---
title: 'DF Direct Q+A: Helix 2028 "Delay"...? Xbox''s Review Problem Fixed? Will Switch 2 DLSS Improve?'
source: 'https://youtube.com/watch?v=bfz5lFEoGj8'
video_id: 'bfz5lFEoGj8'
date: 2026-10-31
duration_sec: 3048
channel: 'Digital Foundry'
---

# DF Direct Q+A: Helix 2028 "Delay"...? Xbox's Review Problem Fixed? Will Switch 2 DLSS Improve?

> Source: [DF Direct Q+A: Helix 2028 "Delay"...? Xbox's Review Problem Fixed? Will Switch 2 DLSS Improve?](https://youtube.com/watch?v=bfz5lFEoGj8)

## Summary

In this Q&A session, Digital Foundry's panel discusses Microsoft's Xbox review code distribution issues, next-gen console delays, the health of the CPU market, and potential improvements to Switch 2's DLSS.

### Key Points

- **Xbox Review Code Whitelisting Problem** [03:06] — Windows Central article exposes missing Metacritic scores for Call of Duty on Xbox; Microsoft's CTO responds, promising fixes to reduce review steps.
- **Next-Gen Helix Delay to 2028** [13:08] — Project Helix delayed from 2027 to 2028; reasons include RAM shortages, need for a complete OS, and aligning with Sony's likely delay.
- **CPU Market Health and Upcoming Releases** [34:28] — CPUs are a bright spot; Nova Lake and Zen 6 expected to bring 10-20% IPC gains, making CPU upgrades more affordable than other components.
- **Sony's QSSR and the Console War** [40:07] — PSSR/QSSR port to Xbox is seen as a natural AMD partnership evolution, not a strategic block; Sony focuses on its own ecosystem.
- **Switch 2 DLSS Potential Improvements** [46:21] — Nintendo likely to release quiet DLSS revisions, improving existing models rather than introducing new features.

### Conclusion

The panel navigates through Xbox's review code pitfalls, next-gen console delays, CPU market health, and upscaler trends, ending with cautious optimism about the future.

## Transcript

welcome to the latest edition of this the DF Direct Q&A show. As usual, our going to make some attempts to provide answers. Joining me on the panel for this one, first of all, he's back, John Linneman. Hello.
>> I was only gone for a little bit, so but yes, it's good to be back and answer those questions because that's uh you know, you see that and like we will attempt to answer always and yeah, I guess we still lack that confidence to
best. [laughter] >> Absolutely. And joining us, of course, it's Oliver Mackenzie. consumer advisement to consumer advisory
>> to to indicate that we're not always going to be there on the answers. You mistakes, but we'll we'll try our best. >> Yeah. >> It's like Dear Abby, but Dear Lid Better, essentially. [laughter]
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description below to find out more. with the questions as such, I we got to talk about Xbox review codes because um uh basically there was an article that emerged on Windows Central yesterday
where basically um they're talking about Microsoft's Metacritic problem. And um we've got this really bizarre situation where there were Metacritic aggregated scores for the latest Call of Duty game um on PlayStation, PC, etc. but not on
straightforward. Actually getting hold of Xbox code for Call of Duty would quite challenging. And how does that work in a world where Microsoft actually owns Activision at this point? It's utterly bizarre. Now, this is something
where um I think it was around the time of 007 first light in particular where um we were offered Xbox code, but the problem the third-party publisher needs to whitelist
specific consoles based on their network ID codes, and then and then and only then do the codes actually work. So, we can get the codes in advance, no problem, but the code won't actually work on our Xbox consoles. This proves
doubly problematic for Digital Foundry because obviously we are using both Xbox Series X and Series S consoles, and we also like the flexibility of being able to distribute that code to whichever team member is available, which means
that we actually have to supply like three sets of two console network IDs. It's a completely impractical system that's had um
workflow, but more to the point, we now have the situation where we're not even seeing Metacritic scores because nobody can be bothered with this system in time, certainly. There are actually, to be fair, there are one or two
working with that have been sort of harvesting those network IDs ahead of but it's it's a faff. yeah, back in March Microsoft actually asked us, "What's your problem with the
system?" And we told them, and nothing happened. In actual fact, they doubled was typically only used on third-party suddenly it was instigated on Microsoft's own games as well.
The good news is that the article by Windows Central seems to have seen an about-face from Microsoft on this. So, there was a response from on this. So, there was a response from Microsoft CTO Scott Van Vliet saying
this, "Reviewing a game on Xbox takes too many steps today. Press and creators that's what the team is ultimately building toward. The first updates are John, I want to talk to you about this one because um
Change is a foot. Things should hopefully go back to the way they were. But the problem is I mean, I don't understand this this wording here. That's what the team is ultimately building toward. It's a
system that was turned on first of all for third-party games and then for first-party. I mean, you just turn it off. We We must be missing something here. >> I mean clearly they did something on the
back end to instigate this and that's the mystery because what you say they're building towards is how it used to be. >> Like for almost an as long as we've been covering Xbox it
was just exactly what he says that it should be. You just redeem and play. >> And it was actually the easiest system of all the platforms because it doesn't take region into account. So you can just just go and it was great and then
system came in and it really just created so many problems. We complained the white listing process not only was it it time consuming for us and also sometimes
didn't even work correctly but from what I could tell it also created a lot of >> Yeah. >> that I don't think they wanted to deal with necessarily because they had to go around all these outlets that are doing
this stuff and suddenly have to deal with this and just resulted in them saying you know what we're not even going to bother with >> You know we're just going to send out the PlayStation version or whatever or
some other version but not Xbox. And I'm so baffled by why like why this was implemented who thought this was a good idea. Like I get security to a
degree but like just look at what the competition is doing. Look at competition is doing. Look at uh I guess just the state of Xbox and >> Yeah. >> The timing couldn't be stranger and it's
had exactly the effect that we thought it would where just if I mean it let's come to you and say hey we got review code you can get it on PlayStation or PC or you can give us your Xbox info that you have to go dig out send it to us
wait a few days and it might work and then you can play on Xbox. It's like >> going to pick the Xbox. >> They're going to play on PC or happened. yeah. >> [laughter]
first time I actually encountered this system was when we were I believe it was when we were reviewing the next generation patch for Metro Exodus, right? And there was actually a good reason for having this white-listed
console thing because the game was already available. And couldn't just let everybody suddenly have preview access to upgrade to an existing game. So, basically the white-listing system was
reviewers are going to be taking a look at this version of the game that's on the Windows store, but it's not actually publicly available yet." So, that makes sense, right? You know, but when it's a game that's not out yet and where you
know, where where there's an existing system that worked just fine, adding this was just turned out to be sort of like a massive own goal. And it's to the point Oliver where you know,
when we're having our weekly editorial meetings and we're talking about reviewing games and it's like, "Wait a minute, is there an Xbox white-list put you off. >> Yeah, it just annoys me because
like to dictate the flow of what the coverage is going to look like to a large degree. So, whether that means tackling everything in one video or splitting off as we so often do into like a main piece and then a platform
different platforms, all these kinds of things, we want those kinds of factors to be within our own control. And when it comes out of our control, then all of a sudden we're forced to like hive Xbox into its own video,
there's not a compelling technical reason to do that and there isn't a compelling viewership reason to do that and it's just weird, but also there is this expectation that we cover Xbox, which is a fair expectation. So,
inevitably that ends up with more work going into a second video that is duplicative to some large degree or it ends up going into DX, which people complain about because then it's seen as like second class coverage, but I'm I'm
like the reality of the hand that we're dealt here. but I haven't noticed this uh cropping up too much recently or perhaps in in part perhaps that's part of our own selection of of of content because
degree. But it is frustrating, especially when well. You know, and there are jailbreaks for You know, and there are jailbreaks for PS5 and hacks for PS5, not really for
Xbox. Um I don't think there's unique interest in the Xbox versions too much, so I can't imagine, you know, Sony is going without a system like this. Microsoft is implementing this system. But for whose security is it protecting?
I don't really get it. I mean, I I honestly don't get it and love it if just don't know why it's incumbent on one platform holder to implement a they're the minority platform holder and when a lot of outlets would probably
you know, take a look at the at the PlayStation code, which is going to be representative of the experience for a larger base of users. I think it's just a total own goal. And I totally agree with with John. I don't know why they
because it worked fine. I had no objections with that system. exemptions here or there. I would understand that, but in general I don't I don't see why every single game needs to be whitelisted. It's just it's kind
>> Yeah, they're going back to the system that they had before, which is basically the same as PlayStation. So, yeah, good news, hopefully, because we've had a number of situations where we've just simply not received Xbox code
and where we've had to go out and buy it on day one. And certainly it's not our intention to to be late with Xbox reviews, right? But we had no choice in that scenario. And other situations where games I guess
this may apply to what happened with Call of Duty. game code is delivered late anyway, like just prior to launch. And then basically there's just no way to get a an Xbox
waiting for the white listing situation to be sorted out. But thankfully, it Microsoft. But I think it's worth saying that, you know, we did talk about this like many, many months ago. Microsoft did reach out
We told them the problem. All of the stuff about how journalists are not likely to be reviewing on Xbox if they can have another version ahead of time. And you know, only now where there doesn't seem to have been a
Metacritic score for the new Call of Duty on Xbox that something actually happening. So, good news. But let's move on. Um let's actually do some questions in
>> And we're going to kick off this with this one from Chicken Point. It appears that the quote unquote analysts were correct and Project Helix has indeed been delayed out of 2027 and and into 2028. Why delay? One thought is
that the Xbox Series consoles and PS5 consoles face no stealing their market share. If we focus strictly on power {slash} performance, you you still cannot get better bang for your buck than a ninth gen console except in the
than a ninth gen console except in the handheld space, hence the 2027 launch. So, perhaps Xbox delays Helix because A, during a RAM shortage, it's generally undesirable to launch a new RAM heavy console. And B, Xbox knows
that Sony's 10th generation console is also delayed. The question is, if this or some other reasoning holds for one year delay, why wouldn't it hold this all just up, Oliver. Where basically um
why delay? Because it doesn't seem like the memory crisis or the storage crisis there's been projections that it's going to continue into 2028. I can only assume um And it's a crazy thought, but maybe
Microsoft and Sony or or Microsoft specifically in this case know something that we don't. >> Possibly. Possibly. I mean, who knows? On the RAM front, I would feel very nervous about
RAM. Um I actually think if anything, when you look at what what's going on in in the whole sphere of AI at the moment, um it it's it's looking pretty dire for consumer availability of some of these
products in the future. I think it's not very positive at all. here with Microsoft is perhaps beyond any kind of like allocative decisions around hardware. I think that they want to launch with a
fully baked OS, hopefully, and a software offering that makes sense. Um positioning versus uh Sony is important, but I think more important is just being there on day one with a good software offering, and that includes
probably a, you know, ideally an exclusive game or two, something big to Um that's something you can't necessarily guarantee. talk about like uh Series X that launched without really any super
wasn't really present. Halo Infinite was famously delayed by a year. Maybe if Halo Infinite warts and all was there on day one, maybe that would have made a bit of a difference. So, I think there is some um importance to to to being
having a complete and fully baked software offering. So, yeah, I suspect that's maybe the issue there. And then also just the difficulty of supporting two hardware launches in one year, spacing those out makes sense.
But yeah, I could totally see it being informed by Sony also possibly delaying because they're subject to similar kinds of pressures as Microsoft. But we have very little visibility into Sony's particular
release timing. All we have is rumors, speculation. Whereas the Fortune story seems to put a little bit of a finer point on the Xbox date. So, perhaps 2028 is a realistic target for Xbox at this point.
>> Mhm. Um I mean, you weren't here to discuss the main Fortune article, but the the key dating situation there, John, was a handheld in 2027 and a full console in 2028. Um what do you make of that?
>> So, when talking about handheld on Xbox, what is it what's the current I guess scuttlebutt around that because we already have the ROG Ally X series, right? So, is there also another Xbox
about here? And what would that actually do in terms of relation to what the Helix is going to be is the question I have. >> and this is all all stuff I'm not really up to speed on. Like I don't know where
>> Yeah, I think the uh whole handheld situation kind of came out of nowhere because there was um reports that Microsoft's first-party handheld device was essentially um uh canceled. And um suddenly uh we've got this
Microsoft is working on a handheld for 2027 and there's a uh conflict between the Windows and the Helix teams about what operating system it should run on." Which, you know, if there is a conflict like that, it kind of does suggest a
first-party device, but at the same time, um Microsoft has gone down a parties specific specific specifically, rather, Asus. So, I think we need more detail there on what's actually going to
happen. Um and um but the concept of actually coming out with a with a another handheld kind of like a year after the X20, I guess. I mean, I'm intrigued. I'm interested, especially if there's much more of a
first-party input into it. Um I still don't see how it's going to be of the, you know, the X20, which is like, you know, 13, 1400 dollars. this is again, we still don't know exactly how Helix is going to play out.
launching their own first-party handheld as well, that would be the beginning of whatever the next ecosystem design that they're tackling will be. How they will approach Helix would theoretically then have to appear
have to appear as of the handheld because if it didn't just launching another device that doesn't fit into what they're trying to do with their console box. So all of this just feels like
the there was there were plans plans have changed and they're currently sort be but obviously as you know console development hardware development has a very long ramp-up time. It takes a long
and I think the current situation with the volatility of prices component shortage all of these things as well as like the current market situation the change in management there's so many balls in the air right now
that it's probably become pretty difficult I guess to figure out where to risk because of how long it takes to make you can't just keep pushing it back. Like if you push this back to 2029 20
2030 even whatever like you can't just arbitrarily start adding stuff to the originally was it just risks being more outdated. so like there's got to be a point in here and I'm sure that's what they're
trying to figure out is like where are they going to launch this how can they afford to do it and clearly I guess still like what is it going to be and I suspect it has changed a bit from
planning and it probably is going to be a bit more console like than maybe we first thought but then again that gets into to be there's just so many questions because right now Microsoft is in a very
weak position in this console market in terms of hardware they're not necessarily weak in terms of software I would say like I still think that their business seems okay in terms of to a degree but
>> oh man I don't know that the Xbox question right now just seems incredibly difficult to solve. I don't know how they get out of this and create a new product that people want. And I think part of it is
going to come down to uh PlayStation making a mistake. To a degree. Not everything, but this is the same we talked about this the other day, Rich, where AMD really is killing it in the CPU
And a lot of that is their own work, but then another portion of it was Intel dropping the ball. They took advantage of Intel making mistakes and they were able to leverage that. Nvidia hasn't really made mistakes, I
would say. They have made mistakes, but in a way that benefits AMD not so much. not been able to pull push the Radeon line ahead to create that same sort of lead that the CPU uh the Ryzen CPUs have. Microsoft is in this position
right now with PlayStation. And even though Sony is making mistakes, somehow [laughter] and making a lot of money, which is really interesting. So, like if I'm Microsoft and I'm just looking at this,
like this is this is such a hard problem to solve. And so, all we can do here is speculate based on the stuff we're seeing, things that we knew to be true in the past, but maybe aren't true now. And just kind of like spitball where
they might go because we don't know and this is a very hard problem. And I'm sure right now internally at Microsoft, they probably haven't really decided yet either. Like I'm sure there's like plans and timelines on the table, but maybe
it's still figuring out like what where are we going with this? course is that in theory, I mean it might be the case that the handheld is a lower volume device and um it could be that the volume is lower than expected.
>> Well, [laughter] yeah, that is the Yes. I mean, that's the whole thing at the moment. If you can't produce any kind of consumer electronic um device that has memory and storage, then yeah, it's all everything's so expensive.
>> They've got to start making moves more carefully here, I feel. Like this has been the Xbox problem for a while now where they're just putting stuff out and messages, and then when it fails, they walk it back and they do something else.
walk it back and they do something else. Like right now with, say, the Gears situation. We don't know what what's going on with E day. We sales, the state of the coalition. But if there were something to happen to the
exclusive, what kind of message would that send? Like they they need to like commit to decisions and find a way to the right move, even if they even if internally there was some issues, they
still got to stick to something for a while and actually try to see things through. You can't just keep reacting to stuff and like twisting and turning all over the place because that is shaking consumer
like confidence in a big way. >> Mhm, yeah. Well, I'm hoping that when the time is right, Microsoft will come forward and be transparent about stuff. >> Yeah. >> to the Xbox Series S.
March 2020 just before just before the pandemic really kicked off. Um we were there to see Series X, right? And then we had an interview with Andrew Goosen, who was the the the chief
architect of the Xbox consoles. And he basically said I he just sat down and why we're doing this. Um because there was a lot of confusion would be putting out a four teraflop console when they've got a six teraflop
one on the market. And the reasons were compelling. They were completely transparent about the costs of making a console. I guess they, they just couldn't really predict how bad it would get. But you know, they
literally came out and said, "We've got issues with this. We don't think we can cost reduce Xbox Series X. This is why we've made the Xbox Series S." So what it was was first of all, the only major consumer electronics company that I was
aware of actually talking about the realities of cost advances to and the problems with upcoming process nodes and the expense factor. And secondly, the expense factor. And secondly, explaining strategy. And um the concept
that um it's kind of got muddied in the water somewhat in recent years. Um so, you know, just having a strategy and uh communicating it effectively is going to be crucial with the Helix
>> Um any final thoughts, Oliver? >> No, not too much. I'm looking forward to next-generation consoles, but I'm not in any particular rush to see them. Perhaps that's for selfish reasons cuz I have enough on my plate already.
>> it's also just you know, I think I think we can afford to wait. I think that there's enough other stuff going on right now. in a pretty good position broadly speaking with regards to how they're
running like lots of software that we're seeing recently. You have PS4 Pro and see new consoles, but um I hope Microsoft sticks it. And I hope it is a proper console as seems to be the case based on
recent reporting and not some like bizarre PC hybrid. Enjoy your Windows, Timmy, kind of thing. I don't like that. [laughter]
delaying next gen because it's uh slightly problematic to your workflow is is is so unfair. >> use a breather. >> Well, I don't know. Yeah. I don't know. I don't want to be selfish. No, I I I
think next gen is just a thing that doesn't make sense right now. >> to make it work, it would just have to be like essentially the Pro Pro. You know, where it's just like because how many studios can even afford to just
target these machines? Not many. Who's going to do it? Probably not many. Like and there's not much that I think can be done right now technologically that couldn't exist on the current consoles as it is.
>> So, like the bigger I've said it many times, the bigger bottleneck is just the point. And the traditional console market just doesn't really work anymore for that reason. Like games just can't be made at
the speed they used to. And so the console cycles had to change. >> Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Um, okay, let's move on. Stamos. >> [laughter]
>> Has Microsoft said anything about third-party expandability options for storage in the Series bit them in the ass and I bet they'll support BYO SSD options like the uh PS5 does. I guess that's buy your own. But if Microsoft
you think they'll support other expansion options like additional RAM slots? Take a screwdriver to it like you would on the PS5, but now here's a PCI slot for you to add your own GPU. Replace the PSU while you're at it. Um,
yeah, um, it's quite a jump to go from uh proprietary storage to what uh Full House's John Stamos is is saying here. I think on the one hand, um,
if it is embracing a more PC-like architecture and uh with the option of maybe having people like Asus, MSI making their own Helix PCs, expansion, but the concept of having additional RAM slots I don't think would
work with that particular design. Um, and I don't know where else you'd go beyond that. I don't know what you would put in a PCIe slot on a system like thinking about it if it's running full fat Windows. Um, Oliver, what do you
think about expandability? I do think proprietary devices and storage are certainly not a good idea. >> Yeah, I think proprietary drives in general are not a good idea like you indicated. I think M.2 makes a lot more
sense. I was more open to the idea that Xbox proprietary drives would be a cool the issue has just been there's not really a use case for wanting like this weird little cartridge-shaped drive stick out of your
cartridge-shaped drive stick out of your console at all times. And uh ultimately like I don't really transfer games much between systems. I feel like that's use. So, might as well use the popular commodity format that actually has some
reasonable competition and actually gets drive prices lower. Um for other expansion options, you know, the these are complicated because the architecture of the system. So, it's going to have an SSC without PCA expansion for the GPU.
At least without like, you know, a PCA slot, that kind of expansion. Maybe it's have PCA expansion for other things like storage, but um not for the GPU. I can't expect. It's going to probably have soldered, you
know, fighter RAM, so no room room for RAM expansion. And the PSU might well be replaceable, but it's not going to be a commodity PSU with like cables you need to tuck out of the way or something. It's going to be a
a custom part that maybe you can order in and replace, but stuff, but this is just the way consoles are, and this is just what makes sense for the systems. And ultimately, you don't want people
walking around with maximally configurable Xbox Helix devices, and different specs, and now we're just back in PC land, which has its own issues, not console land. I'd prefer to stay in console land.
>> Mhm. John? >> Yeah, I think that's probably the case. Like even if there's PC compatibility, I don't expect them to make a fully modular kind of system. I think it would be at the absolute maximum closer to
what Valve has done with like Steam Machine and Steam Deck, where they're kind of modifiable, but I don't even think they're going to go that far. and it you can still do a PC-like experience without that.
swap all these parts around, then the PC is right right there for you. But so like even suggesting like here's a PCI slot for your own GPU.
All right, how would that look case-wise? You got a PCI slot. Okay, now you want to put a big GPU in there, where's it going to go? How are they going to make the case to fit this? Like, none of this makes sense when you
parts in there because they're just like they're not going to make a case for the Helix so big that it can take whatever parts you want to put in it cuz then it's just a PC case. So, and it would
>> [snorts] >> So, I I would like to see them go to the BYO think make sense. Uh even though Microsoft traditionally
guess. Um I mean even but then again Sony also used to have a pretty checkered history. I mean PS3, PS4, PS5, they were open to I mean PS3, PS4, PS5, they were open to like any parts but like their handhelds
memory stick pro duo pro or whatever pro duo and then of which was one of the biggest mistakes they made. but it's a shame that the the price
situation around the proprietary SSDs for Xbox never really got under control because I always liked that form factor a lot. beautiful little card that just slots in there. Um
man, very very cool but obviously in the end it's just too expensive to support >> Mhm. >> Yeah, it's really interesting because um the solution of saying, "Hey, if you've got a PCIE 4.0 drive, just stick it in
go." So, there was a there was less flexibility there because you couldn't move your games about as you could with the Xbox solution but you know, in the real world how many how many times did you actually need to move your games
about? And it kind of makes sense if you've got maybe a Series X in one location and a Series S elsewhere. So, you could like move your games about that way but you know, it's kind of like a fringe certainly it's it's a fringe
case scenario and not one where you'd want to build your your sort of design around it. Um the only other thing that springs to mind about the concept of having um PCIe expandability on a on a console is
that well, guess what? It's actually been done. I've got a little uh prop for been done. I've got a little uh prop for you here. This is the Ryzen 7 4700S, which is a mini ITX board that is based on the PlayStation 5 APU. Uh the GPU is
locked off, but the CPU is there. And um you might wonder why didn't we ever >> [clears throat] >> your PCI bandwidth for the GPU is so low, it's basically uh inoperable as a game games machine. So, it was you know,
this APU was never designed to run as a PC, but you know, AMD did it anyway, and it basically was not very good. The 4800S, which we did review, uh was based on the Series X silicon, had a few more PCIe lanes that you know, did make a a
GPU more viable. And um but ultimately, it was a very limited design. So, um if Phoenix is going to be within like um third-party PCs, they've got to you know, basically have enough um expandability within the
SOC uh to to make that viable. And maybe they will, you know, um it's certainly a very different SOC to what we've seen in um this generation. I guess that's all I got to say about that. So, let's move on.
from Regardless. Hello Jets! Exclamation point. With all the depressing talk about the current and near future state of GPUs, RAM, and storage, what about CPUs? Will they stagnate as well, or will we see actual progress on that
front in 2027? Cheers. Um I think we are we are going to see some progress, and it's potentially very good news. Intel has um Nova Lake coming out. Um there's been lots of leaks about that, but essentially, um they're
seemingly leading with a new design uh with a whole lot of cores and a whole lot of cash. So, it should actually bring um gaming performance into line, maybe even better than what AMD is doing with the X3D chips. And I believe that
with the X3D chips. And I believe that AMD itself does have Zen 6 cooking, we kind of kind of like go start seeing that in 2027. Um Oliver, I I think the problem here isn't so much stagnation in terms of new
products, it's stagnation in terms of people being able to afford a new PC at >> Because the CPU is just one part of the ecosystem, wherein basically everything else, apart from the motherboard perhaps, is like stupendously expensive
at this point. >> Yeah, obviously RAM, storage, the GPU, which obviously contains its own RAM. Those are obviously big price drivers in PC land. CPU is not as much, but you
never know. I I know there are some there's some scuttlebutt about maybe allocations are being moved around. I don't know. everything because uh you need a lot of CPUs for various
kinds of AI workloads, and you end up in a situation where maybe there isn't direct competition for consumer parts, nor is there direct competition for consumer dies, but there is this sort of like
like balancing act of where does Intel's or AMD's CPU allocation go at any given quarter, right? And that's something we fine, but who knows if that changes. I don't
know, but at least there isn't direct competition. competition for instance for the memory modules that go into consumer RAM products. There is direct competition in some cases for consumer GPU dies. Um
there is direct competition for some of these these things. In CPU land, there isn't direct competition for like a 9800X3D CPU die. That's not of any interest, I don't think. Well, there is inter- I mean, the CCDs, I guess, but
mean, there's not as [laughter] much interest in the overall CPU. but yeah, Zen Zen 6 is next year. Uh Nova Lake is supposed to be later this year, last I heard. That was CES. I
>> But it should be out soon. Both products should be out soon. And yeah, if there is a meaningful upgrade, you know, if Zen 6 is like plus 15%, plus 20%, who knows? That would be pretty cool. I don't feel like
we're in a huge crisis of CPU performance at the moment though on PC. perhaps. But I think we're in pretty good a pretty all right state and I I don't really expect there to be any next
generation CPU on the horizon that's going to be more than like a, you know, plus 10%, plus 15%, plus 20%, whatever. Cuz that's just the nature of the market at the moment. >> Mhm. John?
>> Yeah, I actually think CPUs are probably in one of the healthier states right now and it's not the main bottleneck on purchasing price for anything. Cuz I mean, CPUs are less about like transistor scaling and and node
shrinkage, right? It's more architectural improvements and cash and power efficiency and various other factors that go into just improving the overall architecture. And as a result,
continue to see the types of improvements you said and similar what you say and Oliver is probably in like the 10 to 20% IPC gains across the we would hope, something like that. Pretty pretty typical. Like I don't
think it's going to be anything super exciting, but it seems like CPUs are fine. And as far as next generation consoles, that actually might be the area that benefits the most because that is one area I think they can comfortably
scale those up and get a pretty significant jump without breaking the >> Mhm. And I'm sure they're looking for those types of wins right now given everything going on or have looked at that. So like I feel like that we could
as well. Which I think is cool. Which I think is cool. Um so yeah, very different from GPU situation which has huge constraints on it, the RAM situation, storage.
All of those are are really the limitation right now. And I think that's a little bit funny cuz like, you know, CPU was like the big thing that you would purchase in your PC for the longest time. That was the expensive
part. You got your CPU and everything else is you built for that. And now >> much less pricey and like that's not the big [laughter] uh
uh very very interesting spot. And I think the competition I mentioned earlier between Intel and AMD has basically meant that they're both putting out pretty good products right now.
I think you could be happy with either an AMD or an Intel CPU. gains you would expect and the prices seem pretty stable. So, um happy days if you're a CPU manufacturer, I guess.
>> Right. Yeah, I mean there is basically X3D and everything else in terms of gaming performance. But yeah, I mean there are some very strong products. The latest Intel products are actually just very very well priced. You can't really
>> Yeah, they're affordable, good system or CPUs. >> Yeah, absolutely. Okay, let's move on. A question from Darshako in brackets Dan, is there any chance that QSSIR was less a philanthropic expedition?
>> [laughter] >> And more of a firefighting exercise once Sony got wind that FSR 4 would be coming to all Xbox consoles. Well, I wonder whether Sony's relationship with AMD is so close now that perhaps they had an
agreement that FSR 4 would not be released more broadly, i.e. onto Xbox, etc. And so Sony had it in some form on both PS5 and PS5 Pro. I.e. isn't the timing highly suggestive of the latter? Um yeah, I mean
the concept of FSR 4 coming to Xbox is nothing new. So, as soon as an eight version was was available like there was last year via available like there was last year via the link via the leak rather, Um, it was
only just a matter of time before, um, uh, there would be an Xbox iteration because it has innate support. So, you know, it took a year plus for, uh, QSSR to come along and for an RDNA, a fully validated RDNA 2 solution to come along.
So, I I'm I'm not quite sure QSSR was ever a philanthropic expedition, but, uh, Sony would have been well aware that FSR 4 would have been coming at some FSR 4 would have been coming at some point to, uh, Xbox without having uh,
any sort of confidentiality breaches. Uh, I should say that, you know, from from what I've learned from speaking to, um, people who make consoles, AMD is very, very, um, good actually sort of, um, dealing with
each of its, uh, partners separately and distinctively. No sort of sly winking hints as to what the other one is doing. It just doesn't fundamentally, uh, the end of the relationship if it
was the case. >> They're not IBM rich. >> [laughter] >> That's a crazy story. Uh, but yes, as I see it. I think, you know, ultimately,
they saw it was viable and they could do a good job of it. And I think it's to PlayStation lead is so huge in terms of like unit sales and and and whatnot. Um,
extent does does the console war actually exist anymore? Well, I could certainly say that whenever I've spoken to Mark Cerny about console design, he he's he's never at all interested in speaking about what the other guys are
doing. He's razor focused on on PlayStation. And, um, you know, because uh, what would it gain him to to be any would it gain him to to be any different? Um, John, thoughts? I mean,
you know, there's a there's a certain way of of reading the market. And ultimately, when you're an an outsider looking in, there is the temptation to come up with your own narratives as opposed to, you
know, understanding how things actually work. like uh Sony did X to block Y from happening here. But I'm sure there was, you know, Sony's collaboration may have
helped fund some of the technology in the research here with AMD. It's this And uh maybe this gives them a slight priority, but even that it's hard to say. But it's it's not like it wouldn't
be worked on with other partners. It's not like Microsoft was just sitting there twiddling their thumbs while Sony's doing these stuff. Like they're such. Uh so of course they're going to be
working with AMD to do something for it. And it this seems to they seem to have it's just they're kind of sticking with AMD's own branding by calling it FSR 4 where Sony sort of did its own
spun up its own iteration of things in such a way that they kind of and everything. But yeah, I think it was just like here about them making decisions to spite one
another per se. And I don't think anything with PSSR And I don't think anything with PSSR QSSR was done to stop AMD and Microsoft >> [laughter] >> Uh anything to add, Oliver?
>> No, just to say it seems like a pretty obvious extension of their work on PSSR. Um you know, if something like PSSR can work in FP16, then why not port it? Um Sony would probably have had an idea that FSR 4 was being ported to other AMD
architectures. I don't know, but um ultimately like Rich indicated, I'm not sure the day-to-day machinations of the Xbox team matter a great deal to Sony. I think they're really focused on making the
have enough consumer buying at this point to not treat Xbox like a one-to-one competitor. Back in the days of Xbox 360 and PS3, certainly Microsoft and Sony were neck
and neck. And they were one-to-one competitors. And what Microsoft did, you know, moved one direction, Sony would have to move the other, and it was a like a very intricate dance. And obviously that generation ended up with
substantially similar footing. But that old console war narrative is just not the console war we've had for the last two generations. way, and I don't think we should really treat it that way, either.
>> Mhm, absolutely. All right, let's move on. Um, we've got a question here from Souls 22. With AMD backporting FSR 4.1 to RDNA 2 and Sony releasing QSSR, do you think that it's likely that Nintendo would do
a revision of their custom DLSS implementation that developers could implementation that developers could take advantage of on Switch 2? Uh, going because man, whenever there's a you Switch 2 game coming along, you sure
lot of DLSS. [laughter] >> Yeah. I think you know, there's my take on it is that, um, what we've got is kind of good enough. It would certainly be great to see
uh, revisions, improvements. I'm not sure the extent to which the hardware is capable, but we've said that in the past and been proven wrong. So, >> Yeah, I think it's more likely than not that we'll see some kind of revisions,
if we haven't seen it revisions already, indeed, to the Switch 2's DLSS upscalers. Um, but I wouldn't expect it to come in the form of a big announcement. I would just expect it to be deployed
quietly, somewhere in the system. And it's possible that we've seen such revisions already. We just haven't noticed. I would contest the idea, though, that maybe is embedded in this question, but that revision would
actually be significant. Because upsclaer revisions, you know, in line with like the DLSS point releases that we've seen throughout the various generations of Nvidia's upscaler can be very minor.
They can correct weird edge case behavior. They can They can be fairly iterative upgrades that you wouldn't necessarily notice, right? Outside of an A to B comparison with known upscaler
pretty hard to distinguish from just the normal sea of like implementation things like that that might go into a comparison like that. Um but you know, if you go to the Sony and and these side of things, they do
talk about their upscalers a lot for their various console projects and like >> [snorts] >> Nintendo is not like that, you know? They just don't want to do it. They And did they disclose that DLSS is in
the console? I'm not even sure that Nintendo mentioned that DLSS is in the console in any of their materials. So, it really is just like uh style. And I would I honestly I wouldn't expect to know without some developer
leak that there were um new models for people to play with. >> Mhm. Anything to add, John? >> Uh I think Nintendo forgot that DLSS is >> So, somebody should remind them. So, like, "Hey guys, you know you have this
really cool functionality, right?" And see if they can learn to use it. That but now realistically, I mean there there could be updates to the stuff on the SDK side.
Um but I also don't think Nintendo's prioritizing it right now other than maybe pleasing third-party developers perhaps that do want to use it. But I mean, they're not
SDK stuff doesn't stay frozen. There's always work going on to improve that And I'm sure this is going to be a factor of it since DLSS is a part of the Um so, strategically, there's no reason not to just
can. But I don't think we're going to see any like major major leaps here. Uh Uh, nothing that drastically alters what it can do. And we're not going to see newer features.
see proper Nvidia frame generation, for instance. I don't think we're We obviously won't be seeing stuff like which [snorts] not that we would necessarily want to, but
>> Not a chance. Um, but improvements to the current models, yeah, that's possible. >> Mhm. I mean, uh, specifically I'd really like to see an improvement to the uh, the tiny DLSS. Um, cuz it can look a bit
was it Fast RMX? >> Oh, yeah. >> Um, oof. Where it's it's it really kind of shows that it's not not particularly Um, and I just was just thinking back to
actually Alex's analysis of uh, the switch to DLSS where the the the conclusion seemed to be in most cases, please use the tiny DLSS in handheld mode and don't use it in desktop mode and
um, or other TV mode, to be more precise. And um, I think that kind of bears out when you look at what how Capcom is using it. Seems like DLSS is basically the CNN model in their games and it's producing
some fantastic results there, but certainly if they can do something about the cheaper version, I think that would be pretty good. But that was the final of the show. So please do like, subscribe and share all that usual
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