[0:00] Esports organ orgs have a lot of history
[0:03] of failing or needing to make mergers to
[0:06] stay alive um how I guess first of all
[0:09] can you explain to the people how
[0:11] Esports orgs make money just in general
[0:13] yeah so a lot of them have a tough time
[0:16] making money and throughout the covid
[0:17] years A lot of them were only making
[0:19] money through cash injections right um
[0:21] so a lot of these guys are trying to
[0:24] make money through not the actual
[0:26] Esports business but businesses which
[0:29] are to
[0:30] to set Esports business right you see
[0:32] that the Hun thieves they're trying to
[0:33] push their merch at one point trying to
[0:35] push a game and also trying to push a
[0:37] drink um and so a lot of these companies
[0:40] I would say are trying to figure out how
[0:43] many companies can we center around
[0:45] Esports being the marketing engine for
[0:48] um so you have TSM who has several
[0:50] companies underneath them and they
[0:52] actually make a decent chunk of change
[0:54] despite and even then how many layoffs
[0:56] they have had right I believe it's the
[0:57] blitz app that that they own which is
[1:00] one of their one of their biggest uh
[1:01] forms of Revenue you look at Team Liquid
[1:03] with liquipedia and and other things so
[1:06] there aren't a lot of ways for Esports
[1:08] teams to actually make money uh to begin
[1:11] with right outside of their sponsors
[1:13] whether it be peripherals and drinks and
[1:15] all that so a lot of them are trying to
[1:17] make these side companies where their
[1:18] Esports team then becomes the marketing
[1:20] arm for fores said project uh so as it
[1:24] sounds it's pretty freaking difficult
[1:26] unless you have a DieHard audience right
[1:28] to to break even especially because
[1:31] these player salaries are so exorbitant
[1:33] even even still to this day it's
[1:36] unfathomable how expensive it is to get
[1:38] into an esport like Counter Strike like
[1:42] unless you have a big gambling sponsor
[1:45] you can't really be in Counterstrike
[1:47] right now and the same could be said for
[1:48] a lot of Esports that don't offer enough
[1:51] Revenue to suffice for paying for top
[1:53] for top people long story short it is
[1:55] incredibly difficult I think everyone is
[1:57] still trying to figure it out and we a
[2:00] few mantle pieces right now in Esports
[2:01] that are doing a good job but it's not
[2:04] going to be good enough so everyone's
[2:06] everyone's chasing each other and why do
[2:08] you think it is so hard like why can't
[2:10] it be more how traditional companies who
[2:13] rely on Impressions make money with just
[2:15] traditional sponsorships and things like
[2:17] that why do you think they have to go
[2:18] the route of creating their own kind of
[2:22] companies so that they can use the the
[2:24] Esports team as a marketing arm where
[2:27] other traditional companies who rely on
[2:29] Impressions don't have to go that route
[2:30] yeah and I just want to stress this is
[2:32] my opinion all right I'm I'm a dumb guy
[2:34] so I'm not a CEO over there I I've met a
[2:37] lot of these guys they are freaking
[2:39] smart people and I am sure that they
[2:41] will figure this out over the next 10
[2:42] years and the market will continue to
[2:44] change um uh but like it's not like
[2:48] traditional Sports you don't have tv/
[2:50] streaming rights to really back in the
[2:52] entire process so you look at the Dallas
[2:54] Cowboys or any NFL team how much they're
[2:57] making off of media rights is
[3:00] insane no Esports team has that ability
[3:03] so it's
[3:04] like I I don't I remember looking it up
[3:06] a while back but how many billions in
[3:08] media rights these Sports comp these
[3:10] sports teams get Esports doesn't have
[3:13] those kind of numbers to back itself so
[3:14] we're left to find these other these
[3:17] other avenues which are very difficult
[3:20] and it's it's just so I'm sure other
[3:22] people are going to have thoughts on
[3:23] this but it's so difficult to attach to
[3:25] an Esports team when you're constantly
[3:27] changing rosters and you have multiple
[3:29] osters if you're a fan of the Dallas
[3:32] Cowboys they can lock down a quarterback
[3:34] and they can have you as a fan for life
[3:36] if you are an Esports organization that
[3:38] means you need to keep your scump
[3:41] Forever you need to keep NAD shot
[3:44] forever you need to keep double lift oh
[3:46] wait he wants to go somewhere else okay
[3:48] so do his fans so it's so much harder
[3:51] for an Esports team who is spread out
[3:53] across multiple Sports compared to a big
[3:57] big conglomerate who gets media rights
[3:59] so I think the big defining factor for
[4:01] me is those media rights and I'm sure
[4:03] there's a lot more intricate details
[4:04] there but yeah I mean Esports teams had
[4:07] to figure out so many things that are
[4:08] just new yeah and I don't know a lot
[4:10] about the business side of it like I
[4:12] mean I have a business background um
[4:14] myself but like in terms of like how
[4:16] Esports makes money and things like that
[4:18] I haven't looked into it a ton but it
[4:20] just seems like the opportunity should
[4:23] be there like you know like you said
[4:24] like Fox pays the NFL x amount of
[4:27] dollars and that money is distributed
[4:28] through you know to all the teams teams
[4:29] based on all the deals that they've made
[4:31] is is is Esports not making those kind
[4:33] of deals with YouTube or twitch or
[4:35] anything like that for like the rights
[4:36] to stream those or is that just not how
[4:38] it works right now well they were but it
[4:40] was going to the freaking Publishers or
[4:41] devs so like Activision is making a deal
[4:43] with YouTube and they're taking that
[4:45] money and maybe that sprinkles across
[4:47] the teams right but I don't think it's a
[4:48] substantial amount also I mean we're
[4:50] Gamers we don't like paying for things
[4:52] twitch has been free for a decade plus
[4:54] yeah YouTube as well we can just watch
[4:57] an ad and then watch the entire season
[4:59] so so um yeah I don't know where this
[5:03] goes I mean at the end of the day when I
[5:05] talk to owners occasionally or see them
[5:07] at events I'm always reassured because
[5:10] hey these guys have a million followers
[5:12] on Twitter and 200k on Instagram and
[5:16] when they play a match of whatever game
[5:18] whether it's Call of Duty Counter Strike
[5:20] League of Legends there's a quarter
[5:21] million people watching and so somebody
[5:24] out there when the time comes they will
[5:26] find a way to be like there is value in
[5:28] that because most TV shows you keep on
[5:30] scrolling by they don't have a quar
[5:32] million viewers no so I think a lot of
[5:35] this is grass's greener mentality of
[5:37] these teams are trying to figure things
[5:39] out but they're also trying to survive
[5:41] long enough where the industry finds it
[5:43] out for them and we will see however
[5:46] many couple dozen orgs are still left
[5:49] and how this industry shifts with them
[5:51] yeah and I think I'm in agreement with
[5:52] you like there there's the viewers I
[5:54] mean they're getting more viewers than a
[5:56] lot of TV shows that are still going on
[5:58] so there has to be a path to financial
[6:01] stability and Esports and they're just
[6:03] so young that they're just obviously
[6:04] still trying to figure it out yeah all
[6:06] right Jake when you're not working I
[6:09] think you talked a little about working
[6:10] out it's a big part of what you do when
[6:12] you're not working but you know what
[6:13] what do you do when you're not working
[6:15] yeah I mean I I definitely uh not only
[6:18] do I really enjoy working out I'm very
[6:20] uh OCD about it uh it's become a a main
[6:23] stay of like mental health yeah uh for
[6:26] sure so if anyone doesn't work out I
[6:28] mean I've been like we've said a JV
[6:30] athlete my entire life but it's been a
[6:32] really big like way for me to escape to
[6:35] have my own time and like I think
[6:37] physical fitness is a is a big thing for
[6:39] me of like even if things aren't going
[6:40] well at work I can look forward to a
[6:42] workout so being in shape has always
[6:44] been a pretty big thing for me mentally
[6:48] and so I've been doing it ever since I
[6:50] moved out on my own it's been a kind of
[6:52] a reoccurring thing so I'll probably I
[6:55] work out probably four or five times a
[6:56] week it's not too hard I I definitely
[6:58] have my free time to myself
[7:00] and then in other free time I'm gaming
[7:02] dude I'm watching I'm watching streams
[7:04] like I told you earlier I'm watching
[7:06] every interview like I I'll watch
[7:08] interviews twice I I just love hearing
[7:11] everyone's perspectives and almost
[7:13] getting to know how people think through
[7:15] interviews and I'll even watching your
[7:17] stuff I'll take inspiration of like that
[7:19] was a freaking good question and that
[7:21] was a great answer so I'm always trying
[7:23] to take things in and um I guess when
[7:25] it's when it's work I've always looked
[7:27] at that of like if I'm playing a video
[7:29] game but I watching a stream I'm working
[7:30] a little bit because I'm listening I'm
[7:32] waiting for a clip or I'm I'm learning
[7:34] about people so again long story short
[7:37] working out playing video games hanging
[7:40] with my
[7:41] girlfriend binging TV shows there a
[7:44] couple couple drinks here and there man
[7:45] thank you guys so much for watching this
[7:47] clip from Osa brunch don't forget to
[7:49] subscribe if you want to see more and if
[7:51] you want to watch the full interview
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