[0:00] (dramatic music) [0:03] - A man has been found lying dead [0:05] at the side of the road with oozing, [0:07] elongated wounds to his back. [0:09] To solve the murder, [0:10] a local official calls all the farmers in the village [0:13] and demands they all bring their tools to the main square. [0:16] In the square, each man is set to lay down his sickle. [0:19] And then something curious starts to happen. [0:23] In the rising heat of the morning, flies begin to descend, [0:26] all landing on a single sickle. [0:29] Its owner buckles, [0:30] falling to his knees and admits to murder. [0:36] This is from a 1247 book, [0:38] "The Washing Away of Wrongs" by Song Ci. [0:40] And it's the first writing we have [0:42] of an empirical approach to forensics. [0:44] But okay, big deal. [0:46] Anyone could have just swapped the sickles [0:47] or used their neighbor's. [0:50] But forensics today are much more accurate, right? [0:54] Fingerprints support investigations in over 70% of murders [0:58] and DNA evidence in more than 90%. [1:00] But then you also read an article like [1:02] "Hair sample that put men into prison for 28 years, [1:06] turned out to be dog hair." [1:07] - That is not science. [1:09] That is not justice. [1:10] - See, in 2009, the National Academy of Sciences [1:13] published this 350 page report stating that, [1:17] with the exception of nuclear DNA analysis, [1:19] no forensic method has been rigorously shown [1:22] to consistently demonstrate a connection [1:24] between evidence and a specific individual. [1:26] And they also said that some tests [1:28] do not meet the fundamental requirements of science. [1:31] So we ask people to rank five famous forensic techniques, [1:34] all of which are still being used in court. [1:38] Okay, five forensic techniques here. [1:39] And I just need you to rank them in order [1:41] of accuracy from the least accurate down here [1:43] to the most accurate. [1:44] So what do you think? [1:45] - I don't know if I'm gonna nail these. [1:47] - Whoa. I dunno. [1:48] - I don't know what forensic to put first here. [1:50] - Okay, hair. What are you thinking? [1:52] - I think hair is last, eh? [1:53] - I would probably put the hair on the top two. [1:57] - I feel like hair would probably be the easiest to, [2:00] - To fake? - To fake, if you like. [2:01] - I think hair at the bottom, [2:04] because if it's not got the follicle intact, [2:05] just hair in general. [2:07] - Mm. - Do you think? [2:08] - Yeah. - Yeah. [2:09] (dramatic music) [2:11] - Hair has always been an object of interest [2:13] for crime scene investigators. [2:15] And before DNA, they would look [2:17] for the microscopic similarities in the surface [2:19] and the cross section of hairs to try and get a match. [2:22] For example, analyzing how rough the fish scale [2:25] like structure of the surface of the hair is, [2:27] or how the pigment is distributed through the hair shaft. [2:30] - [Announcer] The examiner's trained eye [2:31] can learn many things. [2:33] Is it human hair? Of what race? [2:35] Animal hair? What family? [2:37] This vital information may help [2:39] to establish guilt or innocence [2:41] - Between the 1970s and 1999, [2:44] the FBI used this against defendants in 268 cases. [2:49] But when they later reexamined this using DNA as evidence, [2:52] it completely flipped the field on its head, [2:55] and it turned out that even the most experienced FBI [2:58] examiners would routinely claim they had a match [3:00] between hairs that were from two different people. [3:02] And they sometimes couldn't even tell the difference [3:04] between a human hair and a dog hair. [3:07] (dog barking) [3:08] Out of those 268 cases that used microscopic hair analysis, [3:12] 96% were declared false. [3:15] 33 people were already sentenced to death, [3:17] and nine were already executed [3:19] by the time the errors were found. [3:21] Today, the FBI only uses hair as evidence [3:24] if it can be supported by DNA testing, [3:26] which is why microscopic hair analysis [3:28] goes to the bottom of this list. [3:30] What do you think of bite marks? [3:31] - On a crime scene? - On a crime scene? [3:32] - Yeah, yeah. - It's been... [3:33] Dracula, is Dracula there? [3:34] - Least accurate is gonna be [3:36] pretty close to bite marks, I think. [3:38] - Midway. [3:39] - Midway? - Last. [3:40] That's last. [3:41] That's not realistic, innit? - Okay. Okay. [3:43] Mm. [3:44] Bite marks at the top. [3:45] The idea behind bite marks is simple. [3:47] If you can use dental records to identify a deceased person, [3:50] surely you can identify a perpetrator [3:52] by the bite marks left on a victim. [3:54] Since the 1950s, [3:55] bite mark analysis has been used in thousands of cases. [3:59] But then some experts, like forensic dentist Mary Bush, [4:02] started looking into the method more deeply. [4:05] - There was no scientific exploration [4:08] into bite marks before they were used in the court of law [4:11] to say that this was even a feasible [4:13] technique that you could do. [4:15] - One study from the university at Buffalo [4:17] used a set of model teeth to create [4:19] 89 bite marks in cadavers, [4:21] alongside controlled bite marks made in wax. [4:24] And out of those 89 bite marks made in skin, [4:27] none of them matched the measurements [4:28] of the ones made in wax or the original model teeth. [4:31] In fact, when they compared the bite marks in skin [4:34] to a wider collection of 411 model teeth, [4:37] it wasn't even the original model that made the bite mark [4:40] that was the closest match. [4:42] After 12 studies, their conclusion, [4:45] bite mark transfer to skin is not reliable. [4:48] Skin isn't a good medium [4:49] to leave an imprint of someone's bite mark. [4:51] It's soft, it's squishy, and it distorts under pressure. [4:54] But despite all this, there's still been no ban [4:57] and bite mark evidence is still allowed in courts worldwide. [5:00] We asked Dr. Bush for a comment [5:02] and she said that while the scientific method [5:04] is happy to discard an old and disproven theory, [5:08] the justice system prefers consistency [5:09] in a historical precedent. [5:11] So even the new flurry of evidence wasn't enough [5:13] to get bite marks out of court. [5:15] In fact, bite marks have been used as evidence [5:17] as recently as 2025, [5:19] which is why it gets the second worst spot on our list. [5:23] Blood, if you don't have DNA [5:24] and you're just using like kind of the patterns [5:26] that it leaves along the ground. [5:27] How they splat. - Right? [5:28] - [Gregor] Like the picture, [5:29] that blood on a crime scene could give you. [5:31] - Okay. - I'm looking, [5:32] thinking of putting blood at the end, [5:33] but like, I don't know. - Okay. [5:34] Put blood at the end. - Okay. [5:35] - I would go blood then [5:36] - Second. - Second place. [5:37] - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [5:38] - So bloodstain pattern analysis. [5:40] When someone is injured, the way their blood pools [5:43] and drips into the environment is in a distinct pattern. [5:45] And in 2020, "Wired" actually did an episode [5:48] with a crime scene analyst [5:49] on how these different stains can be interpreted. [5:52] You can use physics and biology to rewind the clock [5:55] and extrapolate where in space [5:57] the blood must have come from. [5:59] This all started in 1971 when chemist, [6:01] Herbert Leon MacDonell, published [6:03] "Flight Characteristics and Stain Patterns of Human Blood." [6:06] In this book, MacDonell described how you can use [6:08] the width and length of a stain [6:10] to calculate the angle of impact, [6:12] and then using trigonometry, [6:14] trace that back to the point of origin of the spatter. [6:18] The book quickly became the foundation [6:20] of bloodstain pattern analysis, [6:21] and everyone was using it. [6:23] In fact, MacDonell even established a Bloodstain Institute [6:26] where thousands of US police officers would enroll. [6:29] The Supreme Court of Iowa actually referred to the practice [6:32] as relatively uncomplicated. [6:34] So they didn't require proof of its reliability. [6:37] They were happy to go ahead with MacDonell's tests [6:39] that he did alone in his basement. [6:42] And soon enough, bloodstain pattern analysis [6:44] was used in courts all over the states. [6:48] But here's the problem. [6:49] Plotting the flight path of each bloodstain [6:51] using trigonometry assumes the trajectories [6:53] were straight lines and gives this common origin point, [6:57] which suggests the victim was standing up. [7:00] The issue is, [7:01] MacDonell and then many forensic investigators after him [7:04] and even "Wired," failed to account [7:05] for the effects of gravity and drag [7:07] as obvious as this sounds. [7:09] When you include these in your calculations, [7:11] the common origin point lowers, [7:13] and you can see that in this example. [7:14] It's more likely that the victim was actually sitting down. [7:18] The first study to measure the baseline reliability [7:21] of bloodstain pattern analysis was only done in 2014. [7:25] That's over 50 years [7:27] after it started being admitted in court. [7:29] And a large scale study from 2021 found that analysts [7:32] come to different conclusions about a way a stain was made, [7:35] about 8% of the time. [7:36] And that's because the same stain [7:37] can come from many different mechanisms. [7:39] And the fact that blood differs from person to person, [7:42] depending on how many red blood cells [7:43] versus the plasma you have. [7:45] Men actually tend to have a 15% higher concentration [7:48] of blood cells than women, [7:50] which makes their blood more viscous. [7:52] Nowadays, investigators have new software [7:54] which uses fluid dynamics [7:56] to help them map these complex 3D seams. [7:58] So bloodstain pattern analysis is improving in accuracy, [8:02] which is why it gets this middle spot in our list. [8:04] Okay. [8:05] But surely fingerprints [8:07] must have a lot of value in identification. [8:09] How unique do you think fingerprints are? [8:11] - I think they're pretty accurate. [8:13] - They're fingerprints. - Fingerprints. [8:14] - That's probably one. - That's number one. [8:15] - Yeah. - Okay. Okay. [8:16] I mean, yeah, you use fingerprints on your phone, [8:18] you unlock it, you pay stuff, right? [8:19] - 'Cause fingerprints are unique. [8:21] Even when you have a passport, [8:22] like they scan you when you enter a country. [8:25] - On March 11th, 2004, [8:27] a terrorist organization operating in Madrid [8:29] set off explosions on four commuter trains. [8:32] The attack killed 193 people and injured thousands more. [8:37] Quickly after, the police found a finger mark [8:39] on a detonator bag left behind, [8:41] and they matched it to Brandon Mayfield, [8:43] a lawyer in Oregon. [8:45] There's only one problem, [8:47] there are no records of Mayfield even leaving the US. [8:50] He doesn't even own a passport. [8:52] So how could he have pulled this off? [8:55] - I honestly felt like I was being framed [8:57] because I hadn't been outta the country for over 10 years, [9:00] - But despite that, the fingerprint evidence against him [9:02] was considered so damning that Mayfield was incarcerated. [9:06] But this wasn't a glitch. [9:08] It was built into the method from the start. [9:10] (groovy music) [9:12] In 1890s Kolkata, [9:13] the city's rich career criminals were avoiding jail [9:15] by paying people to serve sentences for them. [9:18] It was a good tactic since, at the time, [9:20] there was no practical way to identify a person. [9:23] So the criminals were getting away with it. [9:25] Three officers, Edward Henry, Azizul Haque [9:27] and Hem Chandra Bose [9:28] started taking the prints [9:29] of everyone who came through the station, [9:32] but they quickly ran into a problem. [9:34] When they got a suspect in, [9:37] how could they crosscheck their prints [9:39] against their own database [9:40] when there were 10 prints per person [9:42] and thousands of people coming through? [9:44] They needed a classification system. [9:47] Haque proposed that they should look at [9:49] whether a fingerprint has a whirl. [9:51] It's the spiral pattern [9:52] that a person might have on their fingers. [9:54] And because each of your 10 digits [9:56] can either have a whirl or not, [9:59] there are a total of two to the power of 10 [10:01] or 1024 ways your whirls can be arranged. [10:05] So the officers just built 1024 wooden pigeonholes [10:09] to organize these fingerprints. [10:13] Okay. [10:13] But what if like me, you don't have a whirl? [10:15] Well, two thirds of the population actually don't. [10:18] So the system had to go further. [10:20] Once you have a pigeonhole number, [10:21] you go for additional layers of identification. [10:24] Some of the additional categories [10:25] that you could assign included whether you had a plain arch, [10:28] which was denoted with the letter A, [10:30] or whether you had a tented arch, [10:32] which was denoted with a T. [10:34] Similarly, you could look at which side [10:36] of the finger this loop structure is on. [10:38] And with a few more identifiers like these, [10:41] we get a much more in-depth classification, [10:44] one that would go on to be used for the next 100 years. [10:48] Famously, the world's first fingerprint bureau, [10:51] which was established in London in the New Scotland Yard, [10:54] used this fingerprinting system. [10:56] - I started in 1988 with Metropolitan Police [10:59] in forensic services. [11:01] - Could you paint a picture of what the room [11:04] would've looked like with all these pigeonholes? [11:06] How big was this space? [11:07] - So we're looking at a space of about [11:10] 30 to 40 meters in length [11:12] and about 10 to 20 meters in width. [11:15] The collection at the time was about [11:18] 3 to 4 million I think. [11:19] - That is intense. [11:20] Yeah, that's wow. [11:21] - It's a lot of fingerprints. [11:24] - Now, today's system takes into account [11:27] these little details along the ridges. [11:29] It's called friction ridge analysis. [11:31] And well, it's no surprise that [11:32] combing through pigeon holes for these would've taken weeks, [11:35] but online databases today can basically do it in minutes. [11:37] (phone ringing) [11:41] No way this phone works. [11:44] Hello? - Howdy, Gregor. [11:46] Just trying to get a hold of you. [11:47] - Why are you calling me through this thing? [11:49] (caller speaks faintly) [11:50] You have no data? [11:51] Just get Saily. [11:53] - You know, I travel a lot for filming. [11:54] I actually just got to London. [11:58] I always wanna be able to connect to the internet [12:00] as soon as I land, [12:01] and with the help of today's sponsor, Saily, [12:04] it couldn't be easier. [12:06] First, you just scan the QR code and download the Saily app, [12:09] then you search your destination, the UK, for example. [12:12] And next you just pick a data plan. [12:14] And finally, during checkout, [12:15] apply the coupon code Veritasium [12:16] to get your exclusive 15% discount. [12:19] No more dodgy cafe wifi or unexpected roaming charges. [12:24] All you need to do is just [12:25] switch on your mobile data when you land, [12:27] and that's it. [12:28] Saily works with all iPhone and Android devices. [12:30] And once an eSIM is installed, [12:33] you can keep adding plans in the app for each new trip. [12:36] And in the rare case that your phone [12:37] isn't compatible with Saily, [12:39] you can get a full refund at no questions asked. [12:42] I've gone with the Saily Ultra Plan, [12:43] which gets you unlimited data globally [12:45] with access to airport lounges, fast track services, [12:48] and NordVPN, NordPass, NordLocker and Incogni on top. [12:52] So to stay connected on the go for an affordable price, [12:54] you can scan this QR code, download Saily, [12:57] and get 15% off your plan with the coupon code Veritasium. [13:00] So I wanna thank Saily for sponsoring [13:02] this part of the video, [13:03] and now back to our case. [13:05] So if all the details are painstakingly placed [13:08] into these databases, then where's the problem? [13:12] How is Brandon Mayfield falsely accused? [13:15] Well, say you have a mark from a scene [13:17] and you wanna run it through the US fingerprint database, [13:20] you can't actually search the database using the whole mark [13:24] because you first need to identify [13:25] a number of features on the print. [13:28] These are called minutiae. [13:30] It's where the ridge line split or end. [13:33] - To even search the database, [13:36] you need a minimum number of minutiae points. [13:40] It's very efficiently sorted, [13:42] hundreds of million prints, [13:43] but it cannot make an ID. [13:45] So what it does, it pulls out the most similar ones, [13:49] at least 10, 20 up to 40 in some jurisdiction. [13:54] And then the human examiner has to compare. [13:58] - [Gregor] This works in theory, but the problem is [14:00] how these minutiae are identified in the first place. [14:04] - What is interesting in my research [14:06] published scientific reviewed research, [14:09] the same thing one examiner see only three minutiae [14:14] and one sees 10 minutiae. [14:16] So 10 minutiae is enough to run the database. [14:19] However, if the other are only the three minutiae, [14:23] they couldn't run it. [14:24] So whether you find a criminal or not [14:27] depends on the luck of the draw. [14:29] Even if you give the same pair of prints [14:31] to the same examiner twice, 10% of the time, [14:35] they will reach a different decision. [14:38] - And these disagreements are from controlled studies [14:41] where the examiners had no context about the crime, [14:44] but in reality, they often do. [14:46] As many as 42% of the requests [14:48] that fingerprint experts process [14:50] state whether a suspect has a criminal record. [14:53] - In a recent case that I was involved [14:57] where a firearm was involved [14:59] and a forensic firearm expert [15:02] had to decide whether a bullet was actually fired [15:06] on the firearm, on the suspect. [15:08] On the former submission form [15:11] that was given to the forensic scientist, [15:14] it said that it's homicide, [15:17] it said the age of the suspect and the victim, [15:20] and it even said the race. [15:22] It said the suspect is black, [15:24] and the person who died the victim was white. [15:28] - For over a century, [15:29] experts have held so much trust in fingerprints [15:32] that in the FBI case for Mayfield, [15:34] the examiners claimed with 100% certainty [15:37] that that was his mark. [15:39] This likely happened because when another fingerprint expert [15:41] was brought in to verify the match, [15:43] they probably already knew the verdict [15:45] of the original analyst, [15:47] and they probably also knew the stakes [15:49] of what a match could mean for the case, [15:51] which made it all the easier to agree [15:53] with the initial verdict. [15:55] Even the fingerprint expert working for the defense [15:57] agreed that the mark matched Mayfield's fingerprint [16:01] when in reality, it belonged to a man [16:03] who had links to terrorist organizations in Spain. [16:07] This is the impact of conformity bias. [16:09] - So all of this pressure, [16:10] all of this context and intervention [16:13] in the forensic science, [16:15] I say to the police and the prosecutor, [16:17] leave the forensic examiners alone. [16:21] Give them independence of mind [16:23] to make decision based on the relevant scientific evidence [16:28] and do the work rather than telling them about the case. [16:33] - Well, if there were issues [16:35] with all these other techniques, [16:37] why don't we just use, [16:38] - DNA? - DNA first? [16:40] - Yeah. [16:41] - DNA has got to be surely, - DNA should be top. [16:44] - It has to be DNA because, - Okay, okay. [16:46] - You already know everyone have their own DNA. [16:48] - But even DNA analysis can fall prey to the same problems. [16:52] Back in the 80s, [16:53] you had to do this with a sample the size [16:56] of a dime of blood or saliva. [16:58] But today you can do it with less than a pin hair's worth. [17:00] In fact, just this year a 61-year-old cold case [17:03] was solved with just 0.4 nanograms of DNA. [17:08] But the paradox is, the increasing sensitivity [17:11] of DNA analysis could also be its downfall. [17:15] In 2012, paramedics in California responded to a call [17:18] about a severely intoxicated homeless man. [17:21] They treated him and took him to the hospital, [17:24] but along the way, they also picked up traces [17:26] of his DNA on their equipment and gloves. [17:29] Then later that night, they responded to a murder [17:31] of a businessman and they accidentally transferred [17:34] the homeless man's DNA to the victim's fingernails. [17:38] Because of that, the homeless man, Lucas Anderson, [17:40] was charged with murder and he faced the death penalty [17:43] despite being hospitalized at the time the crime occurred. [17:46] He spent five months in jail [17:48] before charges were finally dropped. [17:51] - So this is trace DNA and touch DNA, [17:54] where you can get this kind of DNA transfer that happens. [17:57] - I see how that could be abused easily. [17:59] So my DNA could be in a place I've never been before. [18:01] - Yeah. [18:02] - And if DNA is deposited under the right conditions, [18:05] say a dark dry place, it can persist for hundreds of years. [18:10] - And if, for example, somebody touches a door handle, [18:14] well, loads of people are gonna be touching a door handle, [18:16] so you're definitely going to get [18:18] more than one profile off of there. [18:21] - [Gregor] These samples with multiple DNA profiles [18:23] are called DNA mixtures, [18:25] and they have been found to be [18:26] the most common source of error in DNA interpretation. [18:29] - Some people shed more cells than others, [18:32] so the majority of the DNA that you're getting [18:35] off of that door handle may not be [18:36] from the last person who touched it. [18:38] - The problem in interpreting a mixture [18:40] comes down to how a sample gets analyzed. [18:43] The most common way to do it [18:44] uses short tandem repeats or STRs. [18:48] DNA is made up of four nucleotides, [18:50] G, A, T and C. [18:52] And the SDR method looks at how chunks of DNA, [18:55] usually three to five nucleotides long [18:57] repeat in your genome. [18:59] For example, G-A-T-A, G-A-T-A and so on. [19:02] For one person, they might have G-A-T-A repeat six times, [19:06] whereas another individual might have nine repetitions. [19:10] A standard SDR test will look at around [19:13] 20 locations on your genome [19:14] for where these repeats can occur, [19:16] and it will count how many repeats [19:18] you have in each location. [19:20] - So if you are looking at 20 of these markers [19:23] and you've got one from mom and one from dad, [19:25] you're actually getting 40 different [19:27] genetic markers coming back. [19:29] So the chances of somebody having the same combination [19:34] of genetic markers as you is around one in a billion. [19:38] - Here's what a crime scene sample containing [19:39] just one contributor looks like on an STR test. [19:43] You can see how it's easy to compare this [19:44] to a sample from a suspect. [19:47] But if the crime scene sample contains DNA [19:49] from multiple individuals, [19:51] then their profiles will begin to overlap, [19:53] all with varying signal strengths. [19:55] And the more individuals in the mixture, [19:57] the more difficult these results are to interpret. [20:00] With four or more individuals, [20:01] it becomes increasingly hard to compare [20:03] a clean DNA profile from a suspect to the mixture. [20:07] And now it's hard to say whether the suspect [20:09] was actually in the sample. [20:10] You just can't tell which peak belongs to who. [20:13] It's kind of like having five people talk to you [20:15] at the same time. [20:17] You can hear all the noise, [20:18] but it's really hard to single one out. [20:20] Now, some labs claim they can reliably separate samples [20:24] of up to five individuals. [20:26] And to test this, [20:27] the National Institute of Standards and Technology [20:30] ran a controlled study in 2013. [20:33] They've sent out a DNA mixture from a fictional crime scene [20:35] to labs all across the US. [20:37] Their aim to see how different facilities [20:40] interpret the same mixture of four people's DNA profiles. [20:44] 69% of the labs got the analysis wrong. [20:47] And despite the sample being deliberately complex, [20:50] only 21% of the labs deemed the mix inconclusive [20:54] and not possible to give a comparison on. [20:56] After NIST published the study, [20:58] new checks have been imposed to address some of the issues, [21:01] but there's still no lower limit [21:03] on the quality or the quantity of a DNA sample [21:05] that labs are permitted to analyze. [21:08] And labs themselves still decide [21:10] if something is too mixed or too partial. [21:13] Now, you might think that [21:14] using the entire sequence genome would be better, [21:17] but that can actually introduce different kinds of problems. [21:20] Now, your analyst has access to hair color, [21:22] eye color, ethnicity, [21:24] and that could introduce discrimination [21:25] in the way the sample is being analyzed. [21:28] - This is where the guidelines [21:29] and the guardrails have to come in here. [21:32] What are the genetic markers that are being used for this? [21:36] This is where the really interesting [21:37] ethical questions come into it. [21:39] People think that DNA is like the silver bullet [21:41] that will answer everything. [21:44] And it is true. [21:45] DNA evidence is incredibly powerful, [21:48] it's amazing for identifying individuals, [21:52] but DNA can never be taken out of context. [21:57] - Now, the point of this video isn't to bash forensics. [22:00] I think it's still better for us to live in a world [22:01] where forensics exist rather than one where they don't. [22:05] But if we want to keep calling forensics a science, [22:08] we need to continue the work of the people [22:10] who actually made this video possible, [22:12] who've dedicated their lives [22:13] to already reassessing the field [22:15] and making it as accurate as it is today. [22:17] Do you think it's fair calling this a forensic science? [22:19] - I still think there's science in it [22:21] because you're trying to do the best [22:22] with the information you have, [22:24] which is often times what science is trying to do is, [22:27] with the information you have, [22:28] this is the conclusions you make [22:30] until you know something better. [22:32] (gentle music) [22:44] - Hey, one last thing. [22:46] Last year we launched the official Veritasium game, [22:49] Elements of Truth. [22:50] It's a trivia game with 800 questions [22:52] covering science and technology, [22:54] and we on the team get quite competitive. [22:56] So every time we play things get very saucy. [22:59] See, there's this mechanic [23:00] where you can't only guess an answer, [23:02] you have to put down a number between one and 10 [23:04] to gauge how confident you are that your answer is right. [23:07] So it gets very fun very quickly. [23:09] The game is coming out later this year, [23:11] so if you're interested in pre-ordering, [23:12] you can click the link in the description, [23:14] which will take you to the Elements of Truth website. [23:17] Thank you so much for your support in this project. [23:19] And as always, thanks for watching.