---
title: 'How Hit Men Actually Work | How Crime Works | Insider'
source: 'https://youtube.com/watch?v=AhlCxiCLe7I'
video_id: 'AhlCxiCLe7I'
date: 2026-08-05
duration_sec: 2591
---

# How Hit Men Actually Work | How Crime Works | Insider

> Source: [How Hit Men Actually Work | How Crime Works | Insider](https://youtube.com/watch?v=AhlCxiCLe7I)

## Summary

A retired ATF agent with 21 years of experience, including undercover murder-for-hire investigations, provides an in-depth look at how these cases are investigated and how hit men actually operate. He details the case of John Clevenger, who hired him to kill his estranged wife, and explains the techniques, challenges, and realities of undercover work.

### Key Points

- **Murder-for-hire is a targeted crime** [00:14] — Murder-for-hire is a targeted crime, not random. The value of human life can be very low; people have been willing to kill for far less than $5,000.
- **Common motives** [00:42] — Most murder-for-hire cases stem from personal relationships: husband/girlfriend, family disputes, child custody, business proceeds, or marital assets.
- **How cases come to light** [01:09] — Often, a person arrested for a minor offense offers information about someone seeking a murder to help themselves. They introduce an undercover agent to the would-be client.
- **The undercover's role** [02:18] — The undercover agent poses as a hitman, and the target believes they are hiring a killer. The agent's goal is to gather evidence of intent and overt acts.
- **Case example: John Clevenger** [03:13] — In 1999, John Clevenger was arrested for a low-level offense and offered to introduce an undercover to someone who wanted his estranged wife killed. The undercover was 'Nicky from Brooklyn'.
- **Dialing out the emotional person** [05:27] — The undercover gives the target opportunities to back out, but Clevenger was intent on the murder, using phrases like 'she ripped my heart out' and admitting he had already tried to hire someone else.
- **We don't make somebody a criminal** [07:36] — The undercover does not suggest the crime; the target does all the talking. The agent gives the target a stage and microphone to explain their plan.
- **The method: knock out and stab** [08:47] — Clevenger detailed the method: knock her out and stab her to death, and sprinkle cocaine at the scene to make it look like a drug deal gone wrong.
- **Access and alibi** [09:31] — Clevenger provided access details (ring the bell, say 'Bernie sent me') and discussed an alibi: be seen at work, get gas, get a receipt, and be in Parkville, 15 miles away.
- **The fake crime scene** [12:18] — The police set up a fake crime scene across from the wife's apartment to make Clevenger think the murder occurred. He saw it when he arrived for questioning.
- **Payment: cash is king** [14:05] — Clevenger paid $4,500 in cash, half up front and half after the act. He sold his business to avoid bank records. Cash is preferred because it's untraceable.
- **Another case: incarcerated inmate** [15:01] — In another case, a federal inmate wanted someone on the outside murdered. The undercover kept the money and did not commit the crime, illustrating that hitmen often take money without following through.
- **Investigative methods without undercover** [17:18] — When no undercover is involved, investigators follow the money: examine financial transactions, look for correlations between agreed amounts and withdrawals, and see who stands to benefit.
- **How plots percolate** [18:14] — People discuss their intent with acquaintances; there is no 'HitmanRus.com'. Word of mouth is how plots spread.
- **Digital footprint** [18:43] — Electronic devices used in furtherance of a crime are examined. Deleted files are still recoverable, and searches like 'how long to get a life insurance payout' can be incriminating.
- **Hollywood vs. reality** [19:41] — Hollywood portrayals are not rooted in reality. Real hitmen want to get the job and get paid with minimal exposure, avoiding breadcrumb trails.
- **Arson for hire** [21:05] — The agent also did arson for hire, including a woman who wanted her house burned for insurance, even if the family was inside. Real criminals want to be in and out.
- **The arrest and interview** [22:11] — Clevenger was arrested the next day. In the interview, he was told his wife was dead and asked if he knew anyone who wanted to harm her. He cried and claimed to love her.
- **The reveal** [23:32] — The undercover entered the room and said, 'John, Nicky from Brooklyn.' Clevenger realized the plot was foiled. The whole case took less than 16 hours.
- **The other hitman** [24:35] — Clevenger gave up the name of the first hitman he had paid $4,500 to. That person was on parole and went back to prison, likely having stolen the money.
- **Clevenger's sentence** [25:32] — In spring 2000, Clevenger pled guilty to attempted murder and agreed to a 12-year sentence.
- **Undercover training** [25:44] — The agent led a task force for 15 of 21 years. Undercover training includes classroom instruction and realistic public exercises. Key factors are likability and verbal skills, not appearance.
- **Recording and evidence** [30:55] — Undercover operations are recorded, at minimum audio, ideally video. In 1999, a digital recorder was used. The simple method is often best.
- **Challenges from targets** [32:24] — Clevenger joked, 'Is this where you pull out a gun and arrest me?' The agent replied, 'I've been watching too much TV, pal.' Such challenges are common.
- **A serious challenge** [33:10] — In another case, a target threatened to get the agent's fingerprint from a water glass. The agent ended the deal, as a real criminal would, to maintain cover.
- **Identity concerns** [36:19] — The agent is not overwhelmed by identity concerns, but is aware that high-profile cases may attract attention. Criminals generally don't retaliate against undercovers because they know their friend put themselves in that position.
- **Notable cases** [37:34] — Richard Kuklinski, the 'Iceman', was caught via an ATF undercover and admitted to killing over 100 people. Such cases are rare; most hitmen are not that prolific.
- **Mental health support** [39:11] — ATF provides mental health counselors and training to help agents deal with the emotional toll of undercover work.
- **Changing ATF demographics** [40:06] — In 1998, most new ATF agents were drawn to undercover work. Now, there is a wider variety of expertise, including arson, explosives, and firearms trafficking.
- **Firearms as tools** [41:13] — Firearms are tools, legally sold to first purchasers. The problem is when they are diverted to criminals. The prohibited person with criminal intent is the focus.
- **The goal** [42:19] — Every investigation aims to stop the plot and remove from society someone who legitimately wanted another human being killed and took multiple acts to further that plot.

### Conclusion

Murder-for-hire investigations are a niche but critical part of law enforcement, requiring skilled undercover work to stop plots before they happen. The case of John Clevenger demonstrates how agents build evidence, manage risks, and ultimately save lives.

## Transcript

I'm a retired ATF agent who worked murder-for-hire cases, and I've spent decades infiltrating, investigating and working undercover to disrupt violent plots across the nation.
These are targeted crimes. There's nothing random about a murder-for-hire. sometimes how the value of human life is so little.
I've seen people who would be willing to kill somebody over a lot less than $5,000, a lot less.
number of murder-for-hire cases are the personal relationship. the husband girlfriend, another family member. This is a child custody dispute.
Proceeds of a business, marital assets. There's a question of a lot of money when we're involved as law enforcement.
somebody has gotten himself into trouble They're now sitting in an interview room, and they want to help themselves.
And they say, I know somebody that's looking They give the information. They introduce an undercover to the person looking to have this murder committed.
And then we do what we do on a murder for hire investigation. The target that you're meeting as an undercover. or that type of undercover is this person wants another person killed,
They believe they're talking to somebody that's going to be able to commit a murder at their instruction. I've done undercover assignments, purchasing firearms.
That's the bread and butter of what ATF does. But murder-for-hire as a general type of undercover, it's really a niche type of case
in how we investigate it, how we evaluate it. I was the undercover that went the distance, as we say.
There were numerous overt acts committed by the target. He provided me a photograph of his estranged wife.
We drove together during the first meeting. That's her car. He gave me her daily schedule.
This is gone beyond just talk. This case came to our attention in the way that most of them come to our attention.
So in this particular case with John Clevenger in 1999, a person had been arrested for a relatively low offense, but it was a crime.
under the influence, and he was a business owner. He needed his driver's license to not be revoked.
And when he found himself in the interview room, he said, my ace in the hole. someone to have his estranged wife killed.
I'm willing to make an introduction He let Clevenger know, hey, somebody's going to call you His name is Nikki.
Then I was provided a phone number to call Clevenger. The initial call had one goal to set up a face-to-face meeting. Hey, this is Nikki.
If somebody ever said a "piece of work" done for anything other than a murder.
That's street reference to murder. I set up a face to face meeting. My initial contact,
the first time I spoke to the target, John Clevenger, on the telephone was September 7th of 1999, in North Kansas City, Missouri.
I met with him at about 8:00 at night in a McDonald's parking lot. I met with them again in the same parking lot at 10:00 that night. think about it. Call me in a week.
I can't have a potential victim out there. I don't know who else he's dealing with.
He was intent on having this murder committed. When we do these murder-for-hire cases is, as the undercover,
we want to dial out the micro, emotional person where the feeling is going to pass every time. I gave him an opportunity to back out.
and this talk and this plot. Some of the phrasing that he used was she ripped my heart out.
She threw it in the dirt and she put her footprint on it. I think she's been unfaithful. I've thought about just going
and killing her myself and then killing myself. I have tried to get somebody to do this. I found another person to kill my estranged wife.
He just hasn't done it yet. you know, a few different excuses he gave of why it wasn't done. But the fact is, there is a real victim that there's somebody out there
that's already agreed to do this and taken money by his admission. So this is a person that is far
Yeah, I'm a hothead. Talk tonight, but I'm going to wake up tomorrow, and I don't want this done. This is a guy that's predisposed to this offense.
to make this happen long before I came into the picture. We don't make somebody a criminal. We're fishing in the right pond.
And we don't suggest to them at all. They do the talking and they in most times unburden themselves to tell you all about it.
This, I think would be a good idea. And at that point, you know all the mental check boxes, elements of the crime, all the emotional statements,
all taken together, examined as a whole. This needs to be stopped immediately.
If you think about it like I am giving you the stage. I am giving you a microphone to talk to me.
Well, this is how I would do this. I want to know what you've thought about. This is how you're going to get in the front door.
She'll open the door. Say this. The method, that it got distilled down to. Knock her out and stab her to death.
She was working in a bar, and I think she's selling cocaine. So when you kill her, I want you to sprinkle
Throw it on the floor. And it was very specific that he wanted the cocaine He said this will look like a drug deal that resulted in this murder.
locked building and a locked apartment? The office doesn't open until 9:00. At 8:00 in the morning,
you are going to ring the bell to get into the building. His name is Bernie. Ring any bell. Bernie sent me.
Can you unlock the door? Okay, Bernie, I know who that is. Bernie's directed you, plumber to come into the building.
It's not 2:00 in the morning. Knock on her door and you just say Bernie sent me. I just need to get in for a minute
that's going to the apartment underneath you. And he said she'll open the door. Again, Oh, let me think of a method.
that's committed multiple overt acts in these two meetings. you want cocaine put at this crime scene?
He's like, well, I don't have any. I'm like thinking to myself, he's not a cocaine dealer. I just told him, I'll get my own cocaine, give me an extra $500.
I already knew the answer to this question. I already knew where the police station was. across the street from the wife's apartment building.
Another part of this layered, you know, examination of this plot is he talked about
Of course I'm going to be talked to by the police. And we talked about an alibi. Be seen at work, get gas, get a receipt, go get something to eat
I'm going to be in, and he named Parkville, another community about a 15-mile drive from where the wife lived.
They'll know I'm with them. Check. Another check. He knows he's going to be interviewed by the police.
And that's when I started for how we were going to do this arrest, knowing that the police station
is directly across the street from his wife's apartment building. Obviously, they've been briefed in on We said we're going to set up a fake crime scene,
yellow tape, cops with clipboards in ATF. I want to make the bad guy come to an inaccurate conclusion based on accurate information.
Cops, clipboards, crime scene, van, yellow tape. He did it. And I knew he would have to see that, because he's going to be called
at the North Kansas City Police Department directly across the street. when he turns into the police department parking lot. And that is exactly what happened when he was contacted by a police detective.
I can't talk to you about this over the phone. excuse yourself from work I'll be right there.
Drives down to the police department, sees this fake crime scene You know, to make him think, oh, my wife really did get killed.
Payment to an undercover or a non I have never heard of other
Cash is king. and I can go and do anything I want with it. And to the point. Clevenger.
That sounds reasonable. And he said, well, I sold the business recently. So there's no records of transactions of this money going out of a bank account.
To me, to you, it's the same with when we buy stolen firearms. When we buy firearms from violent convicted felons, we buy crack, meth, coke, another murder for hire case I was involved
with where a federal incarcerated inmate wanted a person on the outside murdered. I'll take half up front tonight, because I'm doing this tomorrow morning.
Crazily enough, when I told him, because I have to find out I'm going to keep it all, I'm going to get your money back from this guy.
A further component of half down, half after this act is committed. how am I
You're going to mail me to my post office box But now, how am I going to get half the money and $1,000 of whatever cash I find in the wife's apartment from either
her drug sales tip money, salary, whatever she squirreled away in the apartment. And this gives you an idea of what you're dealing with. he believes is going to commit a murder
He gives me his parents name, and he goes, I want you to put the money, and mail it to my parents' house.
If you take an unemotional look at that, you're telling a guy that you just meet for the first time, Did the Good Idea Fairy say,
Why don't I tell this murderer where my parents live? I'm not mailing anything back to you. I'm keeping everything. $4,500 from hitman number two, going in my pocket.
Everything, cocaine, money, and any other thing that I want to take Oh, this guy I hired to murder In reality, I'm keeping everything.
Cases where there is no law enforcement involvement in a murder. an investigative method is going to be we have somebody that we're starting to like for this, a potential person that put this plot into motion.
every financial transaction they've done in quite some time. Is there any correlation between an agreed upon amount to
withdrawal, a check, money received and money out? Who stands to benefit? Follow the money.
So how does somebody percolate this plot looking for somebody? They discuss it with people that they know like, They may say, yeah,
It's literally that simple. There's no website www dot
HitmanRus.com, call us. That doesn't exist. And If we believe that any electronic device
has been used in furtherance of any crime, that's going to get looked at, and anything that occurs online is discoverable, you may think you deleted it, you deleted it, you can't see it.
Still, they're still on your computer hard drive, still on your phone, hard drive, still on the whoever you sent stuff to. And by the way, if we see 25 searches in your Google schmoogle,
how long to get a life insurance payout, how deep does a body have to be buried? Okay, a murder has been committed. Why did you do these searches?
Did you have a curiosity? I have not seen a Hollywood production
that is really rooted in reality of how these plots actually occur. A murder-for-hire plot is such a small niche, less than 1% of murders in general.
does the public fear the murder-for-hire scenario? It is just a naturally out there subject.
I was in the investigative business and in a murder-for-hire. A legitimate hitman and there have been enough of them.
They don't want to create all of these I'm not stalking a victim. A logical ordered thinking, actual murder suspect.
They want to get the job, they want to get paid, with as limited exposure to them as humanly possible. Do I want to create breadcrumb trails in all these different directions,
exposing me when law enforcement conducts an investigation? So that's where reality and Hollywood diverge
murder-for-hire investigation. Ricky-tick, tick. As we would say. I've been hired to burn houses down.
And I had one gal that wanted her house burned down for insurance money. She was having a dispute with the family- a couple and two little kids. Well, what if I have to do this when they're in the house?
If I was a real arson for hire, I'm getting the job. I'm getting the money, I'm committing the act, and that's it. And that's a theme in the general criminal conduct underworld.
From hundreds of arrests that I've made, hundreds, if not over 1000 interviews, interrogations, talking to my peers, my pals, Bad guys want to be in and out with any criminal act.
ended the next day with the arrest of John Clevenger, the wife being put in protective custody until we could arrest John. I wanted the mental,
that when he walked into that interview room This murder occurred, done with her.
John, your wife's been killed. Do you know anyone that would have wanted to do this? And he started with
He's crying. I love my wife and all the things that we would expect to hear.
I was over here. You can talk to anybody. After that has run its course, one of the detectives said to John, John, you are really upset.
Would that be okay just to, you know, help calm you down a little bit? I come into the interview room, I've got my ATF neck badge on.
He won't look at me, and one of the detective says, John, do you know him? And I say, John, Nicky from Brooklyn.
And then we actually had to explain to him that I did not actually kill his wife. We saved your wife's life.
We didn't murder your wife. That was it was the whole case was over in probably less than 16 hours from the meeting
to the arrest, to the wife being informed of everything. These cases have to move rapidly because we have a potential life in danger. He's told me he's paid somebody $4,500 to kill his estranged wife.
He gives it right up he goes. This is where he lives. This is his address. I think he gave me the license plate number and he said he's done
a number of years in state prison on cocaine charges. So now we know who this other hired hitman is. He was on parole.
He went back to prison immediately. He explained he basically just stole the money. Really?
Maybe. Who knows why. Take the chance. The following spring of 2000, John Clevenger pled guilty in state court to the charge of attempted murder.
And, he agreed to a 12 year sentence. amount of my time, I was the leader of a task force.
For 15 of my 21 years, ATF became really known to me Department of Investigation back in the 80s,
hitter, not dangerous undercovers, but a lot of undercovers And I was getting paid off a lot.
we want to put you in a formal undercover training school. You had to have distinguished yourself as a federal agent somewhere else,
or as a police detective, some type of investigative capacity and it was a rigorous process to get in. So they wanted a
committed to drilling investigations down to bedrock. This is what we do, and we're going to make a difference
by removing the most violent segment of society. So Nicky from Brooklyn, the name Nick or Nicky is it's almost like John.
a common name in the Brooklyn community They were people I dealt with all the time, plus the senior leadership
It just became natural. Within Brooklyn. I can't pass as Italian at all.
However, outside the New York Northeast area, Southern State. was accepted by the targets I dealt with unchallenged.
I've been out of New York City probably 11 years now, But when I lived in Brooklyn and early days of ATF, I sounded like
Literally nobody knows anybody's last name. We grab somebody and they would want I would say, what's their name?
They go, you know, psycho, crazy man. Everybody's got a nickname. I'm Nicky from Brooklyn.
Literally, I was. from these real Italian guys and gals in my neighborhood and people I arrested, it just all got blended together.
Nicky from Brooklyn. During training, specifically undercover training. it's broken up into two types of training. You have a classroom training where you're going to hear
These are techniques. This is how you put survival safety on your side of the table. They'll do case studies.
There'll be a very detailed examination of some of our most, successful undercover operations So there's that classroom portion.
training that we do in a public setting where there will be an actual bar, nightclub, dance club, whatever kind of public location.
And this is a very heavily monitored situation. to occur in a realistic setting. It really boils down to, we like to say it's not for everyone,
but if you're interested and you want to perfect the craft, literally your appearance is not the factor. The car you're driving, not the factor,
the tattoos, they're all props. The one factor that matters to an undercover is what comes How do you speak, what you say, how you say it.
You have to be likable. Nobody wants to deal with an unlikable person. Not every ATF agent is going to excel as an undercover operative,
but the people that raise their hand, it's a volunteer sport, and my hat's off to every single one of them are masters of the craft, and there's just no other way to put it.
should give anyone pause to being involved in any type of criminal activity. You leave a digital footprint everywhere you go with everything you do,
The minimum is an audio recording. A perfect world situation is a video and an audio recording. When a target is presented a video of themself
cold water to the face in this particular scenario, the technology in 1999 is light years
different from the technology of 2026. For that particular undercover, it was a digital recorder. And, sometimes
the simple method is the best method. And I was 100% confident I was not going to be subjected to a search.
I'm not seeking you out. I want to make sure you're not law enforcement trying to, There was one comical comment that Clevenger made
during the second and last undercover contact that night. and I'm audibly counting out the money because I want it memorialized. You gave me $100 bills.
He says to me, is this where you pull out a gun and arrest me? I've been watching too much TV, pal. And no further questions about any of that with him.
Almost every undercover ATF You're going to have that moment, or you may have several of them where you're going to be challenged,
I was negotiating And this was taking place over several meetings in Kansas City.
the bad guy but yet he is the guy that furthered
He wanted some arson for profits committed. He wanted this 20 kilo cocaine deal And I would be able to give him some, you know, fantastic deal.
As a matter of fact, the contact that I had with him a drawn out high end dinner followed
six hours long between these two meetings, one night and he is pushing this cocaine thing.
But then at the end of the night he goes, Nicky, I don't know who you really are, but I'm going to find out somebody get your water glass with your fingerprint on it,
to run your fingerprint. And we're going to find out exactly if you are who you say you are. It'll find out exactly what I told you.
we then put some safety measures in place that the resources to do what he said,
they were going to find out my cover story. So that challenge happened and that was, you know, well over 20 years ago,
I've had some other gentle challenges, but not where they really think I never had that other than Mr.
That guy just wouldn't come off. I did what any good undercover would do. Cocaine doesn't grow on trees.
And I ended it, then that's what a real bad guy would do. It's like, how many times are you going to challenge me? Only a member of law enforcement would try everything to salvage that.
I'm like, move on, okay. Thank you. And there was ultimately a disagreement over price per kilo. So we just said, okay, thank you enough.
perfect the case on extremely violent individual, they are going to be in prison for a long time. that are not in prison, that they may want to exact some type
and the resounding answer to that is nobody wants to go down with a sinking ship. to try to approach the law enforcement person
They know we didn't put their friend in that position. Their friend put themself in that position.
So am I concerned about my identity for the type of work I did? Not a concern that overwhelms my day, but I'm aware
when those type of cases come up, it's going to get the attention. In the undercover I did where I got hired to kill an estranged spouse. Almost the direct quote from the estranged husband that hired me
asked him, how are you going to know that this happened? Nothing like this has happened in 50 years in this little area.
That's how I'm going to know. And like anything else that gets attention, that this is a much larger occurrence.
There have been some very niche, real cases committed murder-for-hire, or so they state.
Richard Kuklinski, also known as the Iceman. By his admission, he's killed well over 100 people through an undercover done by an ATF agent out of New York
that recorded conversations about murders he had committed. And he's not going to victimize anybody else.
That is not common for, you know, a so-called hitman. The chances of going the distance and being again, being, never discovered, never, a case made on you
There's a lot of things programs, that are in place to deal
with the mental aspect, the mental preparation. We don't need to dwell on the bad all the time. all the trainings, the preparation, the mental health counselors,
will have with mental health professionals Again, to inoculate the emotional toll
okay, I understand why I'm feeling like this. I'm going to talk to somebody or I have mechanisms now at my ready
to move through this problem. When I came on board ATF in '98, the vast
majority of people I was hired with were drawn to ATF in particular, enamored with the undercover technique, Why else would you want to come to this agency?
They were really the federal agency doing the most of it. to current, where it's not the majority of people coming into ATF, That this is why I want to be here.
It's a wider variety of people that are coming in the door now. We have people that have quite an expertise in the arson, explosives,
firearms trafficking, violent home invasion crews, armed robbery crews. So there's a wide variety of violence that ATF agents investigate. It's not all undercover work, but there are a collection
the craft of how to do this. Are firearms drivers for this particular type of crime? Maybe.
A firearm is a tool, and it's a legal commodity legally sold to the first purchaser. It's from that point that firearms get diverted to criminal purpose,
prohibited people in possession of them to commit crimes. It is the prohibited person that possesses the gun with criminal intent.
That's who we look at in this particular murder-for-hire with Clevenger We've had cases where people kill, are killed in
you could think of. The gun, again, it's not hard to manipulate a trigger, point that at a human being and that person is shot or killed.
So there's a factor of ease. you have to be in less than an arm's distance to execute that type of murder.
And every single one of these investigations is We are here to stop this plot. It's the removal
of someone from society that legitimately wanted another human being killed and did multiple, multiple acts to further that plot.