46:16] that gets increasingly harder at least
[46:18] for for me when we go on these like long
[46:21] trips you know or or travel yeah a lot
[46:24] of that gets challenging and I'm curious
[46:26] about just just with sleep being a
[46:28] non-negotiable do is it okay to you
[46:31] utilize sleep supplements uh especially
[46:35] when I travel like it's harder for me in
[46:36] a new environment first night to to go
[46:38] to bed yeah I I mean I I think it it
[46:41] absolutely is I mean I us sleep I use
[46:43] things to facilitate sleep when I'm at
[46:45] home in my own bed like yeah I'm using
[46:47] an eight sleep uh I should disclose I'm
[46:49] an an adviser to eight sleep so people
[46:51] know that I have a conflict um but you
[46:53] know very very concerned with
[46:54] temperature um I used tons of not tons
[46:58] three or four supplements that Aid with
[46:59] sleep when I'm traveling um long
[47:01] distances so not in the US but if I'm
[47:03] off in Europe or I'm in the Middle East
[47:04] or wherever I am absolutely following a
[47:07] jet lag protocol um to make sure my
[47:10] sleep is not disrupted where I'm adding
[47:11] more things to my mix um and so yes I've
[47:15] got this down to like a formulaic
[47:16] science around managing sleep um you
[47:20] know little things like I make sure
[47:21] every gym I stay at even if I have to
[47:23] spend a little bit more or drive a
[47:24] little bit further it's got a good gym
[47:27] got it um and by the way if I'm at a gym
[47:29] like if I'm at a weird hotel that
[47:31] doesn't have a gym make sure it's tall
[47:32] enough that it's got steps that I can
[47:34] run up and down the steps for a workout
[47:35] like it's little things like that that
[47:37] you might think ah who wants to do all
[47:39] that well I don't know do you want to
[47:41] perform or not right like at some at
[47:43] some level you know people have to
[47:45] accept the fact that nothing you're
[47:47] accomplishing is happening by accident
[47:50] like you're very deliberate about your
[47:52] work right you are there's there's
[47:54] nothing you're doing that's just well
[47:56] we'll just kind let this not no yeah you
[47:58] you do you everything you're doing
[48:00] everything that anyone who's listening
[48:01] us is doing with the spect of the work
[48:02] is incredibly deliberate so you have to
[48:05] be deliberate about these other factors
[48:06] as well they don't happen by accident
[48:09] right you have to have the right food
[48:11] environment you have to travel with the
[48:12] right snacks you have to make the right
[48:14] amount of time to get a meal if that's
[48:16] something you're going to prioritize um
[48:19] you know picking the right Hotel takes
[48:20] more time get it but that's that's being
[48:23] deliberate like you would never shoot a
[48:25] video and just it without editing it but
[48:28] that's what many people are doing in
[48:30] their lives so why are if you did that
[48:33] your videos would suck so why is it that
[48:35] people are surprised that if they put no
[48:38] thought into you know how they plan
[48:40] meals and exercise and sleep that those
[48:42] things suck of course they're gonna suck
[48:45] so this is directly correlated we got
[48:46] some questions from creators that I want
[48:48] to uh play for you throughout this
[48:49] conversation um but this is this is
[48:51] pretty correlated to this question from
[48:53] uh Drew hey Peter my name is Drew binsky
[48:56] I am a travel content creator and always
[48:58] on the move and I had a question about
[49:00] burnouts so the last three trips I've
[49:01] taken in Iran China and India I've come
[49:04] home super sick and I am one to push
[49:06] myself to the limits but it's been too
[49:08] much and I usually never get sick so I
[49:10] was wondering what can I do to fix that
[49:12] is it sleep I've been averaging 4 to 5
[49:14] hours a night uh is it taking more
[49:16] vitamin supplements is it working out in
[49:18] the hotel rooms is it taking a break
[49:20] what kind of things can I do to make
[49:21] sure that I come home feeling excited
[49:23] and energetic and just not sick thank
[49:26] you so much for all you
[49:27] do so I would say just listening to what
[49:30] he said probably the sleep is the best
[49:32] explanation if you're uh if you're at
[49:34] four to five hours a night your immune
[49:36] system is basically shutting down um and
[49:39] so it's not at all surprising that that
[49:41] he's going to come home and um his his
[49:45] body is just going to kind of collapse
[49:46] the other thing that's actually going on
[49:47] there um is he his his um without
[49:52] getting too medical jargony his
[49:54] glucocorticoids are really ramping up to
[49:57] support the stress that he's under what
[49:59] was that word yeah so glucocorticoids
[50:01] are um the stress hormones that help us
[50:04] cope with chronic stress so cortisol
[50:08] you've probably heard of cortisol so
[50:09] that's that's kind of like the the the
[50:11] the most important of these hormones and
[50:13] so these hormones are really important
[50:15] when we're under chronic stress even
[50:17] acute stress but especially into this
[50:19] chronic stress where they continue to
[50:21] put more glucose into our circulation to
[50:23] keep our brain functioning um they ramp
[50:26] up other stress hormones like uh
[50:28] adrenaline and
[50:30] noradrenaline and what happens a lot of
[50:32] times is someone comes back from a
[50:34] situation like that and maybe you guys
[50:36] have experienced this and they just
[50:39] completely get sick right yeah and I
[50:42] think a lot of things are happening one
[50:43] is the immune issue that I mentioned
[50:45] with respect to sleep catches up with
[50:46] them but I think the other thing is
[50:48] their endocrine system sort of
[50:50] downregulates very acutely because it
[50:52] finally gets to turn itself off so this
[50:53] is a system that's only meant to be on
[50:55] for short periods of time time and then
[50:57] let's just say he's talking about like a
[50:59] 7-Day Whirlwind tour he's just had it on
[51:02] for seven straight days so the minute he
[51:04] comes home it's like okay finally I can
[51:06] shut this off and it shuts it off but it
[51:09] overcorrects and so now he's got none of
[51:12] these glucocorticoids he's got no energy
[51:14] his immune systems shut down so again
[51:17] what would I say to somebody like that
[51:19] well honestly he's no different than the
[51:21] CEO who's flying around you know the CEO
[51:24] of the Fortune 50 company who's flying
[51:26] who's got to do like the 10 City tour in
[51:28] seven days and honestly what I say to
[51:30] them is you got to make a trade-off do
[51:33] fewer cities or spend more time on the
[51:35] road so that you're not as rushed as you
[51:38] are like those are the only two ways to
[51:40] make this happen right so you can either
[51:42] say fine I'm I'm GNA instead in seven
[51:45] days instead of doing 10 visits I'm
[51:47] going to do six and I have a little bit
[51:49] more time each day but if he says no I I
[51:52] can't do that I have to do all 10 then I
[51:53] said then make it 10 days but he's like
[51:55] oh I can't be away from my family for
[51:56] that long
[51:57] like yeah I didn't say this was going to
[51:59] be easy I'm just telling you those are
[52:00] your choices right what about in terms
[52:04] of recovery because we're we're not
[52:05] going to China and the places that that
[52:07] Drew is going but you know we were in
[52:09] Dallas last week we're going to New York
[52:11] tomorrow and inevitably when we get back
[52:13] there is that like it's always three
[52:16] days of just lower energy kind of a
[52:18] slump trying to get back in the habit of
[52:20] working out what can we do in terms of
[52:23] recovery even if we do do a good job
[52:25] right of like space faing things out
[52:27] getting our sleep what can we do when we
[52:29] get back in terms of recovery um I mean
[52:32] I I think you just have to I think
[52:34] you'll generally if you really
[52:35] scrutinize what's going on the fact that
[52:37] it's taking you three days to get back
[52:39] tells me something's not fully optimiz
[52:41] he said we but he meant I just just so
[52:43] you know that's not me that's him all
[52:45] right two days for two days for you okay
[52:47] so I would I mean I would push I would
[52:48] push on that and try to understand
[52:49] what's really happening when you're in
[52:51] New York because it shouldn't take two
[52:53] days for you to recover if you're doing
[52:57] everything right so my guess is if you
[52:59] are scrutinizing it you might not be
[53:00] sleeping that well if if you think you
[53:02] are um you're maybe timing your flights
[53:06] not well um I know that obviously you're
[53:08] going to have to leave super early in
[53:09] the morning so it's like so the question
[53:11] is are you able to go to bed early
[53:12] enough tonight that that's not going to
[53:14] be disruptive and by the way it's great
[53:16] that you're going to bed at or getting
[53:18] up at 4: because you're getting up at 7
[53:19] New York time so that's great but you
[53:22] have to go to bed tonight at New York
[53:24] time so if you'd go to bed at 11:00 New
[53:27] York time it means you actually have to
[53:28] go to bed at 8:00 tonight well that's
[53:31] not easy to do if you woke up at 8:00
[53:34] this morning sure so you you know you
[53:35] almost have to start the planning a day
[53:37] before and that's something I typically
[53:39] do for I don't you know for me going to
[53:41] New York is only a two-hour time zone so
[53:42] it's not bigal but if I'm going to
[53:44] Europe my planning for that trip starts
[53:46] a day before it's the full day before
[53:49] what time do I go to bed what time do I
[53:51] wake up how do I use my workout as a way
[53:53] to exhaust me even more and then of
[53:55] course what supplements am I using to to
[53:56] help me sleep on the plane so that I can
[53:58] get into the Europe time zone the second
[54:01] I leave the US okay so you you brought
[54:03] up this um notion of like I mean all of
[54:06] us sitting here get paid for our brain
[54:08] and I think that's a lot of creatives
[54:10] and a actually it's like a lot of people
[54:12] who work basically yeah that that's your
[54:14] income driver that's right um there's a
[54:16] question from uh our friend Eric that I
[54:19] want to bring up here all right this is
[54:21] a second take in case you decide to use
[54:22] this that's more concise Peter big fan
[54:26] uh question for you in the Creator
[54:28] business you can replace yourself in a
[54:30] lot of ways but the the main thing you
[54:32] can replace yourself with is creative
[54:34] it's the thing that gets every Creator
[54:36] where they are uh and it all comes down
[54:38] to you at the end of the
[54:40] day currently I basically get creative
[54:43] in completely random spurts which I
[54:45] think a lot of people could relate to
[54:47] and I'm wondering if you have any ideas
[54:50] thoughts or science on how to optimize
[54:52] creativity or to get into a creative
[54:55] space uh uh on command thank you big
[55:00] fed I am not sure about getting into a
[55:03] creative space on demand but I do think
[55:06] that there is a pretty decent body of
[55:08] literature on creativity that suggests
[55:10] you have to create room for it so uh I
[55:14] don't know if you guys have read Ryan
[55:16] holidays book Stillness is the key yep I
[55:18] love Ryan yeah so uh I and I would put
[55:21] Stillness as one of the 10 most
[55:23] important books that I've read right so
[55:25] I love I mean I read a lot um but but if
[55:29] you forced me to say like what are the
[55:30] 10 most important books that have kind
[55:32] of shaped how you think about the world
[55:34] and think about life I I would put
[55:36] Stillness on that list of 10 I believe
[55:39] and so so what you learn in there is as
[55:42] painful as it is we have to get
[55:45] comfortable with Stillness to to sort of
[55:49] come up with really good ideas and it's
[55:52] very difficult to hit those things on
[55:54] demand um and you know there there's no
[55:57] shortage of stories of like some of the
[55:59] greatest works of creativity coming out
[56:02] of years of frustration and toiling and
[56:06] doing seemingly nothing so my intuition
[56:10] as someone again who is not an expert on
[56:12] this and truthfully someone who doesn't
[56:14] consider himself very creative I mean
[56:16] probably I am for my field I'm creative
[56:19] I don't think I'm creative compared to
[56:21] to you and your audience um but I know
[56:25] that some of my greatest
[56:27] ideas uh generally come to me when I'm
[56:29] doing
[56:31] nothing yeah making space for boredom is
[56:33] so hard right now yeah when you say
[56:35] nothing what do you mean what does that
[56:37] look
[56:39] like so it means uh so I like to Ruck
[56:43] right so you take uh you know you put a
[56:45] heavy backpack on like a backpack with
[56:47] weights and go for a walk that's nothing
[56:51] well it's nothing in that I don't have
[56:52] anything stimulating me right like I
[56:54] don't have my phone with me I'm not
[56:56] listening to a podcast like I'm such an
[56:58] information addict that it's very
[57:02] difficult for me to do things without
[57:04] also multitasking and bringing in
[57:06] information so you know I'm riding my
[57:08] bike on a stationary trainer three or
[57:10] four days a week well I'm always
[57:11] listening to an audio book or a podcast
[57:14] um so I just kind of make the rucking
[57:16] the exception which is I'm gonna go do
[57:18] this thing and I'm not going to listen
[57:19] to music I'm not going to listen to a
[57:20] podcast I'm not g I'm not going to be on
[57:22] a phone call I'm just going to walk and
[57:26] the only thing I can pretty much hear is
[57:27] my heavy breathing with this weight on
[57:30] my back
[57:32] um sitting in the sauna same sort of
[57:35] thing just sort of sitting there um
[57:37] another opportunity of kind of not doing
[57:40] much
[57:42] um sometimes it's just if I'm on a plane
[57:45] disciplining myself to close my laptop
[57:48] and just maybe listen to music which
[57:50] again doesn't seem like a bad thing to
[57:52] do but for me seems like oh my God like
[57:55] I'm not working I'm not working I'm not
[57:56] working you know this is such an
[57:58] important window of time in which I
[57:59] could be getting work done but if I'm
[58:01] feeling really tired and by the way
[58:03] another sign for me that I'm
[58:05] really um working too hard is when I
[58:09] have a lot of task switching going on
[58:11] I'm sure you guys can relate to this
[58:13] right so I've got I've got Chrome open
[58:15] I've got email open I've got WhatsApp
[58:18] open I've got iMessage open and I've got
[58:21] a spreadsheet that I'm building a model
[58:23] in and I've got a word dock that I'm
[58:24] writing a memo in and when I can't stop
[58:27] task switching I'm like shut this
[58:29] goddamn thing down it's broken you're
[58:32] not you're not thinking anymore if
[58:34] you're if you cannot stop going back and
[58:36] forth and I get these dumb thoughts like
[58:38] oh my God I got to go read about the
[58:39] latest like I got to read the latest
[58:41] blog on F1 let me just go read that
[58:42] really quick okay yeah yeah okay that's
[58:44] really good okay let me go back to
[58:45] writing this letter yeah yeah yeah oh
[58:46] gosh you know what I I want to look up
[58:48] this on Wikipedia like I I want to
[58:49] really understand like I find myself
[58:51] there a lot which is strange because
[58:53] historically I'm actually really good at
[58:54] focusing yeah like always in college in
[58:57] high school and our career and that's
[58:58] why I've always edited because I can
[59:00] lock in and I can sit there but in the
[59:03] last year or so I find myself in that
[59:05] position so often yeah and same with me
[59:07] like I think I
[59:08] I if Focus was an Olympic sport I would
[59:11] have been the Michael Phelps of it um I
[59:14] would not yeah no I'm I am I consider
[59:17] myself that way too like I can I could
[59:19] go to the library in college and just
[59:21] lock in wow yeah so when I'm not yeah
[59:24] that's a sign shut it down shut it all
[59:26] down cuz you're not getting any work
[59:28] done at that point down like what do you
[59:30] do nothing sit there and suffer sit
[59:33] there and suffer in silence got it yep
[59:37] and let it all work itself out I mean
[59:39] but you're not being productive you just
[59:40] have to accept the fact when you were
[59:42] task switching between eight things you
[59:44] were getting nothing done of any
[59:46] substance so why waste any more time go
[59:49] through the purge and then come
[59:51] back that's scary it's scary to do that
[59:54] because you feel like it's uh the thing
[59:56] that'll make you feel better is getting
[59:58] something done you know like I know that
[59:59] experience so intimately um but I I I
[60:04] like I also know what it feels like in
[60:05] my body to be there and it's a terrible
[60:07] feeling so that that that's a good well
[60:10] again I mean this is just a great
[60:12] example Michael Easter has written about
[60:14] this a lot like going back to Evolution
[60:16] like do you know how much Evolution made
[60:19] boredom
[60:21] painful think about it like do you think
[60:24] natural selection wanted you just
[60:26] sitting around twiddling your thumbs
[60:28] looking at the
[60:29] stars I mean no way you were going to
[60:32] get eaten you were not going to find a
[60:34] mate and you were not going to find
[60:36] food you had to be thinking about like
[60:40] okay where do I need to go what do I
[60:41] need to so boredom is again we are very
[60:45] selected for boredom to
[60:47] hurt the the the members of our species
[60:50] who liked being bored got eaten or
[60:53] didn't pass their jeans on that's why
[60:56] not here right same same with the
[60:58] negativity bias the people who didn't
[61:00] have negativity bias they got kicked out
[61:02] of the tribe they died we don't have
[61:04] their genes anymore I mean natural
[61:06] selection is a remarkable honing tool
[61:09] yeah but again it's an example of how um
[61:13] you know it's a two-edged sword it is
[61:16] good I think that boredom hurts because
[61:18] it drives us to do things it drives us
[61:20] to be Innovative um it's just that in
[61:23] the
[61:24] last probably the last 15 years we may
[61:28] have flipped over in a world where
[61:30] there's so much stimulation that our
[61:34] ability to uh to dissuade boredom has
[61:37] become actually
[61:39] counterproductive when it comes to
[61:41] boredom in your career I want to go back
[61:43] to that question that you were asking
[61:46] yourself about like what does my career
[61:47] have to look like so that in 10 years
[61:50] I'm not bored by it do you have an
[61:51] answer to that
[61:56] yeah I mean I think it depends which of
[61:57] my careers because again there's like I
[61:59] have all of these different careers if
[62:01] you're talking about in the content side
[62:03] of things yeah yeah it I still have to
[62:06] absolutely love um you know get get joy
[62:11] out of the Curiosity that comes from you
[62:13] know because what the content I create
[62:15] is is about interviewing people right
[62:18] and um and the reason I started the
[62:21] podcast which has been six uh yeah it's
[62:24] probably been a little over six years
[62:25] years ago was I just realized like I
[62:28] keep having these conversations with
[62:30] scientists and they're so fascinating
[62:33] and at the end of the conversation I
[62:34] always think to myself oh I wish others
[62:35] could have heard that um so then I you
[62:38] know so it's like well this is what I
[62:39] want to do right I want to talk about
[62:41] science without dumbing it down but
[62:43] making it accessible to everybody and if
[62:46] that stops being enjoyable to me then I
[62:49] have nothing to do in that regard and
[62:51] and I would be okay saying well then
[62:52] this is not what I'm going to do um if
[62:54] if not communicating science uh and and
[62:57] and Medicine you know doesn't get me
[63:00] excited Then I then I shouldn't do it
[63:02] the thing I really appreciate about your
[63:03] model and I actually have been thinking
[63:05] about this a lot is that it's not an
[63:07] addback model which then you know for us
[63:10] we're an addback model right which means
[63:12] which is most podcasts almost everyone
[63:14] which then means performance of episodes
[63:16] is at the is at the height and that can
[63:19] sometimes be um at odds with like
[63:22] enjoyment of conversation yep not always
[63:25] rarely right now but as I look on a 10e
[63:28] window what I recognized like my answer
[63:30] to that question is I
[63:32] think in when I look at this of enjoying
[63:34] this in 10 years means that I don't have
[63:37] immense performance pressure I have
[63:40] pressure to provide value to the
[63:42] audience but not as much pressure in
[63:45] explosive viewership or listenership and
[63:49] I think the membership model that you
[63:50] have is actually something that I look
[63:53] at I'm very inspired by of where I want
[63:54] to get to so that that is not a factor
[63:58] in the future for us yeah I
[64:01] am really grateful when we decided in
[64:05] 2019 that hey okay we've done this for
[64:07] you know six months people seem to
[64:09] really like it you know I got to I got
[64:11] to cover my cost here like I'm you know
[64:14] both my opportunity cost and my actual
[64:15] cost um and you're right I think at the
[64:17] time there was only one other person I
[64:20] knew that wasn't doing an ad-based model
[64:23] um which was Sam Harris yeah and you
[64:26] know Sam and I are very close friends we
[64:27] talked about it a bunch and it was just
[64:28] kind of a no-brainer I I actually never
[64:30] really entertained doing ads um no
[64:33] offense I just I struggle with with
[64:35] podcast advertising models because I
[64:37] don't I don't find them genuine right
[64:38] like at least when you're watching TV
[64:40] the ad is coming from the company that
[64:42] is selling something so it's like okay
[64:45] like you want to buy a Coke like Coke
[64:47] has made the ad that is trying to get me
[64:48] to buy coke I always find it funny when
[64:50] the podcast person is reading the ad as
[64:53] though they love Coke which is like
[64:54] really do you really love Coke or they
[64:56] just paying you to say that you love
[64:57] Coke like it doesn't make any sense to
[64:58] me um also for what I do I just think
[65:01] there's a credibility
[65:04] of which is different for most most
[65:06] people in their podcast it's not a hit
[65:07] to their credibility to sell an ad I
[65:09] think in what I do it would be very
[65:11] destructive to my credibility um but
[65:13] you're absolutely right it means that I
[65:15] focus all of my energy
[65:17] on like curiosity and and and relevance
[65:20] and and how do I how do I make something
[65:22] that's great so if you look like I'm not
[65:24] trying to interview famous people right
[65:27] which is that's how you if you want if
[65:29] you want to interview famous people like
[65:30] that's how you're going to kind of grow
[65:32] but but the truth of it is the most
[65:34] interesting people in my world are not
[65:37] famous right like the I mean even people
[65:40] who have won Nobel prizes they're not
[65:42] famous outside of their scientific
[65:44] community so um I like the idea that I
[65:48] get to interview people who you will
[65:50] otherwise never figure out who they are
[65:52] and for two or three hours I want to
[65:55] expose The Listener to as much of their
[65:57] world as possible and and how it
[65:59] pertains to you know the future of of
[66:01] our health yeah what has it been like to
[66:05] essentially become famous within your
[66:07] field because I would imagine you are
[66:09] essentially especially within the world
[66:10] of medicine and Longevity famous how has
[66:14] that felt to you yeah I you know I don't
[66:17] I don't really perceive it to be
[66:18] completely honest with you um and I'm
[66:20] not
[66:22] sure um I mean I'm not disagreeing with
[66:25] you although I think if you had said
[66:26] this a year ago I would have been like I
[66:27] don't really know but I mean yeah I I I
[66:30] guess to some extent it is um I think I
[66:32] would describe it as micr Fame like it's
[66:34] not fame fame right like I know what
[66:36] fame fame is because I I I I see it all
[66:38] the time and I I have many friends who
[66:40] are legit famous where you know they
[66:42] can't go anywhere um for me it's
[66:45] like three or four times a day someone
[66:48] will come up to me you know in a
[66:50] restaurant or an airport and say thank
[66:52] you so much for your work I really love
[66:53] it can I get a selfie and honestly at
[66:56] that level it's just it's an honor it's
[66:58] not an inconvenience it it
[67:00] feels uh it feels great that and people
[67:03] always say basically the same thing
[67:04] which is they're thanking me which is I
[67:06] think uh means a lot to me so it's it's
[67:08] it's a it's a huge honor that that
[67:10] people say that kind of stuff yeah
[67:11] they're there for Value it's like thank
[67:13] you for Value not like they're like
[67:15] thank you for the work you're doing look
[67:17] how hot petera is let me take a selfie
[67:18] with EXA it's exactly right which might
[67:21] happen too don't discount that it's
[67:22] never happened but I put ourselves in a
[67:24] similar boat of when people come up it's
[67:26] generally like hey thanks for that show
[67:29] yeah I want to ask you about just like
[67:31] the you know I I think when I was
[67:34] younger being an entrepreneur was
[67:36] very um appealing because my father's an
[67:39] entrepreneur and it got even
[67:42] increasingly more appealing during the
[67:45] internet age when we saw movies like The
[67:47] Social Network and saw like Marx
[67:49] Zuckerberg a young kid able to create
[67:51] something you know and so like being an
[67:52] entrepreneur became very very um sexy
[67:56] and I'm looking at my dad in his 70s
[68:00] now and I'm noticing I'm very aware of
[68:04] the uh amount of stress he's endured
[68:08] through his whole life uh it's kind of
[68:10] his Natural State on a day-to-day is
[68:13] that he wakes up and kind of requires a
[68:15] problem to
[68:16] solve he really can't like even in now
[68:19] in in the space where he doesn't need to
[68:20] solve a problem he creates problems to
[68:23] solve because that's his Natural State
[68:25] and I'm curious about as I'm looking at
[68:27] myself I I feel very much like that too
[68:30] and I'm curious about the impact of
[68:32] chronic stress over long periods of time
[68:35] as an
[68:36] entrepreneur what does that where does
[68:38] that net us out because he has a lot of
[68:39] health problems too he's got uh chronic
[68:42] kidney disease He's Got U diabetes like
[68:44] he's he he has a lot of health issues
[68:47] and I can't help but look at that and go
[68:50] is that the fate of the amount of stress
[68:53] he's endured in his life and his
[68:56] desire on a day-to-day basis to endure
[68:59] more well it's really hard to say on any
[69:02] one individual's case um you know it it
[69:06] it's probably more the case that as a
[69:09] result of the stress or the the strategy
[69:13] that's been chosen to manage the stress
[69:15] that some other things also were
[69:18] compromised such as his nutrition his
[69:20] exercise his sleep and that maybe the
[69:23] chronic diseases are are more the result
[69:25] of the imbalance around those things
[69:27] stress is clearly something that our
[69:30] relationship exists with on an inverted
[69:32] U right so so if this is stress and then
[69:37] this is performance on the y- axis
[69:40] stress on the x-axis it's it's basically
[69:42] an inverted U right so really really low
[69:44] levels of stress do not produce good
[69:47] performance right yeah like if you have
[69:49] no stress if there's nothing driving you
[69:51] like what are you doing right totally so
[69:54] as stress goes up your performance is
[69:56] actually going to get better but then
[69:58] and by the way it's not a symmetric U
[70:00] right and everybody's U is a different
[70:02] shape so some people have a u that just
[70:04] has a little tick at the top right so
[70:06] more and more and more stress leads to
[70:08] better and better better performance and
[70:09] then it just kind of ticks down other
[70:11] people have a u that like gets better
[70:13] and better and better and then it very
[70:15] quickly comes down so so you have to
[70:17] kind of know yourself there's a little
[70:18] bit of know thyself in this analysis but
[70:21] what you have to figure out is like
[70:23] what's my optimal level of stress for
[70:25] per performance and recognize when am I
[70:28] over that right that's a very important
[70:31] thing is you know you have to be able to
[70:33] get sort of internal feedback so an
[70:36] example is like what we talked about
[70:37] earlier when I'm task switching like
[70:39] crazy I'm past my level I've already
[70:41] gone over the edge so I have to come
[70:44] back so so that's an example of
[70:48] understanding that the other thing you
[70:49] want to understand is the shape of your
[70:51] curve is malleable by the other things
[70:54] you put in the system
[70:55] so take away my sleep take away my
[70:58] exercise my curve got way narrower make
[71:01] sense if I don't have a workout in me
[71:03] I'm going to go over that curve much
[71:06] sooner than if I am in if I just had a
[71:09] two-hour workout and a great meal if my
[71:12] relationships are not good like if my
[71:15] wife and I have a fight my curve just
[71:18] got way smaller my performance is going
[71:19] to deteriorate much sooner if I had a
[71:22] fight with my daughter if my kids left
[71:24] for school they were unhappy and I
[71:26] didn't get to walk them and blah like
[71:28] just you you life impacts the shape of
[71:31] that curve so what we really want to do
[71:34] is two things one understand the things
[71:36] that we do that stretch that curve out
[71:38] to be its biggest highest furthest J
[71:42] Apex and then secondly learn what the
[71:45] dashboard looks like for when am I
[71:46] tripping over the curve yeah that that's
[71:49] really interest I I love that learning
[71:51] when you are tripping over that my my
[71:53] mind immediately obviously went to
[71:55] myself but also our team and recognizing
[71:58] like how do you build a healthy
[72:01] workplace environment where everyone has
[72:03] variable levels and everyone came in in
[72:05] the morning with a different that's
[72:07] right everyone's and by the way
[72:09] everyone's going to have their own
[72:10] different curve but then each person's
[72:11] curve is going to be different on a
[72:13] given day based on their life and what
[72:15] they bring in from home and you know I
[72:18] mean I think I don't know how much of
[72:19] your team is remote versus in person but
[72:21] the more remote your team is which is
[72:23] unfortunately true of and my team is
[72:25] we're all uh you know located in
[72:28] different places it makes it just that
[72:30] much harder to to sort of figure that
[72:32] out because a lot of times you can't
[72:34] pick up on these things you know over
[72:36] the phone or over Zoom the way you can
[72:37] pick it up you can pick up on it a
[72:39] little more kind of around the
[72:40] proverbial water cooler it's an
[72:42] interesting thing to imagine if everyone
[72:44] had that like visible graph in front of
[72:46] them right like if you were looking at
[72:48] someone and they had that graph and you
[72:49] were recognizing where they would be
[72:50] amazing like just to just to be able to
[72:52] sort of everybody walks in every day you
[72:54] see the shape of their curve based on
[72:55] what happened and you see where they are
[72:57] on the curve yeah I wonder CU like
[72:59] creativity happens in teams right I
[73:01] think um also at the event that at the
[73:03] spotter Summit that we were at J.J
[73:04] Abrams was there and he was talking
[73:06] about creativity in the context of teams
[73:08] and like when a team gets too big it's
[73:10] hard to you know do creativity by
[73:13] committee y there's like a singular
[73:15] artistic voice and then you need a team
[73:16] to surround to Foster that creativity
[73:20] but in small teams you also need to
[73:22] really know where is everyone everyone
[73:25] at today y otherwise it's not going to
[73:27] be effective and also that can quickly
[73:29] compound to not collaborating well right
[73:31] there's definitely days where there's
[73:32] frustration between team members because
[73:35] someone just has a short fuse yeah right
[73:37] and this work is hard you're doing
[73:39] detail oriented cuts on extremely long
[73:42] episodes pressure of last episode didn't
[73:44] do so well so now this one has a ton of
[73:46] stakes to it and so all those Dynamics
[73:49] is something that we've been thinking
[73:50] about I think a lot of creators think
[73:51] about too as you build a creative team
[73:54] what what what do you think some of the
[73:56] strategies are is it like just open
[73:57] communication around where you yeah I
[74:00] mean when I think about like the most
[74:01] creative of my teams is is obviously the
[74:03] the content team and
[74:06] luckily I don't know I mean I just look
[74:08] at the guy who runs that team his name
[74:09] is Nick Stenson um you know I think I
[74:13] think Nick and I know each other very
[74:14] well so we've worked together
[74:17] for 10 or 12 years now um so we're very
[74:21] very
[74:22] close um and we don't have a time
[74:25] disagreeing with each other
[74:28] um and the team is small enough that
[74:33] like we we can push back on each other a
[74:36] lot got it um and even though I'm like
[74:39] quote unquote the boss the structure is
[74:41] purely horizontal so everybody on that
[74:44] team will tell me I'm absolutely full of
[74:46] [ __ ] when they think I am like they and
[74:49] sometimes actually it hurts my feelings
[74:51] like sometimes they are so brutal with
[74:53] me that I'm like I'm pissed piss off
[74:55] like I'm not going to lie right so but
[74:57] but that's really good like like there's
[75:00] no sense of we can't tell Peter what we
[75:03] think right um and and then on top of
[75:08] that like we we and and I'm sure this is
[75:10] something you guys do as well
[75:13] like when when we screw up we're pretty
[75:16] quick to apologize like we don't let the
[75:18] sun set on a fight sure right so we had
[75:20] a pretty big blow up three or four
[75:22] months ago like the biggest blowup we've
[75:24] ever had as a team it probably happened
[75:27] at 10:00 in the morning by noon by 11:00
[75:31] I was
[75:32] apologizing before we went for dinner
[75:34] that night we apologize you know we all
[75:36] hugged and made up again so it it's
[75:38] important I think it's people need to
[75:40] understand something about disagreements
[75:42] the damage of a disagreement is not the
[75:45] disagreement it's in the lack of
[75:47] reconciliation this is important you
[75:49] guys will learn this when you have kids
[75:51] you know you already know this because
[75:52] you're married it's not that you
[75:53] shouldn't fight with your wife it's how
[75:55] do you fight right can you do it without
[75:57] name calling and how do you reconcile
[75:59] when you're in the wrong and if you're
[76:01] anything like me you're going to be in
[76:03] the wrong 90% of the time W wives are
[76:05] generally right if we're being brutally
[76:07] honest like 90% of the time my wife and
[76:09] I have a fight it's my fault um and so
[76:12] it's not that we had a fight it's can I
[76:14] can I reconcile pretty quickly um can I
[76:17] can I um can I calm myself down enough
[76:19] to realize I was wrong do I have the
[76:21] humility to to own it and to apologize
[76:24] earnestly and explain why I'm just you
[76:26] know I'm going to be better next time
[76:28] and so I think that's true with teams
[76:29] and I think teams that can fight and
[76:31] make up quickly um are probably the best
[76:34] teams there are it's interesting the
[76:36] through this conversation some my
[76:38] biggest takeaways are Stillness and
[76:40] space because some of the challenges
[76:42] there are when you don't even have the
[76:44] space to reconcile or you don't even
[76:45] have the space to have that conversation
[76:47] because you're so your your cup is so
[76:49] full that you just have to get to the
[76:50] next thing yeah you know what I mean
[76:53] like that that I think as
[76:55] um running a company that's where I'm
[76:57] looking at it now and going like how do
[76:58] we how do we create more space because
[77:01] right now we are thing to thing to thing
[77:02] to thing really quickly and sometimes
[77:05] those things you'll let them you'll let
[77:06] them pass over because you're like I
[77:08] don't even I don't know how long that's
[77:09] going to take so I don't know if I have
[77:11] the space to sit and
[77:14] reconcile I think you got to make it
[77:16] it's tough but I think you got to make
[77:17] it you have to especially if you can
[77:20] work your get your mind to realize that
[77:23] it's it's actually it's an investment
[77:26] yeah it's a product it doesn't feel like
[77:27] it but it is an investment it's just
[77:29] like you would invest in capex you know
[77:31] if you were manufacturing
[77:33] process all right I got a fun one to end
[77:35] on here from uh another
[77:38] Creator hey Peter it's Jordan matter for
[77:41] a YouTuber I'm like old really old but I
[77:43] want to be even older I actually want to
[77:45] be the first 100y old YouTuber what is
[77:47] the number one thing I have to do to get
[77:49] there so short to the point short to the
[77:51] point I think I think Jordan has over 20
[77:53] million subscribers I think he's 50
[77:54] years old old so he wants to do this
[77:56] until he's 100 what what does he have to
[77:58] do to get there boy this is I mean
[78:00] that's a great example of what we talked
[78:02] about earlier right he's got to he's got
[78:03] to do the longevity on both fronts
[78:07] um uh well my recollection because I
[78:09] remember meeting him in February he
[78:10] seemed like he was he was doing a lot of
[78:12] things right um but honestly if you're
[78:14] going to get to 100 you kind of have to
[78:15] do everything right that's that's
[78:18] there's no guarantee you're getting to
[78:19] 100 that's that's you're in really
[78:21] really rarified Air at that point um so
[78:25] one is you got so one of the the One
[78:27] Import most important thing he has to do
[78:29] is too late which is you have to pick
[78:30] the right parents so he's 50 years too
[78:33] late for that because his genes are set
[78:35] so if he doesn't have centenarian
[78:38] genes uh like I don't pretty unlikely
[78:41] you're going to live to 100 but let's
[78:42] just assume that you're going to take
[78:44] everything that's modifiable at that
[78:46] point you're doing everything possible
[78:48] right you're you're you know you're
[78:50] managing your lipids your blood pressure
[78:52] your glucose all of those things to
[78:55] the level of what somebody would have
[78:56] had in their 20s so you're you know and
[78:58] that probably includes a lot of
[79:00] pharmacology to keep those things in
[79:02] perfect shape um you're
[79:04] exercising you know probably you know an
[79:08] hour six days a week and you know being
[79:10] well thought out between how much of
[79:12] that is strength training versus cardio
[79:14] you know not going too too hard and
[79:16] creating you know the risk of injury but
[79:18] but also being very consistent and not
[79:20] having long periods of time where you're
[79:21] missing it um you're not eating too much
[79:23] but you're eating enough protein you're
[79:25] getting sleep every night you're
[79:26] managing stress relationships all those
[79:28] things you're pretty probably pretty
[79:30] aggressive on cancer screening because
[79:31] if you're going to get cancer you're
[79:32] going to have to catch it early and if
[79:34] you don't the chances that you're going
[79:35] to beat it are next to nil but that
[79:37] means you're exposing yourself to more F
[79:39] false positives basically if you want to
[79:41] live to 100 it becomes really really
[79:43] involved uh and then on top of that you
[79:45] still have to not let that consume you
[79:47] to the point where you can't do the
[79:49] thing that you want to do until you're
[79:50] 100 which in his case is be a
[79:53] Creator good luck Jordan yeah yeah yeah
[79:56] i' say find a middle ground there yeah
[79:59] maybe let's call it 80 yeah do it till
[80:02] you're 80 yeah well that's great thanks
[80:05] so much Peter app appreciate it man um
[80:07] hopefully we get to do a I I think on my
[80:10] bucket list now is to do a workout with
[80:11] you awesome I think that would be really
[80:13] fun to do some Farmers carries with your
[80:15] hex bar all right come to Austin we walk
[80:17] up and down the street in Austin with
[80:18] you perfect uh I'll be there too it's
[80:21] not a buck list item but I'll be there
[80:23] I'll do it awesome did it right thanks
[80:25] guys all right welcome to the deep end
[80:28] the after show after the guest leaves
[80:30] this is the first time we're doing this
[80:31] so first of all thank you guys for
[80:33] joining us here in the deep end where
[80:34] we're going to talk about our biggest
[80:35] takeaways from the guest that was a
[80:38] really interesting conversation one
[80:40] thing I didn't expect to talk about as a
[80:42] question I didn't even prepare was about
[80:44] negative comments and how you know you
[80:48] only see the negative comment why is
[80:50] that when there's a CA of positive
[80:52] comments and the fact that he based in
[80:55] like human evolution yeah that we are
[80:57] not me uh to care about whether someone
[81:00] likes you it's more about whether they
[81:02] don't like you because when you're
[81:03] living amongst like a tribe of people
[81:06] that's what you need to be aware of yeah
[81:08] I I think with with everything we do
[81:10] like as as entrepreneurs and creators
[81:12] like I do think it's really important to
[81:14] zoom out and look at the human element
[81:16] of all this primarily because also
[81:18] another thing he shared that really
[81:19] really stuck with me is like he gets
[81:21] paid for the use of his brain and that
[81:24] is actually like the the majority of you
[81:27] know creative jobs and and
[81:29] entrepreneurial jobs so then evaluating
[81:32] how your brain is working in the context
[81:34] of what we do every day is really
[81:35] important and evolution plays into that
[81:37] which is fascinating the like negative
[81:40] bias and being hyper aware of that so
[81:41] you don't get kicked out of your tribe
[81:44] yeah is such a fascinating like Peak
[81:48] into human psychology and with YouTube
[81:50] creators we're building tribes that are
[81:52] way bigger than we were ever to be
[81:55] building and you're not face to face
[81:57] with those members of your tribe right
[81:59] or members of of you never see those
[82:01] people yeah so I I thought you know in
[82:05] that same context of like negativity
[82:07] positive reinforcement the first thing
[82:09] that really stuck out to me about this
[82:11] conversation was his note around
[82:13] ensuring that you're getting dopamine
[82:15] from somewhere else other than this
[82:17] career I thought that was really
[82:19] interesting because you know I live
[82:22] daytoday and I can feel feel the highs
[82:25] and lows of my emotional state being
[82:28] pretty rooted in the highs and lows of
[82:31] what we're doing here in the studio I
[82:33] mean I have not shaken that ability at
[82:35] all or not even ability but just like
[82:37] that feeling I which is amazing because
[82:40] we're like 13 years in and a good
[82:42] episode still leaves me riding high for
[82:45] multiple days yeah and a Bad episode
[82:48] takes me about a week or more to Shake
[82:50] it Off totally I I think it started to
[82:53] change a bit in in in my 30s of starting
[82:57] to invest back into like social life and
[82:59] friendships and other things like that
[83:02] that's that sounds crazy but when you're
[83:04] like a heads down entrepreneur it's
[83:06] pretty hard to look up and root
[83:09] your you know dopamine and anything
[83:12] outside of your work it's still not to a
[83:15] point where I'm like totally absent of
[83:16] that but that that was a really good
[83:18] reminder today to go like where else are
[83:21] you receiving that so you're not so tied
[83:23] to the highs and lows career because
[83:25] it's going to naturally be up and down
[83:27] from now until the end of you know when
[83:29] we stop creating together it's going to
[83:31] be up and down and so you know where
[83:34] else are we getting that dope mean I
[83:37] liked what he said about work filling
[83:39] the maximum available time yeah and then
[83:41] what you said about
[83:44] scheduling things that are outside of
[83:46] work making it a weekly habit because
[83:48] you don't want to cancel something right
[83:50] right it's like harder to make plans but
[83:52] if you just make it a standing like
[83:53] every Tuesday we play paddle tennis or
[83:57] whatever it is at least it's there most
[83:59] likely you don't want to cancel it yeah
[84:01] I thought about that like with my own
[84:02] life like I really should be scheduling
[84:04] more types of like physical activities
[84:07] like even you going to a workout class
[84:09] yeah with friends I've joined you maybe
[84:11] once once yeah like I I could I need
[84:15] that accountability I think I need like
[84:17] some group accountability and plans
[84:19] otherwise I will wake up and be like H
[84:21] I'm a little tired this morning yeah I I
[84:24] think that's also the relationship to
[84:26] like productivity and I think that's
[84:28] I've always considered working out to be
[84:29] productive but I definitely find myself
[84:32] waking up and being like what's the most
[84:33] productive thing I can do right now and
[84:36] leaving this conversation the the two
[84:38] things I want to try and value in the
[84:41] next chapter to ensure that we have a
[84:43] long career and that I'm performing at
[84:45] my best is stillness and space those two
[84:49] things he brought up quite a bit and I
[84:51] think thinking about like do you have
[84:55] space to think is a really interesting
[84:58] question to ask yourself is there any
[85:01] time where you're not having an input of
[85:04] stimulation whether that be podcast
[85:06] YouTube Instagram Tik Tok uh friends
[85:09] family wives you know whatever that is
[85:11] like no inputs do you have any space
[85:14] like that where you're you're still and
[85:17] knowing when you need to make that space
[85:19] for yourself when you talked about task
[85:22] switching you know where you've like I
[85:24] can't even oh gave me chills I was like
[85:26] oh yeah I've definitely been like trying
[85:27] to buy a flight while also like email my
[85:31] parents something that I'm dealing with
[85:33] over there and also I'm in a frame IO
[85:35] link and I just can't commit to one of
[85:37] them yeah and I'm just overloaded it's
[85:39] like man maybe I need to be more aware
[85:43] of the times that I'm being completely
[85:44] insane yeah and just and be like look
[85:46] the only thing you actually need to do
[85:48] is not one of these things it's none of
[85:50] them what's hard is that there's like a
[85:52] dashboard for everything a lot of things
[85:54] in our career you know particularly like
[85:56] YouTube Studio you open it you have a
[85:58] dashboard for how well things are going
[85:59] there's like green checks or uh grade
[86:01] checks you don't really have that in
[86:03] your life unless you actively create it
[86:06] right like unless you're like what was
[86:07] my week like did I spend time with
[86:09] friends did I give myself space did I
[86:12] think you know like you don't have that
[86:15] dashboard and this episode recording
[86:17] this with him sitting down with him made
[86:18] me take a step back and go like all
[86:20] right if I am someone who needs to like
[86:23] look at progress of things and so with
[86:26] that in mind how can I create a
[86:27] dashboard for like the holistic picture
[86:29] of my life like did I exercise four
[86:33] times this week or not it's like very
[86:36] simple stuff but it is easy to just go
[86:40] and push towards the stuff that does
[86:42] have quantifi quantifiable metrics like
[86:44] what we do on YouTube like what we do in
[86:46] our business because that feels really
[86:48] good to progress quantifiable metrics
[86:50] and problems also will just come to you
[86:53] which is easy right like like a one
[86:55] slack message can be an easily
[86:57] identifiable problem that you're like
[86:59] well great now I have something to solve
[87:01] let's plug in yeah you know the hard
[87:04] thing to do is be like at least for me
[87:07] is to be like okay what I'm actually G
[87:09] to do is block off two hours in the
[87:13] morning to work out or eat right or do
[87:16] anything but that but you actually I
[87:18] think I need to treat my personal health
[87:22] the same way or in a very similar way
[87:24] that I treat work I think I okay so like
[87:27] because that is not hard for me blocking
[87:29] off like two hours in the morning to out
[87:31] it's it's I can do it it's hard for me
[87:33] from like a discipline totally what I'm
[87:35] saying is I think what what what we need
[87:38] to do is I need to like I need to bring
[87:41] you to that with me the workout stuff
[87:44] and what I would ask you is to I think
[87:47] you're good at Stillness definitely I
[87:50] think you're capable of it I'm much more
[87:52] capable I'm not that capable of
[87:53] Stillness yeah we were hanging out
[87:55] yesterday to watch the PLL championship
[87:58] and I'm working on our presentation yeah
[88:00] and you're like working on like three
[88:01] different things I was like I thought we
[88:02] were just watching this game right but I
[88:04] am but then I took out my computer and I
[88:06] started working on stuff I'm near
[88:09] incapable of doing that you are near
[88:10] incapable yeah because I'm like oh great
[88:13] I'm watching a game yeah you need to be
[88:15] playing a game yes that's the only way
[88:17] to get you to be a little bit still to
[88:19] be like playing padle tennis or you used
[88:22] to swim yeah like you're still there
[88:24] yeah yeah yeah yeah that that you're
[88:27] right I'm not good at Stillness and that
[88:30] that's was very loud to me in this
[88:32] conversation like I imagine creators who
[88:34] are listening to this conversation
[88:35] there's a there's going to be one or two
[88:36] things that were really loud to you the
[88:39] loudest thing to me was space and
[88:41] Stillness I'm very bad at that and
[88:44] recognizing that the his answer to how
[88:46] to get creative was create space for
[88:49] creativity it's such a simple thing to
[88:51] say but I was like
[88:54] it's a good point yeah it's a really
[88:56] good point I'm gonna ask you the
[88:58] question that he said he he asks himself
[89:01] what needs to be true for you to be
[89:05] enjoying this career in 10 years that
[89:06] one kind of hit me like a ton of bricks
[89:08] and I asked I wanted to ask him if he
[89:10] had an answer and he basically said you
[89:13] know I just need to make sure that I'm
[89:14] still enjoying these conversations yeah
[89:17] and that holds true but I think I need
[89:22] to spend more time digging into it
[89:24] because I really when he said that I was
[89:25] like oh I actually don't know what needs
[89:28] to be true for me to not be bored by
[89:30] this career in 10 years I think it's a
[89:32] really good prompt for everyone
[89:33] listening I it's a excellent prompt for
[89:35] everyone I I my immediate answer to that
[89:39] question is what I shared in the episode
[89:41] which is a reduction of pressure on
[89:44] performance of content and an increase
[89:47] in you know uh evaluating our content on
[89:52] value to those who are listening or
[89:53] watching
[89:54] that for me would be like the most
[89:57] enjoyable version of this career cuz I
[89:59] do have a lot of anxiety around the
[90:02] performance of episodes and I'd like to
[90:04] reduce that and increase my enjoyment of
[90:07] just sitting in Curious conversation I
[90:09] wish I could say that for myself but I
[90:11] also know that I really enjoy when it
[90:14] feels like you've dominated the
[90:16] conversation that day when an episode
[90:18] comes out or you make something and you
[90:20] put it out on YouTube and everyone's
[90:22] tweeting about it there's comments like
[90:24] that to me would keep it exciting if 10
[90:26] years from now we're still dropping
[90:29] things that it's like we just dominated
[90:32] the conversation today yeah that that's
[90:35] exciting there's nothing more exciting
[90:37] to me than like people reaching out or a
[90:40] video taking off I'm Gonna Get You cold
[90:41] plunging so you get your buzz from that
[90:43] you know I'm open to that but that I
[90:46] don't know maybe that's what it maybe
[90:48] that's what it takes yeah good prompt
[90:50] for everyone though yeah what what what
[90:52] would make what you're doing right now
[90:53] enjoyable in 10 years and you could you
[90:55] could shorten that window too um I think
[90:58] there's like simple stuff that we talked
[91:00] about today that I would also urge a lot
[91:02] of creators entrepreneurs everyone who's
[91:03] listening to this to think about like
[91:05] the Simplicity of sleep exercise
[91:08] nutrition it's almost sounds ridiculous
[91:10] because you're like yeah I know it but
[91:11] unless you actually think about it
[91:13] you're not thinking about it there's
[91:15] also so much we did not go into with
[91:17] Peter today a little bit because we've
[91:20] spoken with him before and we've gone
[91:22] really into the weeds of like what do
[91:23] you do in terms of sleep he you know he
[91:25] mentioned on the show he takes three to
[91:27] four sleep supplements a night yeah like
[91:29] you can find that information from Peter
[91:31] of what he actually takes when it comes
[91:33] to working out you can find the exact
[91:35] exercises and the type of workouts that
[91:38] he recommends and I urge everyone if you
[91:41] are interested in that seek it out from
[91:44] him whether it's in his book or on his
[91:46] podcast because it's out there and it's
[91:49] really fascinating totally and and don't
[91:52] have I would don't have the anxiety that
[91:55] you have to do exactly that like I think
[91:57] one thing that's really great about
[91:58] Peter and and learning more about Peter
[92:00] is that he's very much pushes you to go
[92:02] like it's it's every person is different
[92:04] so like your protocol is g to be
[92:06] different yeah from mine it's different
[92:08] from his it's all going to be different
[92:09] but experiment with what that is and I
[92:11] told him look like I was super inspired
[92:13] the first time I heard you speak and
[92:15] then I've been somewhat discouraged at
[92:16] the action that I've taken like I've
[92:18] been disappointed in the actual like
[92:20] impact yeah but what I didn't say is
[92:22] that I actually have made a lot of
[92:24] improvement like I am working out more
[92:28] so than I was I am more knowledgeable
[92:30] about sleep and certain things um going
[92:33] in a sauna cold plunge like I on the Arc
[92:36] of my progress I have made progress
[92:38] because of the fact that I have spent
[92:39] time with him and I've listened to him
[92:40] and I've been reading his book even
[92:42] though I am a bit discouraged at like
[92:44] yeah I I wish I had made more progress
[92:47] but at the same time I've made progress
[92:49] that I wouldn't have made if I had not
[92:50] been listening to him do you remember
[92:52] some of like the lowest moments M of our
[92:55] career like the the most kind of fried
[92:58] and burnt out yeah I mean what do you
[93:01] remember about those
[93:03] moments I mean I just I mean I just
[93:05] remember being like you know not really
[93:08] fried and burnt out but like sad as
[93:11] tough as that like I just remember being
[93:12] like I'm like not ha I'm really like
[93:14] unhappy yeah you know like it was like a
[93:17] mix of like social life that I didn't
[93:20] have validation that I wasn't getting
[93:22] from career and not eating right being
[93:25] tired like it was so many things missing
[93:28] my family like there was just it was so
[93:29] much I just remember being like damn I'm
[93:31] like I'm not succeeding and I'm pretty
[93:34] unhappy right now you know like no cup
[93:36] was full is kind of what I remember yeah
[93:39] certain
[93:40] times yeah I think uh I just remember
[93:42] like being very far away from my why
[93:45] like why am I doing this when it was so
[93:47] hard and there was no
[93:49] validation you know I just remember
[93:51] being really far away from like
[93:55] why yeah because the videos we were
[93:57] making uh you know at one point at the
[93:59] beginning of this channel they weren't
[94:01] we were searching
[94:03] for we were expressing ourselves and
[94:05] hoping that we would find impact yeah
[94:08] and then once we kind of flipped gears
[94:10] and thought wait what's the impact we
[94:12] want to make that we care about right
[94:14] then we could express ourselves in a way
[94:16] that felt good and also like grew our
[94:20] Channel and you know has allowed us to
[94:23] have the channel that we have now gives
[94:25] you a North star yeah so just on the
[94:28] back half of this episode I would urge
[94:30] creators and and entrepreneurs who are
[94:32] listening to this to just invest some
[94:34] time into like self-evaluating just
[94:36] think about what is driving you what
[94:40] what what do you want your day-to-day to
[94:41] look like and what about what you're
[94:43] doing right now would make it still fun
[94:46] over the next decade I think it's a
[94:48] really good prompt so let us know what
[94:49] you thought about this episode also let
[94:51] us know what you thought about this
[94:52] little debrief we did after the episode
[94:53] this is new for us had a good time with
[94:56] it yeah had a good time let us know all
[94:58] right we'll see you