Cars and Home Theater Collusion | Featuring Audioholics

[00:00] give it a

[00:02] brief

[00:22] sure hello everyone I'm going to get

[00:25] everybody loaded here and uh you know

[00:28] settled in let a a video sync up which

[00:31] you know to be fair might be a little

[00:33] bit off don't freak out this is mostly

[00:35] going to be a live stream it's like a

[00:39] live podcast I guess we can put it that

[00:41] way there's going to be some screen

[00:42] sharing um and a lot of talk about

[00:45] different topics about the audio

[00:47] industry the car industry and I have a

[00:50] guest on today that uh I'm very very

[00:53] happy to because this is a man that I've

[00:56] uh followed on his side of the business

[00:59] and because I'm an a audio I love audio

[01:00] video and he's been in the business for

[01:02] a long time his name is Jean delasala

[01:05] he's the president of audio holics and

[01:08] uh Jean why don't you introduce yourself

[01:09] just to give your background for people

[01:11] that don't know well first of all Mark I

[01:13] really appreciate you having me on your

[01:15] channel um I think it's awesome I love

[01:18] collabs like this because I think

[01:19] there's a lot of dual interest I think

[01:22] if people are into cars performance cars

[01:25] they definitely overlap they're into

[01:27] audio especially you're listening to

[01:28] music in your car right so I think these

[01:30] kind of collabs are great so real quick

[01:33] on me I'm an electrical engineer I was a

[01:35] design engineer um for about seven years

[01:38] I did government defense audio

[01:39] communication systems but my passion has

[01:42] always been home audio and I wanted to

[01:45] become an audio engineer in college and

[01:47] then I realized it was really difficult

[01:48] to get a job that pays well at a college

[01:51] doing audio so I figured out if any Star

[01:54] Trek fans are out there I pulled a Kobe

[01:56] ASI Maru I I beat the no- win scenario

[01:59] by starting a website in 99 working as

[02:02] an engineer for about three or four

[02:04] years until I could turn into profitable

[02:06] enough to eventually quit my very secure

[02:08] government job and then do this

[02:11] full-time and I've been doing it

[02:12] full-time since 2002 and we're going on

[02:15] 25 years on April 18th this

[02:19] year that's crazy I I you know and I

[02:22] think I'm GNA get right into the the

[02:24] meat and potatoes of this because uh I

[02:26] don't know if you know this Jean but our

[02:28] last couple live stream where Jack and I

[02:30] were on here we went four hours um and

[02:34] it's it's uh painful for the people

[02:35] watching but they I I don't it's it it's

[02:37] gets enjoyable but I'm not going to keep

[02:39] you here for for four

[02:41] hours so uh let's let's get into uh one

[02:44] of the things why obviously car audio

[02:48] and home theater seems to be a really

[02:50] common Topic in the automotive Community

[02:53] there seems to be a huge overlap between

[02:55] people that love music um I know Misha

[02:58] he is a guitar player and in periphery a

[03:00] metal band and he told me this it's like

[03:02] it's crazy the amount of people that he

[03:04] meets that are big into like engineering

[03:06] music and like production also love the

[03:09] mechanical and Technical part of cars

[03:11] and there's such an overlap so I I find

[03:13] it interesting that you also are into

[03:15] the car world what's your background

[03:17] with that so I've always loved cars and

[03:20] I always joke with my wife I'm like man

[03:21] in 99 if I would have started a car

[03:23] review website instead of Home Theater

[03:25] I'd be checking out Lamborghini Diablo

[03:28] right now you know because I'm at the

[03:29] very top of the stuff that I'm able to

[03:31] play with with home audio so I'm a car

[03:33] Enthusiast um I'm a BMW fan I've owned a

[03:36] few BMWs I have an m240i I also have an

[03:39] X5 um and I just love it I you know for

[03:43] years when I was a kid there were two

[03:45] I'd go to a magazine you know a

[03:47] bookstore or I'd go to the uh

[03:49] supermarkets and two things I'd look for

[03:50] I'd look for home audio magazines like

[03:52] stereo review stereo file and then I

[03:55] would look at Car and Driver Motor Trend

[03:57] and I would just gawk at the cars the

[03:59] car that I could never afford I'll

[04:01] probably never drive I'm obsessed with

[04:03] the performance metrics and how they

[04:05] were tested and I just have such a high

[04:07] respect for people that do car reviews

[04:10] because you're putting your own risk on

[04:12] the line right running on a track and

[04:14] putting the cars to the limits and I

[04:16] just I love it I just love the

[04:18] adrenaline feel of high performance

[04:21] anything when it comes to home theater

[04:22] when it comes to car performance and I

[04:25] just love engineering marbles you know I

[04:27] also like airplanes Aviation I'm h fan

[04:29] of like the SR71 Blackbird and I follow

[04:32] all the World War II documentaries and

[04:35] just how Aviation evolved over the years

[04:36] so I think there's a lot of overlap

[04:38] especially being an engineer and I'm

[04:40] electrically or mechanically inclined I

[04:42] just like engineering what humans can

[04:45] produce and do you do you find that you

[04:48] know obviously you're big into well it's

[04:50] your job right you test probably

[04:52] thousands of products at this point um

[04:55] how do you find when you get in a car do

[04:57] you like listening to music how's that

[05:00] overlap for you or do you just not care

[05:02] you go back home and deal with it I

[05:04] struggled a lot believe it or not um

[05:06] because I have such a good reference for

[05:09] what good sound is in the home that when

[05:12] I'd go and buy a new car and I would

[05:14] listen to the system and that most of

[05:16] the time they'd be atrocious right yeah

[05:19] um and it would suck because I would

[05:21] like the car let's say at the time I

[05:23] would buy like a Nissan Maxima when it

[05:25] was when Nissan was a really good brand

[05:27] in my opinion and the car AIO sucked I

[05:30] you know it was okay if you had the bow

[05:32] system it was listenable but then I

[05:33] noticed as Years Gone on some of that

[05:35] got worse on these cars and then when I

[05:37] went to a BMW on the two series I um I

[05:41] bought a used two series and it had the

[05:43] hormon system in it and I thought it had

[05:46] the potential but something was wrong in

[05:48] it right so I contacted hormon because I

[05:50] have friends there and I'm like there's

[05:52] too much Center channel in in the system

[05:55] is there a way to turn it down and it

[05:57] turns out it wasn't their fault because

[06:00] BMW uh contracted Harmon to do all their

[06:03] audio systems but BMW only has certain

[06:06] budgets I guess they allocate to each

[06:07] car so like in the two series and I

[06:10] don't know if that's the case now with

[06:11] the new two series because I know

[06:12] nothing about the Mexican Maj German uh

[06:16] the Mexican May 2 Series compared to the

[06:18] 2018 that I own but back in the day they

[06:21] put they couldn't put logic 7 in that

[06:23] car so what they did was they did left

[06:25] plus right and they dumped it into the

[06:27] center with no volume control for the

[06:28] center and that's a good way to kill

[06:31] Sound Stage you go and you do that kind

[06:33] of thing without lowering the volume or

[06:35] having any control of that it kills the

[06:36] sound stage so what I did was after I

[06:39] got my second 240 because the first one

[06:41] got totaled someone rear ended me I

[06:44] bought it with the regular system

[06:46] without the Harmon system because I was

[06:47] going to do my own upgrades and the

[06:50] regular system was not even listenable

[06:52] it was just so scathing the tonality of

[06:55] it you know it just sounded terrible so

[06:57] I went and I got a moral driver kid and

[06:59] Jen hurt underseat woofers and I

[07:01] contacted JL Audio and um I got a DSP

[07:05] and an amp from them and then I went out

[07:07] to Miramar and they spent two days

[07:09] helping me tune the system no Center

[07:11] Channel by the way so the center channel

[07:12] was deleted and we set up different

[07:15] profiles because if you don't have a

[07:16] center channel you're only going to have

[07:18] The Sweet Spot basically where you're

[07:20] sitting when you tune it to the DSP so

[07:22] if you want to have different sweet

[07:23] spots for the passenger for the people

[07:25] in the back you have different DSP

[07:27] settings and that was a world of I could

[07:29] actually sit in my m240 now listen to

[07:33] music and it sounds good it doesn't

[07:35] sound as good as my home theater but at

[07:37] least it's reference and it's it's

[07:39] enjoyable but yeah that's that's a

[07:41] struggle especially when you do long car

[07:42] trips and and you um have bad audio but

[07:46] the one thing I did notice is your your

[07:48] ears and your brain kind of adapt to

[07:50] mediocre sound over time so you learn to

[07:53] live with bad sound until you hear

[07:55] better right so I mean until you have

[07:57] reference sound that you can compare it

[07:58] to most people probably don't pay that

[08:01] much attention to their car audio

[08:02] systems that's kind of an afterthought I

[08:04] think when you're buying a car yeah and

[08:07] I think that's an interesting part and I

[08:09] don't want to get two in the weeds with

[08:10] the the car audio stuff other than yes

[08:13] we test it um and a lot of that has to

[08:15] do with uh Brian he's an acoustical

[08:17] engineer uh who's uh helped me a lot and

[08:21] obviously Jack with understanding how

[08:25] car audio is designed because he worked

[08:26] on the back end so it's going through

[08:28] and talking to some of these Brands

[08:30] where the straight answer is why car AIO

[08:33] is not good is it is not a priority it's

[08:35] not a priority in terms of budget for

[08:38] these Brands when they go down the list

[08:40] of product planning for cars unless you

[08:42] get to the ultra high end where you know

[08:44] you're charging $300,000 where you can

[08:46] most cars are not designed around an

[08:47] audio system a car they're designed

[08:49] around packaging of a car so the audio

[08:51] system gets designed later and thrown in

[08:53] later and then you get to a lot of the

[08:55] commodity Brands and when I say it's

[08:58] actually extends Beyond on that it it's

[09:01] okay what do we have left over okay now

[09:03] put some speakers in it what's the

[09:04] cheapest we can do it for um and you

[09:06] know I've heard directly from about

[09:09] certain brands and how much they pay for

[09:11] a driver set in a car and amplification

[09:13] and it's it's shockingly low like

[09:16] shockingly low it's under it can be

[09:18] under $100 in some cars and under 200

[09:20] for a whole package for a mainstream car

[09:22] so when you have that type of budget

[09:25] your suppliers are going to be like okay

[09:27] we're just going to do whatever and then

[09:28] the the Engineers that are designing the

[09:30] EQ and doing the car you know they got

[09:32] seats they got reflective surfaces every

[09:35] car is different they just try to get it

[09:36] as good as possible where the curve you

[09:38] know you're you're looking at it like

[09:40] okay it sounds okay there's nothing

[09:42] horribly wrong and that's where it's

[09:43] left um and to your point right you get

[09:46] used to that and most people because the

[09:49] bar is set so low for car audio there's

[09:52] there's an exception there's like 10

[09:53] cars I could name that are exceptional

[09:56] and you could tell one we knew that they

[09:58] were designed from the the start along

[10:00] with the interior space so they have a

[10:02] huge Advantage but that that you can

[10:04] count on one hand how many cars are

[10:05] actually like that and you just like

[10:07] hopefully it's not horrible and that's

[10:08] why we test the cars honestly is just to

[10:10] have a reference point of like this is

[10:12] really bad like really bad like the

[10:15] Honda ridg line was the worst one we

[10:16] ever tested like it it sound your phone

[10:19] speaker in a cup probably would sound

[10:21] better than that I mean I'm not even

[10:22] joking um but but you know that's the

[10:25] low point and then there's the Other

[10:26] Extreme but some middle ground and I

[10:27] think most of them now bench Mark each

[10:29] other to the point where in I know we

[10:31] talked about this on the phone like

[10:32] Harmon or Samsung Harmon owns like

[10:34] everything so it's a small group of

[10:37] people that are doing the work so they

[10:38] know how to do it and it's just let's

[10:41] what how much money do we have or how

[10:42] much are they giving us okay let's just

[10:44] do that that so um so two comments I

[10:46] have on on Carl real quick I just saw a

[10:48] comment that says El asking about the El

[10:51] audio system I actually had the El audio

[10:53] system in my Acura 2007 TL Type S and I

[10:57] met Elliot Shiner on the home theater

[10:58] creu

[10:59] um couple of years after I I bought that

[11:01] car and I was just giving him feedback

[11:04] he's the one that came up with the

[11:05] tuning of that system as you guys know

[11:07] he's he's produced music for the multi

[11:09] Channel music for the for the Eagles and

[11:11] other bands and I told him I go you know

[11:13] what the system sounds good it needs

[11:15] more base that little 8 inch in the back

[11:17] is just not doing it but the biggest

[11:19] downfall of that system was the 3-inch

[11:21] wizard cone woofer for the center

[11:23] channel and you just can't get enough

[11:25] volume out of it and he said that was a

[11:27] big struggle for him because he wanted a

[11:29] full range center channel in the dash

[11:30] but the car vendor would not dedicate

[11:32] the space for it right but I know

[11:34] they've upgraded it since then because

[11:36] my my sister-in-law has a uh one of

[11:39] their mdxs yeah and that system has been

[11:42] it's been greatly improved and I think

[11:44] overall the OEM systems are getting

[11:46] better and in fact if you look at one

[11:48] thing I like about the BMW even though

[11:50] their U stock system isn't that great

[11:52] the pre-outs on their head units are

[11:54] flat so all the dsps done in the amp and

[11:57] the trunk which means you can now put

[11:59] your own amp and your own DSP without

[12:01] having to reeq the preamp outputs and

[12:03] they have a strong I think there was

[12:05] like 4volt RMS clean coming out of those

[12:08] um outputs so it's plenty of drive for

[12:10] you to match it with an amplifier but

[12:12] not all the vendors are doing that some

[12:13] of the vendors are putting the DSP into

[12:15] the head unit and then you're kind of

[12:17] stuck you can't really do much modding

[12:19] on that system yeah and I think that's

[12:22] that's kind of the way we look at it

[12:23] right nobody is buying a modern car with

[12:25] all the electronics and what is in most

[12:27] cars you can't change anything anymore

[12:29] you can change out some drivers but

[12:30] you're still limited to uh what the EQ

[12:33] is baked in in the car and honestly when

[12:35] you look at even higher end systems now

[12:37] like Volvo's a good one they have the

[12:39] XC90 and I say this a lot I know people

[12:41] are tired of hearing it but the XC90

[12:42] when they did the Bowers was one of the

[12:44] best systems we ever tested in large

[12:46] part you know the engineers were

[12:48] involved with the interior design of

[12:50] those cars to start and they chose

[12:52] really good drivers and the EQ was great

[12:54] but as the time has gone on the X90 is

[12:56] like 100 years old now you can see them

[12:58] with their new headunit design they've

[13:00] stripped out any EQ that you can do with

[13:02] that car like there's no eqing even

[13:04] available it's just like trouble and

[13:05] base so they got rid of I don't even

[13:07] remember nine seven band or nine band

[13:09] not that you can play with it but

[13:11] they've removed all that for the

[13:12] mainstream consumer so really what you

[13:14] see is what you get and nobody's going

[13:16] to modify these cars honestly it just

[13:18] it's not worth it anymore um you have to

[13:20] get to like your level and you know

[13:22] that's so uncommon um to to to play with

[13:26] this stuff so it's it's disappointing

[13:28] but to fair to the manufacturers uh

[13:31] Acura is a good one they just got rid of

[13:32] Els and they got rid of yeah they they

[13:36] just switched over this year and all

[13:38] their new cars are going to have some

[13:39] subset of bang and olison um and the the

[13:42] directive was make it sound like Els

[13:46] that's what they wanted the you know the

[13:48] harming try do for less money of course

[13:52] because it's not a requested feature so

[13:55] when you go to the MDX Type S which we

[13:57] had as a long termer they have their

[13:58] highest end audio system they ever did

[14:00] it was the ls signature so that was

[14:04] definitely for the price point on

[14:05] another level it was pretty close to the

[14:07] Bowers stuff not as good um but you know

[14:10] you have that the Bowers in the BMW like

[14:12] X7 well you can't really get in X5 but

[14:15] the Bowers is pretty good in there the

[14:17] Volvo's really good and then you get

[14:18] into the burms of the higher end

[14:20] Mercedes which are pretty good um some

[14:22] of the meridians and the jlr test great

[14:25] but I mean that's it like really that

[14:27] that's it it's the all than that they

[14:29] all very much are all have the same type

[14:31] of problem they're very base heavy

[14:33] because they know everybody wants a huge

[14:34] base curve they want base yeah yep like

[14:36] the Beat headphones used to be remember

[14:38] the Beats headphones when they first

[14:39] came out they were just bass machines

[14:41] not no tonal accuracy at all um you know

[14:44] I think you go back to the Volvo case I

[14:46] believe I heard a demo of a Volvo system

[14:48] a few years back at CES or CIA and that

[14:52] was the one that was using dirak

[14:53] calibration and that's dir got its got

[14:56] it start in car audio and that was

[14:59] impressive the amount of DSP magic they

[15:01] were able to pull off that's not

[15:02] something um a person could do on his

[15:04] own just messing with little geq filters

[15:06] or PQ filters in a car so I I do think

[15:11] if you're an audio file and you're

[15:12] choosing a car and they put some thought

[15:15] into the upgraded audio systems I do

[15:18] find they tend to be worth the extra

[15:21] cost because otherwise you're going to

[15:23] be ripping stuff out you have to take

[15:24] door panels off and I'd hate to go

[15:27] through that again that was it when I

[15:28] saw my car ripped apart in jail audio's

[15:31] uh Factory I got nervous it was a brand

[15:33] new car and all my door panels were off

[15:35] the trunk was out I was like oh my God

[15:37] are they gonna be able to put this back

[15:38] together and make it tight again so I

[15:41] don't know yeah It's Tricky it's a

[15:43] double-edged sword and cars are you know

[15:45] if you had it your way you know you

[15:47] would have no storage in the doors there

[15:49] would be no you know everything would be

[15:50] around sound and that's just not

[15:52] practical for most people the amount of

[15:54] compromise you have to do to get a good

[15:56] audio system and a car designed is

[15:58] that's not what people are looking for

[15:59] and it and it makes sense I just think

[16:01] we're looking out for you know we tested

[16:03] a couple Ford and GMS Ford is the

[16:05] biggest uh the the

[16:09] biggest I don't even want to put it this

[16:11] way but they're the ones that charge the

[16:13] most for upgraded audio systems that

[16:15] actually test worse than the Bas like

[16:16] the standard ones they're they're so

[16:18] overblown they're horrible they're just

[16:20] horrible so like that's what we're

[16:21] really looking for is like do you do you

[16:23] spend if there's an updated upgraded

[16:25] audio system is it actually better worth

[16:27] like $1,000 $2,000 $3,000 more and that

[16:31] that's all we can do is like try to

[16:32] protect people from that so there's a

[16:34] reference point other than that I mean

[16:36] it's hard to get into it but I'm gonna

[16:38] I'm going to get shift into a different

[16:40] question here because sure um I think

[16:43] this goes into it the personal

[16:46] philosophies in like your business and

[16:48] audio um and I know you started a long

[16:51] time ago and there had to be a reason

[16:52] why you started this uh and you were in

[16:54] an era like early 2000s right something

[16:57] like that I'm old Mark I started in 99 I

[17:00] just turned 50 so I'm ancient so yeah

[17:04] audioholics like when was when did you

[17:06] kick that off yeah 99 is 99 wow okay so

[17:10] you're on the ground floor and what you

[17:12] what Jean has tried to do from my

[17:13] perspective and I I found him for the

[17:16] very reason I like wanted to do what I

[17:17] wanted to do with car stuff and that is

[17:20] there was a level of trying to be honest

[17:22] where you knew that you still have to

[17:24] keep manufacturers happy you have to

[17:25] keep the people around you happy because

[17:28] you can't just take a dump on a product

[17:29] and expect the brand to be like oh here

[17:31] you go you want to test more of our

[17:32] stuff so there's this slippery slope but

[17:36] I found that you were one of the few

[17:37] people at least on the internet that

[17:39] spawn up something where you were trying

[17:41] to be real about a lot of products that

[17:42] you don't need to waste money on um so

[17:45] that's my perception of it so what's

[17:47] your how do you fill in the gaps so the

[17:50] motto on our and I don't want to

[17:51] shamelessly plug audio Hawks but our

[17:53] motto has always been pursuing the truth

[17:55] in audio and then I Chang it to pursuing

[17:57] the truth in audio and video so I'm

[17:58] trying to get some video in on that and

[18:00] the whole reason why I started

[18:02] audioholics is when I graduated college

[18:04] as a dou and I was working in Telcom I

[18:06] was designing you know not audio

[18:09] amplifiers but like wide bandwidth

[18:12] amplifiers I knew you know the

[18:14] properties of amplifiers and what they

[18:16] do and all that stuff and I started

[18:18] looking at the marketing claims in

[18:20] consumer audio and compared to Pro Audio

[18:24] and compared to what I do for a living

[18:25] I'm like there's so much nonsense and

[18:28] how these manufacturers are specking

[18:30] their products and then I got into the

[18:32] whole cable thing and I could not

[18:34] believe that in consumer audio there are

[18:38] companies out there that are duping

[18:39] people and putting batteries on cables

[18:41] and charging $5,000 $110,000 for a pair

[18:44] of eight foot cables and then they're

[18:46] coming up with this Butchery of science

[18:49] claiming that they're solving problems

[18:50] that don't really exist and it's not

[18:53] based on the engineering principles that

[18:55] they're quoting so I started getting in

[18:57] samples of these cables and I hate to

[19:00] admit this but I started this when I was

[19:02] working in telom I had all access to the

[19:05] test gear there I started measuring them

[19:07] with Magnetic analyzers I had you know

[19:09] hundreds of thousands of dollars worth

[19:10] of test gear at my disposal i' bring

[19:12] them in at night after I was done

[19:13] working I'd start measuring and I'd

[19:15] start writing articles and I started

[19:17] getting attention I had manufacturers

[19:19] calling me um a company called Wayne

[19:21] cerr Believe It or Not is the name of

[19:23] the company uh they sent me a magnetic

[19:25] analyzer I had audio Precision send me

[19:27] test gear and they're like we see that

[19:29] you're on to something here we want to

[19:31] support you give you the test gear give

[19:33] you the tools to do the measurements and

[19:35] then come up with a set of procedures

[19:37] that you think are fair when you're

[19:39] measuring amplifiers or measuring

[19:41] loudspeakers or measuring cables and try

[19:43] to keep the manufactur is honest and my

[19:45] goal wasn't to give people black eyes

[19:48] per se my goal was to kind of raise the

[19:50] industry up you know get to what matters

[19:53] in the industry have the manufacturers

[19:55] all agree that hey we should have a

[19:57] minimal set stand standard on what is

[19:59] good performance and then get rid of the

[20:01] nonsense get rid of the snake oil the

[20:03] stuff that doesn't matter that's just

[20:05] sucking people's money away that they

[20:07] could be putting into something that

[20:08] matters like room Acoustics right and I

[20:10] had a lot of I had a lot of blowback at

[20:13] first I've had you know companies

[20:15] threatening me because I was writing

[20:16] about their cables and people saying I

[20:19] was never going to make a success in the

[20:21] business because I'm you know I'm

[20:22] ruffling too many feathers but then what

[20:25] really surprised me was the companies

[20:27] that were doing legit legitimately good

[20:29] product we're like we are all for this

[20:31] and I had all these Engineers behind me

[20:33] I would get like I would get Christmas

[20:35] cards from Japan from Yamaha from the

[20:37] engineers I didn't even know existed

[20:39] because they like my test reports and

[20:42] then I started uh company started

[20:43] sending me products to do beta testing

[20:45] so like Den or Yamaha or just major

[20:48] companies like that would literally send

[20:50] me stuff to test before it released to

[20:52] Market and I was just loving it this is

[20:54] what this has always been my dream is to

[20:56] be in audio not to design the stuff

[20:58] because I know it's a labor of love to

[21:00] design and I respect the people that

[21:02] design and I always make sure when I

[21:05] measure stuff that I fact check with

[21:07] them that my test reports are accurate

[21:09] so a lot of these companies would go out

[21:10] and buy the same test gear to match my

[21:13] reporting so that way we were Ono one

[21:15] before I would publish I always wanted

[21:16] to make sure that I give the best

[21:18] representation for the product and be as

[21:20] accurate as I can I know I know I always

[21:23] sometimes make mistakes and I do my best

[21:25] to not to minimize those mistakes before

[21:27] we publ

[21:29] that makes sense um and I I I get this

[21:33] question and I think it's becoming more

[21:34] relevant um

[21:36] in for you and I think for me I'm not

[21:39] going to get into me as much but uh the

[21:42] way that I wanted to start this was for

[21:43] a lot of the same reasons that you

[21:45] probably did you wanted to see data you

[21:47] wanted to see these things that were not

[21:49] really out there and transparent um and

[21:52] I get questions a lot from people that

[21:53] want to get into the media space of like

[21:56] the tech space or media space and I know

[21:58] you you know you mentioned like throttle

[21:59] house and some of these other car people

[22:01] and all these people in social media

[22:03] they have a voice um and I think the

[22:05] biggest thing is if you're really into

[22:08] something and you're passionate about it

[22:10] there's an angle to find and there's an

[22:13] angle to find when you really like to do

[22:15] something that's not like it it really

[22:17] takes when you're not happy about

[22:18] something for me I was unhappy when I

[22:21] didn't see real transparency with car

[22:23] things people were never talking about

[22:25] the details it was always glazed over so

[22:28] it really charged me to be like I know

[22:30] how to fill in this space I know how to

[22:32] do this but it takes you know doing it

[22:35] and actually saying that you want to do

[22:36] it are two different things and and I'm

[22:39] reading more and more about like uh Jen

[22:41] Z and now Jen Alpha like they like to

[22:45] watch content they don't like to create

[22:46] it so a lot of like what we're doing is

[22:49] becoming the professional resource for

[22:51] people to gather information to make

[22:54] educated decisions and when you're

[22:56] talking about you know cars and audio is

[22:59] they're nice cities right like they're

[23:01] not you're not going to you're not going

[23:03] to fail in life if you don't have a car

[23:05] or you don't have a nice set of speakers

[23:07] right so they their wants versus needs

[23:09] in a lot of cases but when people are

[23:12] passionate about them and they want to

[23:13] buy them like a car I take it very

[23:15] seriously I think what would I want to

[23:17] know if I was buying a car before I

[23:18] unload you know $800 to $1,000 a month

[23:22] on like a new car like on a loan the

[23:23] same thing with audio gear right like I

[23:25] can't go out when I look at a set of

[23:28] loudspeakers there's no way even if I go

[23:30] into a great store I can't just load up

[23:32] my room full of a bunch of speakers and

[23:34] test them it's not practical it's not

[23:36] practical for me to test 10 amps and

[23:38] five receivers and bring in three TVs or

[23:40] three projectors there's not enough time

[23:42] there's not enough money and enough

[23:43] resources so I think you know it's a

[23:47] message for people that are not happy

[23:49] this is a segue into another

[23:51] topic some people are not happy with our

[23:54] results and what we say in our opinions

[23:56] which is completely fine and I charge

[23:58] people to really if you don't like it

[24:00] and we're doing something wrong either

[24:02] call us out or give us recommendations

[24:04] or try to start up your own thing like

[24:06] fill in the gaps where we're not

[24:07] covering you know because it makes us

[24:09] better and you're giving another voice

[24:10] out there for people to you know share

[24:13] information and maybe we're not doing

[24:15] something right like I can't do

[24:16] everything to in the car world I can't

[24:18] do everything the same way throttle

[24:19] house is we're not funny like them in

[24:21] that traditional way we have an obscure

[24:22] sense of humor we're more engineering

[24:23] focused and we'd fail if we tried to

[24:26] copy their formula much like they'd be

[24:28] very it would be very hard for them to

[24:29] transition to do something like us so in

[24:32] your case um I thought it was

[24:34] interesting because I've been following

[24:35] like the Forum scene for quite a while

[24:37] and what you're trying to do and I see

[24:38] some of the difficulties in because

[24:40] you've been around for so long now

[24:42] there's a new generation of people that

[24:43] are like testing and looking at spec

[24:46] sheets and num the numbers game because

[24:48] they don't have access to the product

[24:50] they have this wide knowledge base so

[24:52] how do you deal in the course of your

[24:55] career like the people now in the The

[24:57] Forum that you're talking about where

[24:58] another they're constantly doing

[24:59] specification tests and all these

[25:01] products and they don't like them and

[25:02] they're garbage and because you do and

[25:04] you're doing more testing they're

[25:05] trashing you personally or giving you a

[25:07] hard time how do you talk to that and

[25:09] how do you deal with that type of stuff

[25:11] I try to stay off those forums I you

[25:13] know I've tried to engage them in the

[25:15] past there's one particular Forum that's

[25:17] that's just like that they do very heavy

[25:19] measurement Centric Forum um but it's

[25:23] just it causes a lot of stress and I in

[25:25] my life as I get older I try to minim

[25:28] distress and I want to focus on Family

[25:30] Focus on creating the best content that

[25:33] I can do and I'm just blessed that I

[25:35] have so many writers and and people

[25:37] helping me out that are more

[25:39] knowledgeable in certain subjects than I

[25:40] am to get a balanced Viewpoint so I the

[25:44] only thing I could say to that is when

[25:46] someone goes and trashes a product

[25:47] because of a graph a CTA 2034 graph is

[25:51] not as pristine as it should yet they

[25:54] haven't heard the product for themselves

[25:56] and then they make the opinion that they

[25:58] shouldn't buy the product because of

[25:59] that one graph I think it's it's doing

[26:01] them a disservice and I'm going to

[26:04] actually have subject matter experts on

[26:06] our channel to talk about this that some

[26:08] of these measurements while the

[26:09] measurements are great the measurements

[26:11] are for the dating phase the listening

[26:13] test is for the marriage right that's

[26:15] what really ultimately determines if you

[26:17] like the product based on your needs and

[26:19] your room Acoustics and your listening

[26:21] environment and listening habits and I

[26:24] don't think we can just dumb things down

[26:26] to the point where the measurements can

[26:28] tell you everything especially psycho

[26:30] acoustically loudspeakers the way they

[26:32] play in a room is really hard to

[26:34] understand every aspect of what you're

[26:37] hearing based on a few graphs as opposed

[26:40] to maybe an amplifier is a lot a little

[26:42] easier because it's an electrical signal

[26:43] you can kind of you know if it's an

[26:45] ideal voltage source or not or a piece

[26:47] of wire you know exactly if it's if it's

[26:49] transmitting that signal without any

[26:51] propagation loss so I try to keep I

[26:55] always try to keep the measurements into

[26:57] context ta like I'll measure a processor

[27:00] and it'll have some weird stuff going on

[27:02] in the measurements but if it's 100 DB

[27:05] below the threshold it's not something

[27:07] you're going to hear it's just not as

[27:08] tidy on the bench should you not buy the

[27:11] product because of that especially if it

[27:12] has really Advanced base management or

[27:15] room correction systems that the other

[27:16] product that doesn't have that anomaly

[27:19] no that's that's a bad choice I've I've

[27:22] always said this get the product

[27:24] integrated into your system and see if

[27:25] it has the feature set you need and how

[27:27] it's sound so I think there's a balanc

[27:29] there needs to be a balanced approach

[27:30] between having the measurements holding

[27:32] the manufacturers accountable for the

[27:33] specs that they produce and also being

[27:36] able to do the listening test to see how

[27:38] that translates in your room okay that

[27:42] that makes sense and I think there the

[27:43] parallel that I was trying to draw is

[27:45] the car world is the same right and it's

[27:47] gotten worse in the car world because as

[27:50] products get more expensive the

[27:51] accessibility to the common person

[27:53] becomes lower and it's it's a shame

[27:56] because these are passion things a lot

[27:58] of these cars are passion things and

[27:59] some of them are not but um I see this a

[28:02] lot where the products you can tell are

[28:04] designed by Engineers that don't have a

[28:05] lot of time to do it they have to get it

[28:06] out and they have to be like on on a

[28:10] bench a lot of this stuff works but when

[28:12] you get into the finer details of um and

[28:14] I'm I'm doing this NSX project right now

[28:17] like trying to finish this documentary

[28:18] that I've said I've had I'm going to be

[28:19] done in like a year it's been over a

[28:21] year and I'm going through these

[28:22] technical documents in this book and one

[28:24] of the things that they talked about

[28:26] during the engineering of this car was

[28:28] uh they had this the the test driver

[28:30] said there's something wrong with it

[28:32] like it's disconnected and all the

[28:33] engineers like we can't measure this

[28:35] there's no there's no data that proves

[28:37] what you're saying is right so as they

[28:39] went along in development they found we

[28:41] can't measure the problem that you're

[28:43] having you have to just turn your brain

[28:45] off to the data for a minute stop trying

[28:48] to record everything with sensors or you

[28:50] know and drive the car and feel it and

[28:52] just feel it and you'll start to

[28:54] understand that we need to engineer it

[28:55] two different ways uh and in the case of

[28:57] audio right it's not just about the

[28:59] feeling of it it's sitting down and

[29:01] actually turning your brain off and

[29:02] listening to it and that's one of the

[29:04] things that I found and I'm nowhere near

[29:06] your level or the people you work with

[29:07] but I found that I can do a set of like

[29:10] calibrations and measurements and I can

[29:12] get them to the best that I can and

[29:13] setting up the room the best that I can

[29:15] but at the end of the day if something

[29:17] looks good on the chart and I sit in my

[29:19] room and I'm like something's not right

[29:21] and I will I will listen more to my ear

[29:24] um assuming you have a good ear or

[29:27] understand what you're listening to I

[29:28] found that to be I will get it to where

[29:31] my ear is happy and the measurements

[29:32] look okay there might be problems but

[29:33] I'll be happier with the connection to

[29:35] the equipment just leaving it alone at

[29:37] that point and stop chasing all the

[29:39] problems and enjoy it and the same thing

[29:41] with cars uh if you're constantly trying

[29:43] to screw with stuff uh you know I don't

[29:46] like this car because it's not the

[29:48] fastest thing so I'm going to trade it

[29:49] to get the next one and the next one and

[29:51] the next one and I know this is the same

[29:52] thing with audio and video you know this

[29:54] tv you know it's the black level aren't

[29:57] this good here in the color you know

[29:59] it's on my color meter it's not you know

[30:01] it's not there's this endless chase that

[30:03] we get into aside from just being happy

[30:05] with things um and that's a place where

[30:07] you and I think because of that

[30:09] experience we learn it quicker than the

[30:11] average person so I'm trying to also you

[30:13] know help people understand that and

[30:15] I've watched your stuff too and like you

[30:17] can get really technical like you get

[30:20] you guys get really technical but you

[30:21] also are accessible in the fact that

[30:23] okay you don't need to spend 6,000 or

[30:25] 20,000 on a set of speakers to really

[30:28] get good sound if your room is not just

[30:30] a horrible you know tin can um and I

[30:34] like the way that you guys approach that

[30:36] so what if you had to give like advice

[30:40] uh just like ABC advice how would you

[30:42] say if somebody want to get into audio

[30:44] kind of like I'm talking about with cars

[30:46] like what are the first five things that

[30:47] you should do and just off the top of

[30:49] your head I think the biggest factor in

[30:52] getting good a good audio experience is

[30:54] the room so if you're going to stick

[30:57] your speakers in a kitchen or you're

[30:59] gonna stick it in a family room that's

[31:01] all tile floor and glass you're not

[31:03] going to get a good experience it's just

[31:05] really hard if you don't do anything

[31:07] with the Acoustics of the room I've seen

[31:09] systems I've gone to people's houses

[31:10] where they spend 10 grand on a pair of

[31:12] BS and walk in speakers and it's stuck

[31:14] in a in this horrible room I measured

[31:16] the rt60 Decay time it's like a second

[31:18] and a

[31:19] half it sounds like an echo chamber

[31:22] you're better off just putting a sound

[31:23] barar in there at that point if you're

[31:25] not going to address the room acousic so

[31:26] yeah defining where your listening space

[31:28] is going to be um trying to get

[31:31] reasonably good Acoustics in there

[31:33] without you know while having spousal

[31:36] approval that's step number one then the

[31:38] next step is I I might be a little

[31:41] different than most home theater uh

[31:42] channels where they focus strictly on

[31:45] multi-channel I'm all about getting the

[31:47] best two channel first and then building

[31:50] a system around it like you can see the

[31:51] speakers behind me those are fully

[31:53] active rbh speakers this is my kind of

[31:55] listening space I even spin records here

[31:59] every system that I set up in in my

[32:01] house or when I set up for other people

[32:03] is I make sure I get good Imaging from

[32:04] the front Sound Stage and I think that's

[32:06] similar in car audio I'm not an expert

[32:08] of car audio but I know it's really

[32:10] important to get good sound staging up

[32:12] front and in the best systems some some

[32:14] of those are just two channel like they

[32:15] don't even use rear fill right if you

[32:17] get a really good DSP tune so yeah I

[32:20] would say focus on getting that but if

[32:22] you're not into music and you just want

[32:23] to supplement the sound of your TV so

[32:26] you watch and streaming stuff then you

[32:28] can go and get a 5.1 or 5.1.4 if you

[32:31] want to get an Atmos maybe prioritize

[32:34] Less on the quality of the front Sound

[32:36] Stage so you can have all the speakers

[32:38] but at the very minimum I always

[32:40] recommend two subwoofers because in

[32:42] small rooms in order to get even base

[32:44] from seat to seat you can't do that with

[32:46] one sub you can get good base in a very

[32:49] narrow area with one sub in a small room

[32:52] or home theater but having that dual sub

[32:55] configuration really opens things up so

[32:57] that way every seat is EQ and then every

[33:00] seat gets sound more consistent so that

[33:02] way if you're sitting on the left of the

[33:03] couch and your wife's sitting on the

[33:04] right of the couch you're both hearing

[33:06] similar base level and similar base

[33:08] quality and Bas is 30% of the experience

[33:11] bad Bas you don't enjoy the music or the

[33:14] home

[33:15] theater um I you know obviously I think

[33:18] the whole concept of uh Bas management

[33:22] has changed quite a bit over the years

[33:24] you know like back in the day before you

[33:26] had all the EQ ility and all the modern

[33:28] software you know having one was you

[33:31] know most people are never going to have

[33:32] more than one and now you see like at

[33:34] least in the autofile audio file

[33:35] Community there's people talking about

[33:37] four like the best case four and then

[33:40] like people are putting them in the

[33:41] ceiling and you know I mean it it's an

[33:44] interesting transition of how things

[33:47] have changed over time and I I think

[33:49] that that's that's the other question I

[33:51] wanted to ask you about this and I'm

[33:53] going to go over just a couple things so

[33:55] people aren't lost in the dark with some

[33:56] of this measurement stuff that we're

[33:57] talking about and I don't want to get in

[33:58] the weeds with it either but in the past

[34:00] 20

[34:01] years what have you seen the biggest

[34:04] change aside from the internet and the

[34:05] business and all the products like in

[34:07] terms of Technology what have you seen

[34:09] change and what are the things that are

[34:10] the most disposable also the most

[34:12] garbage things that have

[34:14] happened so I think the industry in

[34:16] general as a whole is improving right I

[34:19] mean 20 years ago you couldn't go out to

[34:21] Mono price and buy a pair of $600

[34:24] speakers that actually perform decently

[34:26] it was hard to get a pair of good floor

[34:28] standing $600 speakers back then so I

[34:31] think because of companies like Harmon

[34:33] that did the research that showed hey

[34:35] this is kind of a recipe for a good

[34:37] sound you know this is how a speaker

[34:39] should behave in a room more people

[34:42] started researching this other brands as

[34:44] well and they got more serious about not

[34:46] just voicing a speaker by ear but doing

[34:48] the measurements first getting a good

[34:49] blend of the drivers and then of course

[34:51] doing listening tests and in general I

[34:54] just think loudspeaker performance has

[34:56] gotten better over the years subwoofers

[34:58] especially I mean I'm talking 20 years

[35:00] ago when I started this whole thing you

[35:03] know it was hard to get good deep base

[35:06] and the subwoofers did not perform the

[35:09] drivers didn't perform as is the way

[35:10] they do now there's just so much lower

[35:12] Distortion you've got the ability to EQ

[35:15] and get rid of the bumps in the base

[35:17] that was very hard to do I mean just 15

[35:19] years ago a flagship D and receiver had

[35:21] one subw for output it had a geq on it

[35:24] you couldn't do a lot of Base stuff you

[35:26] had to go and buy a mini DSP and tag it

[35:29] onto your receiver and fix the base in

[35:31] your room well now you could do that

[35:32] with room correction now you could do

[35:34] that with a lot of subwoofers that have

[35:35] built-in room correction so I think in

[35:38] general that aspect has improved the

[35:41] things that that kind of bother me about

[35:43] how the industry's changed in the last

[35:45] couple of years is is The Branding and

[35:47] the labeling of stuff like Dolby Atmos

[35:50] like now you can get Dolby Atmos in in a

[35:52] computer in a laptop you can get it in a

[35:54] $400 Soundbar it's like they've water

[35:57] down what the atmos experience is and I

[36:00] understand why they're trying to

[36:01] commercialize it and bring it out there

[36:03] so more people get into it but at the

[36:04] same time I feel like it takes something

[36:07] away from the magic if if someone's only

[36:09] exposure to Dolby Atmos is through a

[36:11] soundbar through bouncy house speakers

[36:13] the one that flect up to the ceiling

[36:15] they're not getting the whole picture

[36:17] they're not really getting the full

[36:18] immersive effect so the other problem

[36:21] too with that is as you add more

[36:22] features to products like avrs the FI

[36:25] the thousand AVR from 20 years ago had a

[36:28] much bigger power supply and capability

[36:31] than a $1,000 AVR today because now

[36:33] you're paying licens and fees to Dolby

[36:35] you're paying licensing fees for HDMI

[36:37] 2.1 to get 8K uh switching in there

[36:41] anytime you add these new features into

[36:43] a product you're going to have to cut

[36:44] what matters most for sound quality and

[36:46] that's the power supply or the

[36:47] amplification section so that's why I

[36:50] started this whole truth and power

[36:51] campaign a few years ago keeping them

[36:54] accountable for measurements and

[36:56] amplifiers because they started

[36:57] measuring amplifiers rather than FTC I'm

[37:00] trying I'm trying not to get too in the

[37:01] weeds with your audience I got you in

[37:04] the 70s the FTC did full bandwidth power

[37:06] ratings for two channels driven eight

[37:08] ohms 4 Ohms well if you look at the fine

[37:10] print on a lot of these cheap avrs today

[37:13] they measure it at one channel driven at

[37:15] one kertz at 10% at six ohms so it gives

[37:18] you the illusion of more power and

[37:20] there's just so many caveats so you look

[37:22] at this receiver it says 250 Watts a

[37:24] channel the reality is it's more like

[37:27] 90 or 100 watts of channel it's about

[37:29] half of what they're showing and I just

[37:31] wish manufacturers would be more honest

[37:32] about that with people so like you go

[37:35] into the Best Buy and you get one of

[37:36] these home theater boxes and it says

[37:38] like 2,000 Watts it's like pmo which is

[37:41] like some Dynamic BS power rating it's

[37:44] not even close to that so that's those

[37:47] are the kind of things that seem like

[37:48] they've gotten a little bit worse in the

[37:50] industry since we've added Atmos and

[37:52] we've added more Channel counts to

[37:54] products but in general I think products

[37:57] are getting better especially the

[37:58] loudspeakers and subwoofers and room

[38:01] correction okay yeah and I think that's

[38:03] a that's a valid point because you see

[38:05] that um it's not just yeah obviously

[38:08] it's that makes sense in the audio video

[38:10] space because you're you're trying to

[38:13] take something and make it new to people

[38:14] so it's the marketing magic of trying to

[38:16] get more people in um while things have

[38:19] changed they haven't changed all that

[38:21] much and you see the same thing with

[38:22] cars right like the cars that what made

[38:25] people excited for cars 20 years ago was

[38:28] a Driving Experience right it was about

[38:31] the physicality the connectedness of the

[38:33] car and now you look at a modern car um

[38:36] and it's about how isolated is it how

[38:38] much can we isolate the Driving

[38:40] Experience out and then what's the

[38:42] technology that's the primary goal of

[38:44] like you know our younger buyers want

[38:47] screens our younger buyers want

[38:48] infotainment because they are holding

[38:50] their phone and the first thing to get

[38:51] them in is oh I feel comfortable because

[38:53] I see a screen in the car and I'm not

[38:55] kidding you that's exactly what they the

[38:56] manufacturers tell us Point plank it's

[38:58] not made up so it's this switch of how

[39:01] do you make an old thing new um and

[39:05] they're constantly trying to recreate

[39:07] this and um you know as I do more and

[39:10] more work on the back end talking

[39:12] Engineers talking to people designers on

[39:13] the business side all these things have

[39:15] to come together right if it was all

[39:16] engineering this car would car or

[39:18] product would be you know ridiculous and

[39:21] it wouldn't be accessible to you

[39:23] wouldn't sell them right that's the same

[39:24] thing with cars right if if you made a

[39:26] car

[39:27] um that was the perfect car from an

[39:29] engineering driving perspective you have

[39:30] five people that would buy it you know

[39:32] and that's the joke um but it's gotten

[39:35] to it's it's another extreme too where

[39:37] you're you're selling all this marketing

[39:40] versus actually having a product that

[39:41] makes a lot of sense um and I found that

[39:44] too over getting back into audio video

[39:46] again and obviously with the help of

[39:47] your site is you

[39:50] know what are most people doing most

[39:53] people are you know listening to basic

[39:55] two Channel audio mostly compressed most

[39:58] people are watching stuff through a TV

[40:01] they don't have like a dedicated AVR let

[40:03] alone the space for all these speakers

[40:05] and then what's their streaming Source

[40:07] or their source to get content they're

[40:10] not going to be like discreet like

[40:12] really high quality um multi- Channel

[40:15] outputs most people have like a generic

[40:18] app thing on their TV or a Roku and the

[40:20] audio is limited there what are you

[40:21] going to do with it so when you talk

[40:23] about Hi-Fi right like a really good

[40:26] Channel system I feel like tier Point

[40:28] that's the most accessible way to do it

[40:30] um because you at least you have really

[40:32] good control of two channel and no

[40:34] matter what you watch or listen to you

[40:36] can get sound and set it up out of a two

[40:38] two speakers um obviously with TV and

[40:41] movies a center and that's going to be a

[40:44] huge argument I see people arguing about

[40:45] Center Channel all the time it's like a

[40:47] blessing and a curse when you hear a

[40:49] good setup with a center channel when

[40:51] everything comes out of it because so

[40:52] much data comes through there it can

[40:54] make a huge difference in terms of

[40:55] dialogue NE legibility and all of that

[40:57] and I I feel like even like a three

[40:59] Channel setup for TV and movies is

[41:01] pretty good but when you get into all

[41:03] the you know like when you start talking

[41:05] about Atmos and you start talking about

[41:08] like four subs or three or you you know

[41:10] however you're going to do it it gets to

[41:11] the point where how am I going to do

[41:13] this yeah yeah you're not going to

[41:16] convince an average person to go set

[41:19] this up in a space that most people

[41:20] don't have in modern homes especially

[41:23] and this is where I've struggled and I'm

[41:25] I'm not going to talk to death but I'm

[41:27] going to get back into like how I got

[41:28] back into this and got reconnected with

[41:31] audioholics but I I loved audio as a kid

[41:34] um my Dad loved movies and TV and he

[41:37] knew nothing about how to set anything

[41:38] up I was like an eight-year-old plugging

[41:40] in RCA cables and a mess and setting up

[41:43] like a preamp and all this crap I had no

[41:45] idea there was no internet either and I

[41:46] just I like that part of it but as I got

[41:48] older and into it I realized where the

[41:51] hell am I going to set this stuff up I

[41:52] had an apartment okay now you can't play

[41:54] it Loud or you know you have to be

[41:56] careful and what can you do with the

[41:58] room not much and then you know I'm

[42:00] looking for a house and every new house

[42:01] is like a cavern to find a room that is

[42:04] the proper size in a pre-built home is

[42:07] almost impossible because of the high

[42:08] ceilings and everything and then you get

[42:09] to the point of like what you're saying

[42:11] is I could get a monor speaker not to

[42:14] say that there's anything wrong with it

[42:16] but something that's like $300 then it's

[42:18] going to sound just as good as like a

[42:19] $2,000 set of speakers in a a room with

[42:21] a 20 foot ceiling it's just yeah it's

[42:24] really hard

[42:27] sorry sorry that that that was kind of

[42:28] my point it's really hard to get people

[42:30] into it the room the room and the

[42:33] difficulty and setup look we're not at

[42:34] the point where you can just plop down a

[42:37] five channel with a subwofer speaker

[42:39] system and press a magic button and have

[42:41] it perfectly calibrated we are there are

[42:44] some systems that do a decent job that

[42:46] that get you close and some people will

[42:48] be satisfied with that but there is some

[42:50] setup and that's why I think it's

[42:51] important to work with a partner if

[42:54] you're buying from a retailer that

[42:56] actually has technical expertise

[42:58] sometimes it's worth the extra money to

[43:00] pay the retail price and get customer

[43:02] support as opposed to shopping for the

[43:04] for the cheapest you can get it from

[43:06] someone that doesn't even know the

[43:07] products they're just basically

[43:08] reselling it and I think that's why

[43:10] there should be a connection with the

[43:12] dealer even if it's an online dealer

[43:13] there's some great online companies that

[43:15] are offering service they're offering

[43:18] expertise on the products and I think

[43:20] that's what really helps people get

[43:22] better into it because half of it is

[43:25] getting the setup you get the good

[43:26] equipment in there but if it's

[43:28] improperly set up you're not getting the

[43:30] results that you were hoping

[43:32] for yeah in the TV stuff is the same way

[43:35] as you know like I I I've cursed this

[43:37] for a long time and I obviously making

[43:40] videos uh I have a really good ear for

[43:42] video and audio great I grew up with

[43:44] this stuff so I'm like okay now I get to

[43:46] make it or somewhat try to make it and I

[43:48] have a better appreciation for

[43:49] everything that goes into it I also have

[43:51] appreciation for the fact that I could

[43:53] spend all this time on calibrated

[43:54] displays like color calibration trying

[43:57] to get audio calibrated and make making

[43:59] a mix and a video that looks as accurate

[44:02] as I can possibly make it to to do what

[44:04] I want to do and then you know you don't

[44:06] know what people are watching and I look

[44:07] at the the analytics for YouTube and

[44:10] surprisingly our our viewer base is like

[44:13] almost half they watch on a TV which is

[44:16] unbelievable so a lot of people do watch

[44:18] our stuff on TVs um and a lot of people

[44:20] are clearly more Enthusiast based but

[44:23] the other half are watching on a

[44:24] computer or phone screen so you don't

[44:26] know what color profile they're in they

[44:28] could be on a color profile it's

[44:29] completely incompatible it would look

[44:31] horrible based on how I did it so the

[44:33] magic of trying to get something set up

[44:35] only to have the end user with a product

[44:38] they don't understand and it goes into

[44:40] you know 100 700 Hertz mode or 7,000 htz

[44:44] on their TV with you know frame blending

[44:47] and all this stuff that ruins the

[44:48] picture and that nobody knows the

[44:49] difference either like people don't have

[44:51] a good ear or eye because there's never

[44:53] been any real standardization because if

[44:57] standards you wouldn't be able to them

[44:59] right so it kind of goes to that

[45:02] question of you know the gimmicky part

[45:04] of trying to Sol this marketing to make

[45:06] it look cool like oh I sold a laptop

[45:08] with Dolby Atmos wow people like okay

[45:10] it's got Dolby Atmos I don't even know

[45:12] what the hell that is but it it's a

[45:13] feature that they can try to sell as a

[45:15] value ad um and the car market is

[45:18] egregious with this too it's the same

[45:20] thing with the market the the type of

[45:22] nonsense that they're um that trying to

[45:26] push um yeah like like the paddle

[45:29] shifters like do we really need paddle

[45:31] shifters on our steering wheel I mean

[45:34] they oh

[45:36] hello yeah sorry can you still hear me

[45:39] my audio I could hear you I just can't

[45:41] see you okay well it my uh somebody's

[45:44] listening to me on the back end and

[45:45] they're like nope you're not you're not

[45:48] going to talk about us I'm going to try

[45:50] to restart my webcam it I think it

[45:52] crashed okay so I'll I'll get into the

[45:55] next question um was while you can't see

[45:58] me I'm just a black

[46:00] void um your biggest some lessons oh

[46:04] sorry go ahead oh I was just GNA finish

[46:06] one point that I because you asked me

[46:07] about some of the downfalls recently in

[46:09] home theater and I think one of the

[46:11] biggest blows to home theater in the

[46:13] last few months is the fact that the

[46:15] retailers like Best Buy are not

[46:17] supporting Blu-ray anymore so if

[46:20] People's only experience for home

[46:22] theater is streaming they're really

[46:25] missing out because there's a huge

[46:27] difference in sound quality between

[46:28] streaming whether whether it's an Apple

[46:30] TV or Roku Disney plus all that stuff

[46:34] there's always compromises in the audio

[46:36] quality because it's compressed and the

[46:39] streaming versions of these movies

[46:41] either have limited dynamic range

[46:43] limited base extension or they have a

[46:46] lot more compression in the high

[46:47] channels so I would really encourage

[46:49] anyone that has a home theater to to get

[46:52] a Blu-ray player at their very minimum

[46:54] buy their favorite movie if it's an

[46:56] Atmos or if you have the budget a

[46:58] Collide Escape is the way to go that's

[47:00] just the only way you're going to get

[47:02] reference material now because streaming

[47:04] just hasn't caught up until we get

[47:05] lossless audio and until we don't get

[47:08] different compromised mixes for

[47:10] streaming you're never gonna get the

[47:12] full experience that you got in the in

[47:14] the movie theater watching a movie on

[47:17] streaming yeah I'd agree with that and

[47:20] just just I'm gonna ask you can you

[47:21] still hear me clearly and see me yeah

[47:24] okay all right cool I I yeah I I would

[47:27] agree with that the streaming thing it's

[47:29] it's it is amazing honestly and I know

[47:30] you know this when you're working all

[47:32] the time and you're doing stuff the last

[47:33] thing you're going to be able to do and

[47:35] this is really hard for me is go to a

[47:36] theater or sometimes it's just

[47:38] convenient to be able to stream anything

[47:40] you want like I want to see it it's

[47:41] right there and I'm willing to sacrifice

[47:43] some of the quality to see it right then

[47:45] and there but it it it does take away

[47:47] some of the magic namely um I think when

[47:50] you look at HDR or not HDR but uh UHD

[47:53] discs which I know nobody uses like like

[47:55] it's probably got to be like a 1% of the

[47:57] market share but I my dad collects all

[48:00] these movies and he has like all these

[48:02] movies he doesn't even open he's just a

[48:04] collector of movies and he loves them

[48:05] and I now that I've gotten older I never

[48:07] really understood it as much as I like

[48:08] it I'm like why do you have all this

[48:10] stuff that you've never opened and he's

[48:11] like I you know I collection yeah it's a

[48:14] collection and now that I'm older I'm

[48:15] like I want all of it you know I'm not

[48:17] you I'm not going to go in and just loot

[48:19] his house but you know I mean like when

[48:21] when he's gone in a hundred years uh cuz

[48:24] he's going to live forever I you know I

[48:25] would like to take and make a room just

[48:27] for physical that physical media um and

[48:30] I think when you go and as you know you

[48:33] you take a UHD disc and you compare it

[48:36] to the streaming like the same thing

[48:37] even in a 4K stream it's it's not even

[48:39] close um in terms of picture quality but

[48:42] you know if you get used to it right

[48:44] like you can still enjoy it and I think

[48:47] that's the balance of it you don't need

[48:48] a you don't need a $300,000 sports car

[48:51] to enjoy the Driving Experience right so

[48:54] that's the same thing goes with audio

[48:55] and video um and I will go into the next

[48:59] question I've haded up here what do you

[49:01] think your your biggest mistakes and

[49:02] lessons are that you've learned in the

[49:05] the Decades of doing this now I made a

[49:07] lot of mistakes running a website

[49:09] without a marketing degree or anything

[49:11] like that I would say um the biggest one

[49:15] was in the early 2000s I tried to Brand

[49:17] a store with audioholics and I was I

[49:19] guess I was ahead of the uh I was ahead

[49:22] of its time because now everybody does

[49:24] affiliate right so I try to I try to

[49:27] bring a partner in and run an online

[49:29] store that was independent from audio

[49:31] Hawks but they would use my name and it

[49:33] would sell brands with click to buy on

[49:35] the reviews and people did not like that

[49:38] our readers didn't like it we pissed off

[49:41] our advertisers if they weren't included

[49:42] in the store and it just it created a

[49:44] mess for a couple of years and then that

[49:46] company wouldn't let go of my name

[49:48] afterwards when I dissolved the

[49:49] partnership and that was a mess in its

[49:52] own um I'm glad that that chapter is

[49:55] over but then all of the sudden in the

[49:57] last few years you can't survive without

[49:59] affiliate all the YouTube channels are

[50:00] monetized they're all run with Channel

[50:03] Partners everybody's monetizing their

[50:05] websites you know it's not just banners

[50:07] anymore the man the advertisers don't

[50:09] really want the banners they don't see

[50:11] the value in branding anymore they want

[50:13] click to buy they want links embedded in

[50:16] the YouTube videos and it's there's

[50:18] pressure there because now you have to

[50:19] perform you have to get enough views in

[50:22] order for those clicks to work based on

[50:24] the numbers game so that's kind of

[50:26] changed the game a little bit and I and

[50:28] the other thing I see is um other

[50:31] mistakes I've made is I just didn't

[50:33] Focus sometimes on I worri too much

[50:36] about where the next Revenue stream was

[50:38] going to come in and not just have faith

[50:40] that the content itself would win you

[50:43] know and just those kind of challenges I

[50:46] I would always think like during covid I

[50:48] was like oh man my business is ruined I

[50:51] lost 60% of my advertising because

[50:53] everybody pulled out I was like how am I

[50:54] going to recover

[50:56] and then sure enough I had no idea

[50:57] there'd be a Resurgence in home theater

[50:59] because people weren't going to the

[51:01] theaters right they were building home

[51:03] theaters in their houses so postco was

[51:05] the best few years we've

[51:07] had I just couldn't that's amazing do

[51:10] you think people have a better

[51:11] appreciation for it now uh 100% yeah

[51:14] 100% every I mean I talk to friends of

[51:17] mine that are installers and their

[51:18] business is all boomed after Co because

[51:20] of that people are putting dedicated

[51:22] listening spaces look what happened

[51:24] after Co the movies went direct to

[51:25] stream right HBO Max had all the new

[51:28] movies I was loving that I was like man

[51:30] I hope this doesn't end of course it

[51:32] ended because people going back to the

[51:34] theater but for a while that was like

[51:36] just a cool feature to get a brand new

[51:38] release literally when it was coming out

[51:40] on

[51:41] stream and that's something we've talked

[51:43] about forever you know that's always

[51:45] been teased the services that were going

[51:47] to allow you a direct to home the

[51:49] theatrical release and I forgot what

[51:51] company was it was like a $220,000 box

[51:54] or subscription that you could do that a

[51:55] long time ago and I remember going with

[51:57] my dad back in the divix or something

[52:01] yeah I think it I think it was that yeah

[52:03] I remember going to CS or some of the

[52:04] electronic shows when I was a kid and my

[52:07] dad I remember walking with him I was

[52:09] probably six years old and we were in

[52:10] Chicago and um we went to all these like

[52:14] you know the the uh what do you call it

[52:17] the um Hotel setups for all the

[52:20] listening rooms they did in Chicago and

[52:22] yeah I remember listening to like a set

[52:24] of theal speakers and some of these

[52:26] other ones and we're walking home and my

[52:28] dad's like one day you're going to have

[52:30] HDTV in your generation one day you're

[52:33] going to have this stuff and you're

[52:34] going to see movies at home without

[52:36] having to go to the theater and it's

[52:38] funny how it's still you know some of

[52:41] these prophecies have not been fulfilled

[52:43] and it makes sense right it's a big

[52:45] business you're not going to you can't

[52:47] have one streaming service with every uh

[52:50] brand on it so so you're now it's worse

[52:53] than cable was you have to have 75 live

[52:55] streaming services to get you know where

[52:58] is that one movie on more money than

[53:02] yeah it's more I I'm subscribed to like

[53:04] all the streaming services and when I

[53:05] look at my monthly bill I'm like this is

[53:07] way more money than I paid for

[53:09] cable and like half of them are not even

[53:12] good like yeah you still get commercials

[53:15] you still get commercials on some of

[53:16] them like Hulu you got to spend almost

[53:17] 20 a month if you don't want the

[53:18] commercials I love American Dad but do I

[53:21] want to spend 20 a month because I don't

[53:22] want

[53:24] commercials yeah yeah exactly yep and

[53:27] yeah I know saw Amazon is now doing ads

[53:30] I mean it makes sense right these

[53:31] companies if they can't get enough

[53:34] content they need to to get the money to

[53:36] keep the the business rolling um so I

[53:39] don't know it's a slippery slope I I

[53:42] think we're reaching a point of

[53:43] saturation now with streaming so it'll

[53:45] be interesting to see what happens with

[53:47] that like as these Services Fall by the

[53:48] way side um when there's too much

[53:51] because people can't afford to be

[53:52] spending $40 or like the prices keep

[53:55] going going up 20 40 50 or like Hulu

[53:57] like $80 with DVR it's it's crazy it is

[54:01] yeah but don't you think it changed the

[54:03] way it it changed the way we we digest

[54:06] content now in in my opinion and I don't

[54:08] want to get too far off topic movie

[54:10] quality has suffered over the last few

[54:12] years I think everything is recycled

[54:14] plots gender swapping and I everything

[54:17] seems to be the good stories are going

[54:19] to stream but then they hook you because

[54:21] you have to watch serialized content so

[54:24] you you start on a show and you got to

[54:27] watch all the seasons to see how it

[54:28] concludes you can't just jump from one

[54:30] episode to the other so I just think the

[54:32] way we've

[54:33] consumed our media has changed since

[54:36] covid

[54:37] particularly yeah it's gone down quite a

[54:39] bit and I'm not saying that because I'm

[54:41] you know middle-aged white guy that

[54:43] everybody says shouldn't have an opinion

[54:44] anymore um yeah in media space right

[54:47] especially when it comes to um movies

[54:50] and film right like the the concept of

[54:52] if I say something bad about a movie

[54:54] well that's not for you right I I mean I

[54:56] get that I'm I think more there is so

[54:59] much creativity and there's so much

[55:02] talent out there um but I really do

[55:04] think it comes down to what makes money

[55:06] right like the studios don't want to

[55:08] dump a hundred million doar on a movie

[55:10] if it's not going to make triple that

[55:11] back so yeah they're trying to say with

[55:14] safe topics um that said there is an

[55:17] unbelievable amount of great like TV I

[55:19] mean more so than ever um you look at

[55:22] like the last of us which you know is

[55:26] you know I mean like literally took a

[55:27] video game which was a good story to

[55:29] begin with to be fair but they

[55:30] translated it perfectly into a story you

[55:33] care about like and it wasn't it was

[55:36] just different there's a lot of shows

[55:37] like that and we could go on and on and

[55:39] talk about TV and movies but I feel like

[55:41] it's gotten better but I think the mass

[55:43] commercial stuff has gotten worse um and

[55:46] but that to be fair that's also like the

[55:48] the burnout effect of uh the superhero

[55:52] stuff I mean it's been played out for

[55:54] years anyway yeah no I want I want

[55:58] movies like I want movies like the Sha

[56:00] Shank Redemption again we're just not

[56:01] getting movies to that level anymore now

[56:04] every everybody has to fly and it's all

[56:06] action and it's just not deep character

[56:10] development yeah and I think there's a

[56:12] lot there's a lot more competing for

[56:14] your eyes and ears now too um you know

[56:17] like I I talked about I talk about this

[56:18] a lot with media space because you have

[56:20] to go back 50 years and there was like

[56:24] three five channels right five TV

[56:26] channels and your media was really

[56:27] Consolidated your messaging was really

[56:29] Consolidated or you know you'd pick up a

[56:31] newspaper like oh okay I have three

[56:33] choices for a newspaper in my town and

[56:35] that's where you consumed everything now

[56:37] you're inundated with so much like from

[56:41] all these spaces and streaming services

[56:43] and online sites and uh it's going to

[56:46] get worse I think generationally with

[56:48] the the concept of quick you know like

[56:50] the Tik Tok style um just just constant

[56:54] scrolling stuff I think the attention

[56:56] span is also going to deplete I don't

[56:59] know how long form is going to do with

[57:01] that generational shift will they'll

[57:03] will the younger generation get more

[57:04] calmed down and want to watch longer

[57:06] stuff what's your feeling on that well

[57:08] my scary here's what scares me is the

[57:11] reason why I got on YouTube is I saw the

[57:13] decline of people reading

[57:15] online and wanting to digest content on

[57:18] YouTube so back in our Heyday we had our

[57:22] our editorial site had twice the traffic

[57:24] that it has today and it still does well

[57:27] but it had twice the traffic all that

[57:29] shifted over to YouTube so our YouTube

[57:31] channel has about the same traffic now

[57:34] as our editorial site which is crazy but

[57:37] it's the trend is getting worse now

[57:38] people are going like you said to Tik

[57:40] Tok and the attention spans are getting

[57:41] shorter and shorter and they just don't

[57:43] want to read like they used to and I'm

[57:46] guilty of it myself when I go online and

[57:48] I want to find out about a new car or

[57:50] whatever I don't go and read the article

[57:52] I go right to YouTube and look up

[57:54] channels like yours or throttle housee

[57:57] and it's just more entertaining right

[57:58] you want to watch it from your TV so I

[58:01] think there needs to be a balance of

[58:03] that and but I'm just not seeing it like

[58:05] I look at my kids and they're not

[58:07] reading the content they're on Tik Tok

[58:09] and they're on YouTube and that's how

[58:12] they're digesting the information so I

[58:14] don't really know what the answer is to

[58:15] that other than supplementary so when I

[58:18] do a video on audioholics I do put the

[58:20] editorial in more detail if people want

[58:22] to read it but I always promote my

[58:25] YouTube channel back to my website to

[58:27] try to keep that thing going I I think

[58:30] there's certain topics that lend well to

[58:32] written format and supplemental like to

[58:35] your point audio video stuff it's it's

[58:38] really hard you're you're never going to

[58:39] be able to show somebody what a speaker

[58:42] sounds like right it's impossible I mean

[58:44] you can show the speaker and take it

[58:46] apart and like here's the engineering

[58:47] that goes in it which would serve well

[58:49] from a video format but frankly I don't

[58:51] want to watch a 20-minute review to see

[58:52] a bunch of graphs right it would make

[58:54] more sense have it written out and your

[58:57] what scares me about YouTube as well is

[58:59] there's people on YouTube with binaural

[59:01] microphones letting you listen to the

[59:03] speaker through your Beats headphones or

[59:05] your little desktop speakers thinking

[59:06] you're getting the same experience and

[59:08] it's such a disservice it's so dishonest

[59:11] intellectually it's entertaining but

[59:13] it's a it's just bad form you cannot do

[59:16] a listening test through YouTube and

[59:19] hear a speaker at someone else's house

[59:21] and get the same

[59:23] exp it's funny but people take it

[59:25] seriously I I get people arguing with me

[59:28] like you talk 20 minutes about that

[59:30] speaker you never shut up and you never

[59:32] you never let us hear the speaker I'm

[59:34] like am I going to sit here and let you

[59:36] hear a $20,000 pair of peristent

[59:38] speakers on your earbuds and think

[59:40] you're going to get that experience

[59:41] you're going to hear what I'm hearing

[59:42] and you think the microphones are going

[59:44] to accurately represent the acoustic

[59:46] space and what's going on with the

[59:48] speaker versus what's going on with the

[59:49] Acoustics and transfer it back to your

[59:51] speakers it just it doesn't

[59:53] happen so it's hard to play in a space

[59:56] like that um and to kind of reconnect

[59:58] the car world and the product Tech world

[1:00:01] and the speaker world right it's really

[1:00:02] hard to explain some of these

[1:00:04] complicated topics without talking down

[1:00:07] to people right I think that's that's

[1:00:08] the other thing that we Face we get a

[1:00:10] lot of this like oh you guys are

[1:00:11] pretentious you know and it it's hard to

[1:00:15] help people learn while not talking over

[1:00:18] them and making them feel dumb right

[1:00:20] because that's what happens with this

[1:00:21] stuff and I like I listen to your stuff

[1:00:23] I don't ever feel stupid l to it but I'm

[1:00:25] like I have no idea what the hell you're

[1:00:27] talking about and you know it takes a

[1:00:29] lot of work to like get caught up with

[1:00:31] that but at the same time you know like

[1:00:34] you have to have a middle ground of

[1:00:36] trying to help people understand what

[1:00:38] you're saying without going over their

[1:00:39] head but also not dumbing it down and

[1:00:41] watering down the content to the point

[1:00:42] of like I don't want to make Tik Tok

[1:00:44] videos where I have 30 seconds to show a

[1:00:47] dashboard steering wheel a tire and a

[1:00:50] wheel and look how cool it is um I don't

[1:00:52] care about that and I I I know there's

[1:00:54] that game of trying to do that um namely

[1:00:57] in the audio space too like look how

[1:00:58] cool it is you've dealt with that

[1:00:59] forever like look at the Finish or look

[1:01:01] at the specs look how much wattage or

[1:01:03] whatever um I think there's a place that

[1:01:07] you exist and I know you said this and

[1:01:09] it hit me when you first said it is

[1:01:11] you're you've maxed out what you can do

[1:01:14] with the audio video realm of your

[1:01:16] business like there's nothing left

[1:01:17] you've achieved what you went out to do

[1:01:20] so how do you how is that how's that

[1:01:23] changed for you knowing that um

[1:01:26] personally has it evaporated your joy in

[1:01:29] it like what what do you how do you deal

[1:01:31] with it dayto day so there was a period

[1:01:33] a few years ago where I was just burned

[1:01:35] out like I there was I would go to trade

[1:01:37] shows I'm like I've already heard it all

[1:01:39] I'm not interested in this and like I've

[1:01:41] Seen It All I've had so many products in

[1:01:43] my house but then I self-reflected and I

[1:01:46] realized personally I was having some

[1:01:49] struggles of my own like I was dealing

[1:01:51] with some depression and I just wasn't

[1:01:52] getting excited about things

[1:01:55] so then I after I treated that and I

[1:01:57] went through my own personal Journey it

[1:01:59] kind of re um ignited my passion for

[1:02:02] audio and then I got more people

[1:02:05] involved that's that's the thing is

[1:02:06] getting getting more people involved in

[1:02:09] what you do I hired new writers people

[1:02:11] that have fresh perspectives you know

[1:02:14] getting on YouTube and getting the

[1:02:15] reaction out of people and then go into

[1:02:17] to trade shows and when people recognize

[1:02:19] you and they you know they're

[1:02:20] appreciative of your efforts it kind of

[1:02:24] gave me like a new appreciation and that

[1:02:27] I'm so privileged and honored to have

[1:02:30] that I'm able to reach so many people on

[1:02:32] these platforms and and help people make

[1:02:34] better purchasing decisions kind of like

[1:02:37] what you're doing as well that it's kind

[1:02:40] of I'm excited about it now I look

[1:02:42] forward like I saw at CES they had those

[1:02:44] translucent TVs from LG I mean that's

[1:02:46] like that's Tony Stark level stuff you

[1:02:48] know that stuff that we saw in Avengers

[1:02:51] 10 years ago that are now coming to

[1:02:53] fruition or the fact that we now have

[1:02:55] the ability to do multi manage sub room

[1:02:57] correction that I was dreaming about 20

[1:03:00] years ago that I had to do manually so

[1:03:02] there the fact that there's progress

[1:03:04] gives me hope and I see that um younger

[1:03:09] Generations are getting more into audio

[1:03:11] in terms of even if they're listening

[1:03:13] with earbuds they are paying attention

[1:03:15] to listening and the fact that Apple

[1:03:17] music puts so much effort into spatial

[1:03:19] audio I never thought we'd see the day

[1:03:21] where we would be streaming surround

[1:03:22] sound music

[1:03:24] that's you know sit back and think about

[1:03:27] that 10 years ago that was an an

[1:03:28] impossibility you could not do that you

[1:03:30] had to go and buy physical disc to do

[1:03:33] that so the fact that a major company

[1:03:36] like apple is investing in spatial audio

[1:03:38] gives me hope that there's future for

[1:03:41] this and that there's we just got to

[1:03:42] reach the younger generation because

[1:03:44] when us old farts die out well me I'm

[1:03:46] talking about you're you're younger than

[1:03:48] me but when when I die out my

[1:03:51] generation has to pass that passion on

[1:03:54] to the Next

[1:03:55] Generation yeah I think that's those

[1:03:58] people yeah I I think it is really super

[1:04:01] important and it's one of the things

[1:04:02] that's uh drives me more now um I I and

[1:04:06] I mentioned this before and I'm it's

[1:04:08] just because I've been working on it

[1:04:09] with the snsx thing and um I I'm sitting

[1:04:12] here thinking to myself how much work

[1:04:14] I'm doing like trying to trying to get

[1:04:16] this video done and like all the things

[1:04:17] that go into it and part of it after a

[1:04:20] while is a car is a car but you know

[1:04:24] after a while this knowledge goes away

[1:04:28] and this is what I told the engineers

[1:04:29] like they're all you know and there some

[1:04:30] of 60s and 70s right they're they're

[1:04:32] been retired and I told

[1:04:34] them you know once you're gone and this

[1:04:38] knowledge is not shared it's not

[1:04:40] relearned you know the the past lessons

[1:04:42] are gone so what is it that you know for

[1:04:45] me I didn't create these things to like

[1:04:47] to your point like I've spent my entire

[1:04:49] life supporting product or fixing things

[1:04:53] that are wrong with things that are

[1:04:54] people creating or trying to make them

[1:04:56] better for the people that are creating

[1:04:58] them so a lot of my job is to try to

[1:05:00] share some of these stories and some of

[1:05:03] the knowledge that has gone into them so

[1:05:05] people have a better appreciation of

[1:05:07] that and that's what gets me excited and

[1:05:10] it's more rare let's be real because

[1:05:12] most of the products are just out

[1:05:14] you know they really are they're just

[1:05:15] quick let's get them out we need to sell

[1:05:17] a lot in high volume but there are

[1:05:19] products out there that really get you

[1:05:20] excited and you want people to learn and

[1:05:22] understand and there's so much fun to be

[1:05:23] had with that and if I can pass along

[1:05:25] even other people's work um that's

[1:05:28] really that's the best thing I can do at

[1:05:30] this point with what I'm trying to do um

[1:05:33] and H have you I know you talked to a

[1:05:35] lot of people you talked to a lot of

[1:05:36] Engineers that do audio and video

[1:05:39] um how is it is it mostly just the

[1:05:42] people that are working in these smaller

[1:05:43] companies that you have access to how do

[1:05:46] you view the small versus the big

[1:05:47] commodity Brands no that's what that's

[1:05:49] what another thing that really blows me

[1:05:52] away is is even though our Channel's not

[1:05:55] as nearly as big as yours we are watched

[1:05:57] by people I don't realize are watching

[1:05:59] us I I had an interview with a guy that

[1:06:02] did the uh Atmos mixing for the Star

[1:06:04] Wars movies he was a fan of my channel I

[1:06:06] had no idea we gave him some

[1:06:08] consultation because he's making a

[1:06:09] mixing studio in his house and he's

[1:06:11] going to be producing content on it so

[1:06:14] that kind of stuff is amazing I had most

[1:06:16] recently last summer I had uh Yamaha

[1:06:19] reach out to me and their lead designer

[1:06:21] in Japan for their Hi-Fi division one

[1:06:24] wanted to come out visit me showcase his

[1:06:26] new products sit down with me listen to

[1:06:28] music and we spent two days together and

[1:06:31] this dude was awesome I mean this is the

[1:06:32] guy that's designing the very best audio

[1:06:35] equipment that Yamaha makes hanging out

[1:06:37] with me drinking saki listening to blues

[1:06:40] music I mean I just this is why I do

[1:06:43] what I do you know I the fact that I'm

[1:06:46] able to have these kind of relationships

[1:06:48] and and influence these companies

[1:06:50] because they listen to what I say when I

[1:06:52] find an anomaly and their product they

[1:06:54] go and make changes so it's not just the

[1:06:56] small companies which I do work with as

[1:06:58] well but the large companies pay

[1:07:00] attention I mean large companies like uh

[1:07:03] Mor morance and Denon have made major

[1:07:05] changes to their products because of my

[1:07:07] testing and loudspeakers too we have a

[1:07:10] guy that does all of our loudspeakers

[1:07:12] James Larsson he's incredibly

[1:07:14] resourceful he takes the speakers

[1:07:15] outside to do accurate measurements when

[1:07:18] he does this stuff the manufacturers

[1:07:20] watch it and if there's problems they

[1:07:22] try to make improvements to the products

[1:07:24] the good companies do that yeah you know

[1:07:26] and that's so that's that's just an

[1:07:29] awesome thing and and I just have to

[1:07:30] tell you the fact that you keep talking

[1:07:32] about this NSX project the fact that you

[1:07:33] sit in that car and drive it that's like

[1:07:35] a dream of mine I would love to drive

[1:07:37] that car that's a beautiful car that

[1:07:39] must be

[1:07:40] awesome yeah it's um I think a lot of

[1:07:44] these like NSX specifically uh Jack and

[1:07:48] I started doing a video on it like a

[1:07:51] year ago and like oh I I wanted do it

[1:07:54] like a documentary style thing and then

[1:07:55] we interviewed people

[1:07:57] that spent their business supporting

[1:08:00] this car most of their adult life like

[1:08:01] literally servicing and supporting and

[1:08:03] and supporting the owner community and

[1:08:04] I'm like I cannot tell a story about

[1:08:08] this car without getting the Japanese

[1:08:09] involved because this is what we do as

[1:08:11] in As Americans or in the United States

[1:08:13] we we we get these products and we spin

[1:08:17] our own stories on them and we make it

[1:08:20] like it's our own and we don't get to

[1:08:21] hear from the people that actually

[1:08:23] worked on them and knew I'm like okay

[1:08:24] how old are these guys when can I get

[1:08:26] you know can I get a hold of them you

[1:08:28] know like and I made the mistake open

[1:08:31] opening up that door and um I was not

[1:08:34] prepared for the door that I opened uh

[1:08:37] however it's probably the this is like

[1:08:40] most things with life right like the

[1:08:42] hardest things you do the most difficult

[1:08:44] things you do whether you enjoy them or

[1:08:45] not the Silver Lining is usually you

[1:08:47] learn a lot from it and oh yeah and I

[1:08:51] know you know this going through

[1:08:52] difficulties and running a business

[1:08:54] you you learn from mistakes or even not

[1:08:56] mistakes you just learn by having to do

[1:08:58] more than you normally would have done

[1:09:00] um and you learn what you did good and

[1:09:02] what you can do better next time and

[1:09:04] what you would never do again but I

[1:09:05] really love um it to me it's Way Beyond

[1:09:09] the car at this point Way Beyond the

[1:09:10] driving the car and all that and it's

[1:09:13] more about how these things come about

[1:09:16] like the stories behind the people and

[1:09:17] how they were and this was their life

[1:09:20] you know literally some of these dudes

[1:09:22] that made this this specific car and it

[1:09:24] could be any car to be honest some of

[1:09:25] these big cars they've dedicated almost

[1:09:28] their entire adult life this was their

[1:09:30] one achievement that they had in their

[1:09:32] generation and their life that's the

[1:09:34] biggest thing that they did and a lot of

[1:09:36] the Japanese especially tie a lot of

[1:09:38] their identity to that thing that they

[1:09:41] did over anything else and I find

[1:09:44] that sad but I also find it very

[1:09:48] fascinating and compelling that somebody

[1:09:50] put this much energy into something and

[1:09:52] I have a lot of respect for for that

[1:09:54] because we're so spread out right like I

[1:09:56] know you and I we're in a million

[1:09:57] different directions but if I had to

[1:09:59] dedicate to one thing and that one thing

[1:10:02] was this car that you know people are

[1:10:04] still talking about it's like the

[1:10:06] closest thing you can come to like an

[1:10:07] art piece or something that hopefully

[1:10:09] will live on long after you're gone so

[1:10:12] it's it's cool um there's not too many

[1:10:15] products you can talk about that you can

[1:10:16] pass that stuff on and I'm sure on the

[1:10:18] audio video space you know there's some

[1:10:20] historic pieces of equipment uh that

[1:10:23] people think about and talk about but

[1:10:24] it's probably less than some of these

[1:10:26] historic cars I would would think do is

[1:10:28] that I mean there's classic there's

[1:10:30] classic designs there's gold standards

[1:10:32] of what audio files consider to be

[1:10:35] products that are Timeless right like

[1:10:37] JBL has the L100 which when it came out

[1:10:41] back in the day wasn't a very good

[1:10:42] speaker but it was kind of the gold

[1:10:45] standard and JBL actually brought that

[1:10:47] speaker back with modern engineering and

[1:10:49] it's a much better speaker now with

[1:10:51] updated driver Tech and a wave guide but

[1:10:54] yeah I mean there there is some of that

[1:10:56] there's the funny thing is some of this

[1:10:57] audio Nostalgia is what really drives uh

[1:11:01] the appreciation for that like old

[1:11:02] Macintosh gear Old Macintosh gear sells

[1:11:06] for more now than it was sold for when

[1:11:08] you bought it in the

[1:11:09] 70s and so it's I mean it's beautiful

[1:11:12] stuff with the blue uh front glass and

[1:11:15] the Vu

[1:11:16] meters yeah but on a bench some of the

[1:11:18] stuff isn't that great it's certainly

[1:11:20] not worth the amount of money that

[1:11:22] they're asking for it's almost like a P

[1:11:23] of jewelry at that point you know but

[1:11:25] that's that's how it is the the

[1:11:27] perception it's not always it's not

[1:11:28] always about the measurements it's not

[1:11:30] always about the performance it's about

[1:11:32] the perception and how you connect to

[1:11:34] the product that really matters and you

[1:11:35] could connect with something like a

[1:11:37] Macintosh product over like a den

[1:11:39] receiver you know Den or so Mass Market

[1:11:42] product you don't get that kind of

[1:11:43] emotional connection and that that's a

[1:11:46] big part of of your experience with

[1:11:48] audio and video is the emotional

[1:11:50] connection to seeing the product in the

[1:11:51] room and um

[1:11:54] I don't think uh some of the

[1:11:55] manufacturers that that really push the

[1:11:57] blind listening test to remove the bias

[1:12:00] they don't always factor in the fact

[1:12:02] that you have to live with the product

[1:12:04] in a room and if you have something that

[1:12:06] sounds good in a room but also looks

[1:12:08] good that changes your whole perception

[1:12:10] of how you experience it and I'm

[1:12:12] imagining the same thing with cars I

[1:12:13] look at some of the cars today and I

[1:12:16] look at like what BMW did with that

[1:12:18] Beaver grill that kills me that I just

[1:12:21] won't I won't trade my m240 for a car

[1:12:23] that has that big grill on the front and

[1:12:25] I don't know why they're doing it but

[1:12:27] that's everybody's doing that Lexus did

[1:12:29] that with the is I had the is- 350 which

[1:12:32] in Black looked okay but those grills

[1:12:34] keep getting bigger and and it's a

[1:12:37] design choice I guess that the industry

[1:12:39] kind of stuck with but it created a very

[1:12:41] polarized result right I think there's a

[1:12:43] lot of BMW enthusiasts that prefer the

[1:12:45] older designs over the new designs for

[1:12:47] that

[1:12:48] reason yeah it's an interesting

[1:12:51] discussion with the car stuff and the

[1:12:53] car design um because cars are weird in

[1:12:57] the fact that they have multi people

[1:12:59] have them for multiple reasons right

[1:13:01] they can be a vanity piece they can be a

[1:13:03] flex they can be you know a status piece

[1:13:06] they can be an A2B machine that's like a

[1:13:08] toaster you know uh some people are

[1:13:10] enthusiasts they just love the car they

[1:13:11] don't care how it looks um so there's so

[1:13:14] many reasons why people buy cars but

[1:13:16] yeah I I think what struck me is there's

[1:13:19] and when we did our we did this video

[1:13:21] with elcid air Sapphire and the

[1:13:23] engineers and the guys that we talked to

[1:13:25] and girls they were they had some

[1:13:28] interesting things to say and one of the

[1:13:30] the brand managers he's like you know

[1:13:31] we've gone through this evolution of

[1:13:33] additive design big grills uh add-on

[1:13:37] pieces for the sake of it nonfunctional

[1:13:39] pieces and now you're starting to see

[1:13:40] that reverse itself so it's again it

[1:13:42] rolls in Trends right like you talked

[1:13:43] about the jbls like they're re releasing

[1:13:45] a a Heritage or Legacy speaker and

[1:13:47] improving it so there's these trends

[1:13:50] that we go on um and I think the BMW

[1:13:53] thing

[1:13:54] is interesting because you know all the

[1:13:55] BMWs for a long time look the same like

[1:13:58] that generation like after you know they

[1:14:00] were all the same and what is every

[1:14:01] other brand do they copy that formula so

[1:14:04] BMWs and I remember doing one of the

[1:14:06] first couple BMW videos like the problem

[1:14:08] with BMW is everybody else has done what

[1:14:10] they've done so it's been copied out to

[1:14:12] the point where they no longer feels and

[1:14:15] looks special so I think they picked up

[1:14:18] and I'm not saying has anything to do

[1:14:19] with you know that mentality but I think

[1:14:21] they picked up on it and they're just

[1:14:23] like we're no longer going to be copied

[1:14:25] we need to throw all that out and just

[1:14:26] be seen so you look at the XM that SUV I

[1:14:30] don't know if you know what that is it's

[1:14:33] like uh no it's it's the V8 one

[1:14:35] basically it's like an X7

[1:14:39] size uh

[1:14:42] hideous um I'm

[1:14:47] gonna put this up here just for a

[1:14:50] second anyway it's it's an SUV

[1:14:54] um that is just disgusting and it kind

[1:14:59] of sums up what this is happened to this

[1:15:04] brand um I I I'm assuming you can see my

[1:15:08] screen

[1:15:09] hopefully yeah okay so it it just takes

[1:15:12] what you hate oh gosh yeah please and

[1:15:16] and turns it into like amplifies it

[1:15:19] right and somebody so much bling so much

[1:15:21] bling that's not needed for the brand in

[1:15:23] my opinion yeah oh here's here's a

[1:15:26] perfect example right like somebody had

[1:15:28] to make an active

[1:15:30] decision

[1:15:32] um somebody had to make that active

[1:15:35] decision that it was like a big middle

[1:15:38] finger right like we're going to be seen

[1:15:39] I have the money and I want to be

[1:15:41] different and in some cases I don't

[1:15:44] think it's working but in other cases I

[1:15:45] think it will help and I think it's

[1:15:46] going to help other companies stand step

[1:15:48] aside or you know separate themselves

[1:15:50] you know obviously it's not for you or I

[1:15:52] clearly I don't like that but some

[1:15:54] people do it's weird well that's what

[1:15:56] kills me about like the m240 I have the

[1:15:59] 2018 and the new version is is a lot

[1:16:02] faster because mostly because it has

[1:16:04] all-wheel drive right but I don't like

[1:16:07] the design cues it like it doesn't blend

[1:16:09] like the rear tail lights look like the

[1:16:11] sloth from Ice Age and yeah yep it it's

[1:16:14] just gawky and it's too the car's bigger

[1:16:17] yet there's less space in the back seat

[1:16:19] so I'm confused what is it trying to be

[1:16:21] is it a sports car is it a

[1:16:24] Dan I I don't know I didn't I never

[1:16:26] drove it I never compared it to my 240

[1:16:29] but my 240 and maybe I'm buyas because I

[1:16:31] own it but it's kind of a Timeless car

[1:16:33] it's like when the one series came out

[1:16:35] it was too small it didn't look right

[1:16:37] but the two series had the right

[1:16:39] proportions and if you get the M2 which

[1:16:41] I couldn't afford at the time the M2 is

[1:16:43] gorgeous because it has it's wider it's

[1:16:45] like almost like an M4 but it has the it

[1:16:48] also has the older engine it doesn't

[1:16:50] have the b-58 or at least the old M2

[1:16:52] didn't

[1:16:54] yeah and that that becomes the problem

[1:16:55] you know you get the the newer car with

[1:16:57] the better techn well in some cases

[1:16:59] better technology better performance and

[1:17:01] then you know you get saddled with the

[1:17:03] the horrific modern styling of or you

[1:17:06] know again the trendy styling of what

[1:17:08] what is required from the the current

[1:17:10] generation I I know you said you like

[1:17:12] the Macintosh connection and I just

[1:17:13] thought to myself I'm like I know the

[1:17:15] exact thing for you uh as a Macintosh

[1:17:18] fan uh get the new Jeep Wagoner with the

[1:17:21] Macintosh audio system in there it's a

[1:17:23] game changer for sure I saw that at one

[1:17:26] of the trade shows yeah I saw that big

[1:17:29] plate on the big face plate on the front

[1:17:31] yeah yeah the digital face plate yeah we

[1:17:34] uh when we tested that I think it was

[1:17:36] probably one of the worst audio systems

[1:17:38] we had ever

[1:17:38] tested the Bas base curve was like I

[1:17:42] can't draw it but it was like here and

[1:17:45] then it comes down you know I mean it

[1:17:47] was I I don't know what they did I have

[1:17:49] no idea why they did it somebody made a

[1:17:50] clear decision to do it it wouldn't have

[1:17:52] slipped through but yeah it was

[1:17:53] horrendous um McIntosh is an interesting

[1:17:56] company because they have an amazing

[1:17:57] Heritage you know they're an American

[1:17:59] company they've been around

[1:18:00] forever and I this is my personal

[1:18:03] opinion I thought they made some good

[1:18:04] speakers back in the day in the 70s and

[1:18:06] 80s they they had a guy Roger Russell

[1:18:09] that was largely involved and he did

[1:18:11] some great stuff but I feel like in the

[1:18:14] modern years when they came out with

[1:18:15] these large line of Ray they just they

[1:18:17] got a good deal on these two-inch

[1:18:19] drivers that were probably desktop p uh

[1:18:21] PC speakers and they just put 20 or 30

[1:18:23] of them in his big array with big

[1:18:25] woofers behind them and every time I

[1:18:27] listened to him when it was at a trade

[1:18:29] show even in an acoustically control

[1:18:31] room there was just no sense of cohesion

[1:18:34] to the sound it was just like a wall of

[1:18:36] sound and then they just bragged about

[1:18:38] how much power was behind it with all

[1:18:39] their big amplifiers and I don't know if

[1:18:42] it's because they're appealing to the

[1:18:43] older audio file older than me and as

[1:18:47] you get older obviously your hearing

[1:18:48] declines and they're just trying to make

[1:18:50] a speaker that's big and bold for them

[1:18:52] but I feel like a company like them with

[1:18:54] all their resources and all their

[1:18:56] Heritage they could be doing

[1:18:57] loudspeakers much better than they're

[1:18:58] doing them yeah yeah I think that that's

[1:19:02] a good point I I think the expectation

[1:19:04] level goes up when you have the level of

[1:19:06] expertise and Heritage in a brand um

[1:19:09] it's a blessing and a curse right

[1:19:10] because the expectation goes up like hey

[1:19:13] you're one of the best at this you

[1:19:14] should be able to do it right and I

[1:19:16] don't know that that's really if you

[1:19:18] don't have the right people to do it and

[1:19:19] some of the right leadership of deciding

[1:19:21] what you're going to do or have a Clear

[1:19:23] Vision in terms of products like that

[1:19:25] sometimes it just it's better off not

[1:19:26] doing it if you're not going to really

[1:19:29] do it right sometimes um but well

[1:19:32] there's been companies there's been

[1:19:33] subwoofer companies that try to make

[1:19:35] loudspeakers valadin Tred to make

[1:19:37] loudspeakers they were

[1:19:38] atrocious JL Audio tried to make

[1:19:40] loudspeakers for the home and it didn't

[1:19:42] work out but JL Audio makes great

[1:19:45] subwoofers and they make great

[1:19:46] subwoofers for home as well they're just

[1:19:48] they're pricey but they sound great they

[1:19:50] really are good but I just don't see

[1:19:52] them at least in the near future is

[1:19:54] becoming a real competitor for making

[1:19:56] home loudspeakers full range

[1:19:59] loudspeakers and what's the incentive

[1:20:01] too I mean I I this is what I was going

[1:20:03] to ask you too there's like this level

[1:20:04] of saturation and when I was looking to

[1:20:07] do speakers in my room which I'm going

[1:20:09] to get into with you in just here in a

[1:20:11] minute because I I know how much how

[1:20:13] much time do you have left just so I can

[1:20:14] manage expectations here uh you know

[1:20:16] another 10 or I mean is there a good

[1:20:18] stream going I don't even know how many

[1:20:19] people I let me let me take a look cuz

[1:20:21] I've honestly been I don't want to be

[1:20:23] boring yeah and I I know like that it's

[1:20:26] the tricky part of this um answering the

[1:20:30] questions yeah let me go through here

[1:20:32] because there is there is quite a bit I

[1:20:34] don't know how many are actually

[1:20:35] questions

[1:20:39] versus I can't even go all the way up

[1:20:42] here all right um there are it looks

[1:20:45] like there

[1:20:46] are one two three four five five Super

[1:20:51] chats which which is is good because

[1:20:54] sometimes we get insane amount where

[1:20:56] you're sitting here for three days

[1:21:00] um but there there seems to be a lot of

[1:21:03] questions to go through so I will yeah

[1:21:05] if you want to go through a couple of

[1:21:06] those if any if any of them have pertain

[1:21:08] the audio I'd be happy to try to help

[1:21:10] out with that okay I'd say maybe another

[1:21:13] 10 or 15 minutes is good okay yeah let's

[1:21:16] start hitting some of the questions

[1:21:17] let's start with the the ones that

[1:21:20] people you know paid for thank you

[1:21:22] everybody obviously

[1:21:25] um one guy Tails said come on guys show

[1:21:29] some support thank you uh

[1:21:32] Brandon he's like what are your thoughts

[1:21:34] on the Tesla audio systems uh keep up

[1:21:37] the great

[1:21:38] content uh Jean have you heard any of

[1:21:40] them my brother has the model y he

[1:21:43] swears it's a great audio system um I

[1:21:46] have not sat and listen to it so I can't

[1:21:48] intelligently comment but I do know they

[1:21:50] put a lot of effort into their audio

[1:21:52] system I know it's proprietary uh it's

[1:21:54] not a Harmon system as far as I know

[1:21:56] it's Tesla's own and yeah I can't really

[1:22:00] give you any comments on

[1:22:01] it um I've only heard three of them uh

[1:22:06] and I know that they just announced and

[1:22:07] I'm not sure I don't don't quote me on

[1:22:09] this but I think they just said they're

[1:22:10] cutting costs on the model 3 audio

[1:22:12] system they're actually cutting taking

[1:22:14] money out of it I don't know what that

[1:22:15] means if I even heard it right it might

[1:22:17] be model y one of the two and it'll

[1:22:18] probably happen to both of them to save

[1:22:20] money um the the three cars that I heard

[1:22:23] had a problem with Reflections

[1:22:26] reflectivity when you have a glass roof

[1:22:29] there's only so much you can do to

[1:22:30] control those Reflections I don't care

[1:22:32] what you do and that that's the problem

[1:22:34] even on phone calls there is you hear

[1:22:37] the Decay time of even talking is like

[1:22:40] it's scattering all over and I think

[1:22:42] that was my big problem with the audio

[1:22:43] systems is I think that they're well

[1:22:45] engineered for what they are but to my

[1:22:47] to my ear um they they just have a

[1:22:50] problem with the interior space that

[1:22:52] that's just it it's too too too much

[1:22:54] Reflections too many hard surfaces it's

[1:22:56] a very reflective cabin and that's

[1:22:58] that's what I would leave it at Brandon

[1:23:01] now the model S I have not driven so I I

[1:23:03] don't know about the model S interior

[1:23:05] and and that brings me back one question

[1:23:07] to you is I'm not a big fan of the trend

[1:23:09] in the industry where you have these

[1:23:10] giant glass roofs now like why do I have

[1:23:13] to have that in every car and I live in

[1:23:16] Florida and you even with the little

[1:23:17] Shield that comes on you still get

[1:23:19] blasted with the sun you still feel the

[1:23:21] heat it doesn't as

[1:23:23] well uh it's a a massive wow factor

[1:23:27] right like the Lucid air that we did um

[1:23:30] the sapphire did not have it wasn't even

[1:23:32] an option it was a glass roof but the

[1:23:34] regular car that we drove I I was

[1:23:36] filming it I was like laying down in the

[1:23:37] back seat with a camera trying to show

[1:23:39] the scope of this piece of glass and I'm

[1:23:43] like this sucks it's not that it doesn't

[1:23:45] look cool I mean the visibility the

[1:23:47] openness that you get is the same

[1:23:48] openness you walk into a house with like

[1:23:50] a 20ft ceiling right it's the same con

[1:23:53] want tooc in car and gives this but of

[1:23:57] if you like audio or trying to quieter

[1:24:01] cabin from an engineering point it's

[1:24:02] what a nightmare so you lean on all the

[1:24:04] noise cancellation quiet it down playing

[1:24:07] through the speakers to try to get

[1:24:09] rid of some of that noise and you're

[1:24:10] trying to have to over insulate other

[1:24:11] parts it's a nightmare it looks cool but

[1:24:14] that's about it um and I could go on

[1:24:17] more but I won't

[1:24:19] um Raider blue you mentioned W's

[1:24:22] upgraded audio systems are sometimes

[1:24:24] worse than the base audio system can you

[1:24:25] explain that seems

[1:24:27] counterintuitive uh so the the two

[1:24:30] recently um that we that we did um one

[1:24:34] was I'm pretty sure it was an F-150 and

[1:24:40] the I want to say the bronos sport one

[1:24:42] of the two that had I'd have to go back

[1:24:44] because we've tested so many cars but

[1:24:46] the two the F-150 that had the upgraded

[1:24:48] bang and ol and the bno play and I think

[1:24:51] it was like a $2,000 option um the

[1:24:55] amount of money they spent on the

[1:24:56] speakers was roughly the same that they

[1:24:58] did on the base audio system and the

[1:25:00] calibration of however they did the

[1:25:01] eqing in the car was horrible uh like

[1:25:04] transition from the sub was all messed

[1:25:06] up like you you'd have this massive base

[1:25:08] swing and like a a 30 DB drop on the

[1:25:11] crossover so you have high base and then

[1:25:13] you lose all the mid-range and then it's

[1:25:15] like this the the frequency responses

[1:25:17] like all over the place and it just

[1:25:18] sounds it sounds horrible like it does

[1:25:22] forget the graphs for a minute yeah it

[1:25:24] just sounds like a tin can in there

[1:25:26] everything's thin it's all base you

[1:25:28] can't dial it out there's no way to dial

[1:25:29] it out um it was something that was

[1:25:31] thrown in there for the the least amount

[1:25:34] of money possible and whoever had to try

[1:25:37] to fix it in terms of tuning just

[1:25:39] couldn't do it there was no way to do it

[1:25:41] and some of those systems and I think

[1:25:43] we've called them out we've definitely

[1:25:44] called them out in the videos uh about

[1:25:47] that you don't spend the money on it

[1:25:50] it's really a waste you're not getting

[1:25:51] anything other than having the bno name

[1:25:53] on it um and they're one of the few

[1:25:55] Brands and Chevy's done that before too

[1:25:57] but Ford definitely is egregious into

[1:25:59] that point and I know they're trying to

[1:26:00] fix it I know internally they're trying

[1:26:02] to fix it but it hasn't happened yet

[1:26:04] yeah and I heard the systems in the

[1:26:06] Honda Accord and the Honda um the CRV

[1:26:09] and they're really bad in my opinion I

[1:26:11] don't know if you listen to them they

[1:26:13] got worse Honda used to have decent

[1:26:15] audio systems back in the day I don't

[1:26:16] know why they cut so much well we know

[1:26:19] they cut budget out of it obviously yeah

[1:26:22] I think they were Alpine the upper end

[1:26:24] were Alpine but they weren't branded

[1:26:25] Alpine yeah yeah um yeah they they were

[1:26:28] decent it's changed a lot like yeah

[1:26:31] whenever you test I think the the new

[1:26:33] Bose systems now they're moving over to

[1:26:35] bows of course uh bows and then Harmon

[1:26:37] stuff on the Acura side but the Bose

[1:26:40] stuff surprisingly has gotten better so

[1:26:44] like if you listen to the new Accord and

[1:26:46] the new Civic and the pilot is average

[1:26:49] because it's such a big cabin on the

[1:26:50] inside it's such a big space they have

[1:26:52] improved over the previous generation so

[1:26:55] they're but again that's trying to

[1:26:56] compete with the other brands what

[1:26:57] they're doing and then you know as you

[1:26:59] consolidate down your basically same

[1:27:01] Engineers working on the cars so

[1:27:03] everything's going to sound the

[1:27:05] same um Bose get Bose gets a bad

[1:27:07] reputation in home audio uh because

[1:27:09] that's really that's not their bread and

[1:27:11] butter their bread and butter is you

[1:27:13] know the headphones and car audio and

[1:27:16] I've heard some really good bow systems

[1:27:17] in cars my friend had a C7 Corvette I

[1:27:21] thought that system sounded pretty darn

[1:27:22] good for what it was yeah surprisingly

[1:27:25] JM does a good job in the Corvette Jack

[1:27:27] has uh my my uh coworker he's got a C8

[1:27:32] um and the audio system is is good for

[1:27:34] what it is given the constraints they

[1:27:36] have in the car so there's ways to do it

[1:27:38] they just have to make it a priority

[1:27:40] obviously um Mike said I haven't been

[1:27:43] able to catch one of these live streams

[1:27:44] in a while keep up the great work um

[1:27:46] thanks Mike and we're doing another live

[1:27:48] stream Just Jack and I next week so get

[1:27:50] ready for a 4our power

[1:27:53] session you take bathroom breaks when

[1:27:55] you go for four hours I could I could

[1:27:57] never last yeah I do because I'm like 90

[1:28:00] years old Jack doesn't have you know his

[1:28:01] prostates not 50 pounds yet that's me

[1:28:04] right

[1:28:06] there reach you reach the the the uh

[1:28:09] high powered age of 40 and 50 it starts

[1:28:13] to become an issue yes um we have uh

[1:28:17] Stephen more Savage geese forever thank

[1:28:19] you appreciate it thanks for thanks for

[1:28:22] coming on uh the Biff just thanks for

[1:28:25] the conversation thank you so much for

[1:28:27] just coming on listen to us ramble about

[1:28:29] stuff um thanks for your focus on

[1:28:32] quality and honesty uh I should probably

[1:28:34] be studying right now thank you and the

[1:28:37] satire we're very sarcastic Jean to a

[1:28:39] fault I have to dial it back for my own

[1:28:44] self-preservation uh what do we got here

[1:28:46] next one uh Matthew thanks Jean for

[1:28:49] coming on would love another one of the

[1:28:51] these favorite source for good quality

[1:28:53] audio now CD digital HD tracks other so

[1:28:57] I'm going to say yes on that I like all

[1:29:00] good sources of audio I I still spin

[1:29:02] records people will make fun of it

[1:29:04] there's certain music like 70s 80s

[1:29:06] Fusion Jazz that just TR did not

[1:29:09] transfer as well digitally as it is on

[1:29:12] analog so i' like to just spin a record

[1:29:14] sometimes I listen to Apple music

[1:29:17] lossless title Amazon HD I still love SA

[1:29:22] I know I'm I'm a dinosaur but I probably

[1:29:24] have two or 300ds and and sometimes I

[1:29:27] just want to sit in my theater room and

[1:29:30] put on an sacd Patricia Barber or even

[1:29:32] some of the genus's re-releases and I

[1:29:35] love listening to that I have some DVD

[1:29:38] audio I love the fact that there's

[1:29:40] Blu-rays now like one of my favorite

[1:29:42] artists Stephen Wilson has I introduced

[1:29:45] him to Dolby Atmos he didn't even know

[1:29:46] what Dolby Atmos was when he came out

[1:29:48] with his album in

[1:29:49] 2011 now he's mixing all of this stuff

[1:29:52] in Atmos and you could buy it on Blu-ray

[1:29:54] and I love that because there's artwork

[1:29:56] supporting with the music so that's a

[1:29:58] great experience if you could get music

[1:29:59] in Blu-ray format that's my favorite I

[1:30:02] have to say that's my favorite what uh

[1:30:05] just to piggyback off this um what

[1:30:07] service do you use to listen to your

[1:30:09] music streaming service or what what's

[1:30:10] your most common way to playback music

[1:30:12] if you're listening to it so I have

[1:30:13] tidle and apple music and I favor Apple

[1:30:16] because I think they did a better job

[1:30:18] implementing spatial audio I think

[1:30:20] there's too much level difference in

[1:30:22] title still going from like you'll

[1:30:24] you'll be on an Atmos track and then

[1:30:25] it'll go to two channel and the and the

[1:30:27] level will jump up 15 DB and scare the

[1:30:30] out of you I think Apple's a little

[1:30:32] bit more put together when it comes to

[1:30:34] that and apple has a better selection of

[1:30:35] spatial audio but they're both good

[1:30:37] formats stream formats uh do you have

[1:30:40] like two or three top tracks that you

[1:30:42] listen to like every single set of

[1:30:44] speakers that you do like your favorite

[1:30:46] three tracks to test something on that

[1:30:48] somebody would want to like listen to so

[1:30:50] there's this there's this artist called

[1:30:51] Maran Hill and there's a song called

[1:30:54] differently and that'll determine if

[1:30:56] your speakers have good bass or not and

[1:30:58] it's just good dynamist good transients

[1:31:01] uh Dominic Fe she's a friend of our

[1:31:04] Channel she's a Canadian singer French

[1:31:06] Canadian singer the track called Birds

[1:31:10] it's just beautiful sound for two

[1:31:12] channel um you get to hear the clarity

[1:31:15] of her vocals you get to hear uh just

[1:31:17] decorrelated information so you could

[1:31:19] see if you set up a nice wide Sound

[1:31:21] Stage those are kind of two tracks I

[1:31:23] listen to a lot um I know I just kind of

[1:31:25] vary I'm a jazz person so I'll put on

[1:31:27] some Pat methen um when he's in like a

[1:31:30] three or four piece band because I just

[1:31:32] want to know the purity of of how his

[1:31:35] guitar

[1:31:36] sounds and you know stuff like that some

[1:31:38] some of the stuff I listened to is a

[1:31:40] little obscure that most people probably

[1:31:41] wouldn't like but my my music tastes

[1:31:45] vary yeah it makes sense especially

[1:31:47] doing what you're doing and you like

[1:31:49] you're testing speakers like you have to

[1:31:50] have a wide variety content to go

[1:31:52] through I mean I'll throw on Drake I'll

[1:31:54] tell you what throw on Drake fair trade

[1:31:57] that song has infrasonic base if you

[1:31:59] have a good subwoofer that I didn't even

[1:32:02] know existed in my car when I listen to

[1:32:04] it in the car you don't hear it when I

[1:32:05] listen to my home theater I'm like holy

[1:32:07] cow there's a lot of lowend Base in that

[1:32:09] song I just didn't know that existed and

[1:32:11] it's actually mixed pretty well like

[1:32:13] below 30 or below 20 defin I would I

[1:32:17] didn't measure it but I'm saying i'

[1:32:19] probably say below 20 there's some stuff

[1:32:21] going on track yeah okay interesting

[1:32:24] yeah yeah that's cool because everybody

[1:32:25] always asks that I know I'm sure you I

[1:32:27] could look it up on your website but

[1:32:28] that's too much work you know so I'll

[1:32:30] just have you tell people here London

[1:32:33] Grammar London grammar is another one

[1:32:35] London Grammar m is incredibly well uh

[1:32:38] produced music and good demo

[1:32:42] material makes sense uh Bob Wilson asked

[1:32:46] if Macintosh equals VW Conrad Johnson

[1:32:49] Volvo Cambridge equals Chevrolet bno BMW

[1:32:53] which audio brand is stellantis dumb

[1:32:55] question I know man that seems like math

[1:32:58] is involved in this one yeah I know I I

[1:33:01] I know what you're getting at I'm I'm

[1:33:03] trying to think stantis definitely would

[1:33:06] be probably

[1:33:08] something Jean what would be the most

[1:33:11] commodity speaker that is very very base

[1:33:15] heavy and very very elevated in the

[1:33:20] highs

[1:33:22] let me think about that for a minute

[1:33:24] like basically just have just like a V

[1:33:25] curve just a lot of base and a lot of

[1:33:27] travel

[1:33:31] yeah

[1:33:34] uh it you know there are brands that do

[1:33:37] that that that don't follow that

[1:33:39] philosophy through their entire line

[1:33:40] there's there was a paradigm speaker a

[1:33:42] few years back um they don't make it

[1:33:45] anymore but it was a v curve it was all

[1:33:47] base and travel but then you get the

[1:33:49] premiere series now and it's completely

[1:33:51] neutral speaker so Clips is probably the

[1:33:54] biggest example of the V curve most of

[1:33:57] their products are just boom and Sizzle

[1:33:59] there's a there are a few exceptions

[1:34:01] there's some good products that they

[1:34:02] make but a lot of their products are

[1:34:03] just lots of Base High sensitivity we've

[1:34:07] yeah back in 2010 we did a blind

[1:34:09] listening test and we even had the clips

[1:34:11] representative come out to see if he

[1:34:13] could pick his favorite speaker and he

[1:34:15] knew every time the clips came on even

[1:34:17] though we level matched it he picked it

[1:34:19] every time he knew it yeah so you can't

[1:34:22] connect yeah it was so obvious how

[1:34:24] colored the sound was in that speaker

[1:34:26] and of course he was going to pick that

[1:34:28] as his preferred speaker because he sold

[1:34:29] it but I couldn't fool him with the

[1:34:31] blind test because he was already

[1:34:32] familiar with the sound of the speaker

[1:34:35] that's unbelievable I mean it makes

[1:34:37] sense I guess if you spend your life

[1:34:38] listening to One product like or

[1:34:40] spending a majority your like right now

[1:34:42] you you'd probably be able to pick it

[1:34:43] out too I'd be curious to see if you

[1:34:45] tune a room if you could tune like five

[1:34:47] rooms and you had like a preset set to

[1:34:50] compared to your the other people you

[1:34:51] work with if you could tell your sound

[1:34:53] signature over the other people that set

[1:34:54] up rooms like if you did BL you know

[1:34:57] room to room you could pick up on it

[1:34:59] there's no doubt I mean um we all we all

[1:35:01] calibrate the taste at the end of the

[1:35:03] day I mean you want to get flat you want

[1:35:04] to remove the resonances in the room you

[1:35:06] want to have your base linear but you

[1:35:09] still have subjective listening

[1:35:10] preferences look I set my room curve

[1:35:13] where my Bas at 20 htz is you know 5db

[1:35:17] above where it is at 100 Hertz there's

[1:35:20] people I have reviewers that like it 10

[1:35:22] DB or 15 DB higher so sometimes people

[1:35:25] come in my room they're like wow your

[1:35:27] Basse is amazing and then other times

[1:35:28] like I need more base and I notice a lot

[1:35:31] of people that think that they need more

[1:35:32] bass are the ones that are really into

[1:35:34] car audio that have the Dual 18s in the

[1:35:36] back of the trunk and they're already

[1:35:37] probably have hearing damage because

[1:35:39] they're listening at 120 DB eight hours

[1:35:41] a day while they're driving so it really

[1:35:43] depends on your hearing Acuity you know

[1:35:46] your listening preference but yeah I

[1:35:48] absolutely say that everybody Tunes

[1:35:50] their systems differently and if we did

[1:35:52] that if I had different reviewers coming

[1:35:54] in tune my system you would you would

[1:35:56] hear a difference for sure we all have

[1:35:58] you know various

[1:36:00] preferences yeah I watched one of your

[1:36:02] recent uh I don't know if it's not

[1:36:04] technical live yeah I guess it would

[1:36:06] have been a live stream um and I'm sorry

[1:36:08] I don't know all the the remember all

[1:36:09] the names of the people you have but I

[1:36:11] know uh Anthony gani was on there which

[1:36:13] I went back and watched a lot of his

[1:36:15] like seminar stuff on room Acoustics and

[1:36:17] room treatments but it was interesting

[1:36:19] to see like the the difference and the

[1:36:21] mentality of the people that you had on

[1:36:23] like the one guy was like I just want

[1:36:25] bass right like I don't I getting rid of

[1:36:27] it is not negotiable I need Bas I need a

[1:36:30] base curve and you know then there was

[1:36:32] the more conservative approach well you

[1:36:34] know it needs to be a little bit you

[1:36:36] know more level than that and everybody

[1:36:39] has a different taste and it's much like

[1:36:41] ours too right like some people just

[1:36:42] want it loud and Brash like the Hellcat

[1:36:45] stuff I mean there can be a lot that can

[1:36:48] be done with a car that is obnoxious and

[1:36:50] fun and and same thing with a system

[1:36:52] that is just like turn your guts inside

[1:36:55] out with bass um for certain certain uh

[1:36:59] music especially it can be a lot of fun

[1:37:01] so I don't think there's one straight

[1:37:02] answer that's one thing I've learned

[1:37:03] from watching you guys there's not like

[1:37:05] one right answer on how to do it it's

[1:37:07] it's more about what do you like

[1:37:08] personally and what can you actually do

[1:37:11] realistically and be happy with um and

[1:37:14] that's what you really help me with

[1:37:16] figure out in my own home

[1:37:19] stuff yeah and and you know and even at

[1:37:21] the end of the day when you set up your

[1:37:23] system there's nothing wrong with using

[1:37:25] tone controls or or to have various

[1:37:28] profiles so depending on what you're

[1:37:30] listening to you might want to adjust

[1:37:31] the Bas of the travel up or down um I

[1:37:34] have a I have a mode for my wife she

[1:37:35] does not like bass unfortunately and it

[1:37:38] and it sucks because if I want to play

[1:37:39] some deep stuff when she's sleeping no

[1:37:42] matter how much sound isolation I did in

[1:37:43] my room nothing stopping a 21in

[1:37:45] subwoofer from penetrating the walls it

[1:37:47] just doesn't happen so I have um a

[1:37:50] calibration setting for her that knocks

[1:37:52] the base 6db down and I get rid of the

[1:37:54] infrasonic because she can't handle the

[1:37:56] infrasonic so it's nothing wrong when

[1:37:59] having multiple calibration settings

[1:38:01] yeah that's smart especially for that

[1:38:03] this is the looks like the last question

[1:38:05] we got uh morance mm 7 7025 Power Amp

[1:38:09] versus parasound a23

[1:38:11] plus so those multi-channel uh morance

[1:38:14] amps they're decent they're by there may

[1:38:17] be a slight step up from what's in their

[1:38:19] avrs parason amp is exceptional amp I

[1:38:22] mean that's I would choose the Paras if

[1:38:24] if the money wasn't you know a

[1:38:28] factor makes sense I'm sure you get

[1:38:30] these questions like this versus that

[1:38:32] and sometimes they're not very

[1:38:34] straightforward but sometimes they're

[1:38:35] very straightforward I mean if you're if

[1:38:38] you're base managing your speakers and

[1:38:39] you're not playing it loud you might not

[1:38:40] even hear a difference between the two

[1:38:42] amps so it really depends on you're

[1:38:43] listening but if you're doing full range

[1:38:45] and you have low impedance speakers the

[1:38:46] parasound is going to drive those

[1:38:48] speakers with more

[1:38:50] Authority

[1:38:51] makes sense um I'm just gonna cut off so

[1:38:54] no more uh because we got to get Gan off

[1:38:56] here he's not the 4H hour power guy um

[1:39:00] uh I have some point yeah I don't want

[1:39:03] this guy to starve here I have a giant

[1:39:05] head in big ears hard to find over the

[1:39:06] ears that are big enough to be

[1:39:08] comfortable use Sennheiser 598s for

[1:39:11] years

[1:39:13] recommendations how do you feel about

[1:39:15] headphones I have so many headphones

[1:39:18] sitting under my desk that I haven't

[1:39:19] even opened to test yet um

[1:39:21] I look at the clamping force on

[1:39:23] headphones because I have the same

[1:39:24] problem I can't wear headphones for too

[1:39:26] long especially with glasses and if they

[1:39:28] put too much pressure on my head they

[1:39:29] drive me nuts I don't know if he's

[1:39:31] looked at I like the focal Stellas I

[1:39:34] think they're pretty comfortable they're

[1:39:35] they're a bit bulky but you know I think

[1:39:38] focal makes a comfortable headphone if

[1:39:40] you want a wireless headphone the mark

[1:39:42] levenson's are actually pretty

[1:39:43] comfortable um I'm not too thrilled with

[1:39:46] the call Quality on them because it

[1:39:48] cancels the noise cancelling when you're

[1:39:49] doing a call which is we weird you hear

[1:39:51] the cabin when when you're on an

[1:39:53] airplane I don't know why they did that

[1:39:56] and um yeah I mean that's that would be

[1:39:59] my recommendation always look at the