Lanterns Episode 2 Review: Grounded Mystery — Full Breakdown & Transcript

[00:26] am your host, Ryan Ary, and today we are talking about Lantern season 1, episode 2. We haven't done a review or a reaction video to this show yet, but two episodes in, I am loving this show. This is exactly what I wanted to see from the

[00:39] DCU. Different kinds of stories, presenting old stories that I thought I I'm really excited to talk to you guys about episode two. Let me know in the guys have anything you want us to talk about, any problems you want to address

[00:52] or questions for us. But now, let's bring on our panel. We do have somebody who's coming in a little late today. But for starters, first of all, you know him doesn't know it. So, please don't tell him, Mr. Colton Ogburn. What's up,

[01:04] Colton? I'm on hold with with Janet. Uh, sorry. with Am I doing it right? >> So So many bits. So many bits.

[01:16] >> And of course the guy who >> Oh, sorry. I thought I thought you were it. And of course the guy who secretly lives under the Screen Crush store, Mr. Lee Mazio. What's up, Lee? >> Hello. Hello. So excited to talk about

[01:30] lanterns. Very happy. >> Yeah, you've been you write the videos. lanterns videos, man. So, like it's good to actually have you on and talk face to face. Um, I know a lot about DC, right? I grew up reading the Silver Age Justice

[01:44] League. I collected also the 2000s. I'm pretty up on stuff. No one has the amount of DC knowledge that Lee does. It's actually like I'm kind of worried about you with some of the >> It's a little concerning.

[01:57] there's certain things in these shows we can Google. You can look at a license plate and Google that license plate and then Green Lantern after it, but you're like, "Oh, yeah, and that's similar to this obscure line of dialogue from this

[02:10] know that. That's incredibly impressive stuff that you put out." And thank you so much. >> It's always a pleasure to write them and uh find new things that I love about the comics every time I'm going back through

[02:22] them. So, it's great. >> Yeah. And you recommended a great comic I really love. It's a great comic. >> I want to What do you think about the series so far? Let's start with Colton.

[02:34] series? >> I love it. I I think it's it's exactly what I thought it would be when they said um that this was going to be True Detective meets Green Lantern. This is exactly

[02:50] what I had in my mind when they said that. It feels very It It's got that True Detective vibe to it. It's got that, you know, classic HBO feel. It also has a little bit of like a Taylor Sheridanness to it. I don't know if it's

[03:02] because where it takes place or because Hal is wearing cowboy boots, but there's something that it kind of has that vibe to it as well. It's just a really well-made show. And I I think we might have HBO to

[03:17] thank for that because not to turn this into bashing on Supergirl, but one of the things we talked about was with Supergirl, James Gun like wasn't in the room a lot and it started making us wonder, oh

[03:29] well, does that mean that they DC Studios can't make something good without James Gunn in the room? I think it we're seeing here with Lanterns. No, room. You need somebody with a quality control like an HBO because I I would

[03:45] have trouble thinking of any show that HBO has done that wasn't at least really good. I mean maybe there's one or two. >> Damon Lindelof is a co-creator of the show. And as far as like, you know, HBO pedigree, Watchmen, Leftovers, Lost on

[03:59] ABC, like it really doesn't get much much better than that. Um but yeah, I'm I'm right there with you, man. Like I I thought True Detective would be True Detective in space. So, I'm glad to see they're keeping it grounded because one

[04:11] thing that after the the Ryan Reynolds Green Lantern, I think the general their head. Oh, it's goofy. It's silly. And I think they needed to go to the town hall meeting and to the really basic things and to show how Jordan who

[04:26] >> and is helpless to prevent it and there's no magic [ __ ] uh story. And it's and you guys know way more about Green Lantern than I do, but when I think Green Lantern, I don't necessarily think it, oh, it has it needs to take place in

[04:41] space or on other planets and stuff. His his main job, as I understand it, is protecting Earth, protecting his sector. So, the idea of seeing this space cop protecting his planet from like this secret alien invasion, that feels very

[04:57] Green Lantern to me from what I know. Le's face is about to explode with you to protect one planet. >> No, no, no, no, no. I I will say that it is >> like the core like how Jordan is part of

[05:13] the larger Green Lantern story at play and that very much more is a space opera than like western cop style earth is the only planet we focus on. Um, and it

[05:27] predominantly is like a space saga, but I think the great thing with this show is that making it focus on how and especially with training a Green Lantern

[05:39] that hasn't been to space yet and that hasn't opened uh his Green Lantern job title to being a Green Lantern that has gone to OA, that knows of the Guardians, that knows other um alien species. I

[05:54] mean, like he does, but hasn't met them. And I think that eases us as the audience into it more, especially like Colton, like you're saying, for someone who just knows the Green Lanterns as people in space, or rather as not people

[06:07] people in space, or rather as not people in space, uh, just on Earth. Yeah. sorry. I I want to hear Lee, what did you think of these episodes before we get too far into that? >> I I love them. Um, I think I texted

[06:20] >> I think I texted you, Colton, that I said, "This hooked me more than the said, "This hooked me more than the penguin did." Um, episode one right from the jump. I was like enthralled with it. Especially the ending. I did not think

[06:33] that they would do that. Like though, you know, it kind of felt obvious the choices they were making with how, I didn't think it would be in episode one. And the fact that they had the guts to do that,

[06:45] I'm I'm sold. I'm already locked in. >> Yeah. I mean, and the Green Lantern character, I mean, yeah, everybody knows Green Lantern, and I don't have any data to back this up, but I think you'd be pretty hardressed to to find like if you

[06:58] theater or whatever, and ask people like, who is Hal Jordan? I don't know that you're going to get a lot of like, oh, he's, you know what I mean? Like, he's not that the Green Lantern character in the lore is not at that

[07:11] level. And the reason I'm bringing this up is because I think that the way they're doing the show without doing the whole origin thing, which gets old, >> they're treating John Stewart as like this audience proxy

[07:26] >> to introduce >> the whole idea of Green Lantern. And I think this first season can really serve as a great uh ground level for they could build upon this for for years and years with in DC. I think

[07:41] of Hold on just a secondly. I like the idea of Colton being outside of a shopping mall asking people questions when no one goes to a shopping mall. >> like, "Hey, do you know who the Green Lanterns are?"

[07:55] insult Colts in that little bit. >> No, I got it. Um I think they're kind of already doing that like building in and out at the same time. Um, I I think the perfect line was from William Min in the first episode where he was like, "By

[08:10] virtue of your existence, there's a whole galaxy out there." And just by introducing how >> we're already exploring all the new sectors of the DCU, already seeing tech from different universes on the Earth in

[08:25] the DCU. Um, I think the choice to do multi-timelines within the show also really helps. Um, but yeah, just all around like you know, speaking too. Sorry, Colton. Go ahead. >> Yeah, speaking of the multi-timelines,

[08:40] sometimes that's a crutch I don't like because it feels like the the show just does not trust the audience to stick around and pay attention. This is handling it very well. And God, there show it. It just came out. It has David

[08:53] Harbor and Jason Baitman in it. Uh, it's a murder mystery uh DTF. DTF. I did uh this jumping back and forth because it was kind of a murder mystery thing as well. So Ryan, you're right that this works really well with

[09:07] you're solving the case backwards like you're the detective. So yeah, it's >> Absolutely. And uh and that's what True Detective did too, by the way. True different timelines. But before we go any further, I want to bring on one of

[09:19] my all-time favorite film writers out there today. Uh she is right now the hottest free agent in the biz. If you're looking for people to write about movies than to talk to Rachel Leechman. What's up, Rachel?

[09:33] >> Hello. I'm sweating because I was running here from the MTA. >> You didn't have to run, but curse the MTA for making you late. Um, I haven't do you think about these first two episodes?

[09:45] >> Kyle Chandler remains hot. John Stewart is hot. It's a hot show. And I think that seeing everyone online suddenly realize that Kyle Chandler is one of our

[09:57] hottest television actors is maybe my favorite thing that's been happening on the internet in recent years. Just a plethora of friends. >> Apart from finding the two leads physically attractive, very reductive of

[10:09] meat for you to ogle. What do you think about the show? >> Yeah, is also hot. Yeah. >> Um, no, I love it a lot. I think it's like it's perfect for the space cops because I feel like if we went into a

[10:23] show about the Green Lanterns and did like the Ryan Reynolds shick with it like the movie did, >> it wouldn't work. And it hasn't just enough elements of like, you know, how being a pilot and like all like it has

[10:37] being a pilot and like all like it has enough of all of that that it it feels like it's honoring what these characters represent and who they are while also doing something new and exciting. And I love that it's set just in like one town

[10:51] and one case and it's not like a rolling like, okay, here's your case of the week. Like I I like how it is set up a lot. mysteries of this show I want to get everybody's opinions on. U the town, the

[11:04] bird, the aliens, the big bad, who could maybe be the big bad for the DCU. But in our breakdown video and on screen crush.com right now on the Easter egg article we just posted there, there's a um a thing you mentioned where he goes

[11:18] to the hospital check-in and everything in the hospital's wrapped in plastic. >> No one has gone into this hospital. It's very Invasion of the Body Snatchers. the hell's going on in this weirdass town?

[11:33] >> Um, I also thought it was very It was very Plurbian to me that whole scene. >> Yeah. Just the whole town vanishing. I think and I've seen some people online

[11:46] also have this take that the town of Rushville may have over time just been Rushville may have over time just been replaced by manhunters and there's no real reason for there to be a hospital because

[12:01] because >> why would they need a hospital? Um so I that. I feel like that is where obviously this is going. It just seems obviously this is going. It just seems to be the AAM's razor of the show. But I

[12:16] don't know. I I personally am not a huge fan of the whole town being Manhunter's sticktick. But it is like that way in the comics that after they're, you know, expelled by the Guardians, they go off onto Earth and

[12:31] I'm forgetting the most famous guy's name, but he assimilates with humans on Earth and tries to, you know, spread the manhunt way. So, it makes sense. But >> We're looking at manhunters. You don't think we're looking at just other kinds

[12:45] you think because the manhunter thing makes sense? If the guy was an alien who was a part of the group we'll talk about in a second, uh that torture Jon. If sense he would go into a town of Manhunters and start shooting people up

[13:00] or influence them to shoot each other. >> I also got a bit of a World's End vibe, >> I also got a bit of a World's End vibe, that Simon Peg movie where like the >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Like when I haven't seen that

[13:14] movie in so long, but there's like, you know, when they're there doing the what whatever. >> Yeah. They're they feel like they're not wanted. And Hal says that same line in the episode. I feel like I'm not wanted

[13:29] here. Nobody wants me here. And when he's walking around town and it's like a ghost town and then you realize, oh, the entire town is at that meeting, which isn't very many people really. I just loved all of that. And it does kind of

[13:41] feel like a I don't know, like a like it's a hive mind, like maybe there's not really humans there or anything. >> I don't Are we sure that because I only guys know better than me. Are we sure that that alien detector is actually an

[13:56] that that alien detector is actually an alien detector and not a human detector? it. >> Yeah. >> And John walked through it and was fine. And John has even less alien tech if you

[14:10] >> So where does Min Senior fit into that? manhunters. Here's Min Senior. Like I hate aliens. I can't stand aliens. My employer is worried about aliens. I mean, does it make sense for there to be

[14:23] one true manhunter and other people are robots? But I don't think Carrie Kaine, uh, and we'll talk about that name in a second from Gotham, is a Manhunter robot. >> I don't believe she is either.

[14:36] but she's married to a robot? Like, is >> I think her not being from there was a really key piece of I'll let Lee go, but True. That was a key piece of exposition there for us to know that she's not from

[14:49] there. >> Yeah. I mean, I I like did zooies around my kitchen when she said Gotham. I was ripping, you know, drywall out. I was so ripping, you know, drywall out. I was so excited. Um, but I don't know. It just

[15:02] opened so many doors. But yeah, I definitely don't think I I think she definitely don't think I I think she knows more than she's letting on to Hal. knows more than she's letting on to Hal. >> Do I think she is aware if M or if I

[15:14] don't think her husband is a manhunter? I think making senior if anything would be. But I also I don't know because there is a thing in the Jeff John's comics where the manhunter's whole thing is to like no

[15:29] one no man escapes the manhunter. They there's the one ultimate manhunter who is hunting down the old man old manhunter on earth. He wants to like be the ultimate one. Mhm. >> So that could I guess happen if if we

[15:44] >> So that could I guess happen if if we take it a different way where it is like the ultimate manhunter that has his little other ones, but I I don't know if I necessarily see that, especially with this whole NDA cuz he isn't the one that

[15:59] is in charge, I guess, or if the NDA, like you said, if it even exists. They did specify um and we'll get to the other guys in a second, but um they did guess it could be a twist that there is more than one. They're wrong about that,

[16:14] more than one. They're wrong about that, but doesn't Anton have like some kind of it can look like a human. I think it's a better show if there's only one. town. Like it's weird that no one's ever sick,

[16:27] don't know. That's a little too easy for me in a show that set up a mystery this damn cool. The whole thing just feels fake. There's something to it. And have that Plurbus feel. >> No, mind control makes sense. Like

[16:40] nanobots in their bodies. Like I like that because the nanobots would also keep them from getting sick. Uh Lee, in the breakdown, we also Oh, go ahead. >> Oh, sorry. I was going to say or just fear. Like that's a huge part of just

[16:53] the Green Lanterns in general. And Carrie makes a whole point about how the makans, if you give them more power, the town is going to see them as the seed of power. They could just simply be like, "Hey, I know about aliens. Here's this

[17:07] alien tech. You guys trust me, or else there's going to be another invasion. You saw Aban Sir crash down 10 years ago. You want that to happen again?" It like it could just be simple human fear just, you know, listening to the leader.

[17:21] >> Well, let me ask you this. So, in this universe, um, and part of this might Just like in the comics and in the green the how the Ryan Reynolds movie, he was trained by Sinestro. It all went bad. Sinestro is in jail. Now, at this point,

[17:36] do the yellow lanterns exist? Because maybe that's the reveal. Maybe it's the yellow lanterns working with the manhunter to create fear. Maybe with the manhunter to create fear. Maybe with the end goal of overthrowing the Guardians.

[17:53] like we we have very limited information at this point on the lanterns and I feel like Hal loves to just be saying [ __ ] and so if there were like the layers to

[18:05] the lanterns that we do know exist within the lantern core I think he would be the first to kind of make a joke about like that's the other guys and he hasn't done one of those things. So unless he's like he just doesn't know or

[18:18] he's told not to say anything, I don't think they exist at this point. >> Only in canon the yellow lanterns exist before Sinestro's turn. >> Okay. >> Sinestro the fact that he is

[18:34] >> now in the science cells. I'll be honest, I was a little hung up on this myself. Um especially because it seems like his betrayal of the core you good cult.

[18:50] >> My webcam is like >> that was great >> was um was something fairly recent. Um especially with how raw it still is to how um but it also just side note very

[19:05] weird and funny to me that they have like a a wiki for Sinestra's crimes like on Google like that to me when she pulled out her phone I was like love >> so common that's that's what I like about this lived in universe though like

[19:19] >> and you know Colton you said it's how they're presenting the world. We're John world that gun created you know that they've been around for so long. Sorry, >> No. Yeah. I love that. It's very fun. Um, so

[19:32] >> where we live in, you know, we're people who are used to superheroes being around they're kind of putting us in that seat. Go ahead. >> Yeah, I am kind of unsure if the yellow core

[19:46] exists currently. If it does, I think Sinestro is the only one that is a member of the Sinestro core at the moment. Um, moment. Um, do I think Hal would know?

[20:02] do I think Hal would know? Maybe. I think maybe Sinestro may have Maybe. I think maybe Sinestro may have said something because there is I'm forgetting in which, you know, timeline it is. But there before

[20:16] Sinestro is arrested, he does say to Howal like, "You and me, what if what if like, "No way." So I I do wonder if that happened and if Hal is just keeping that to himself and maybe that's why he's a little weird

[20:31] with the oath at the moment because he's like why why wasn't I aware of this prior to this with like I feel like everything I know is a lie. But I I don't know. That's another point I like that they're slowly unraveling something

[20:43] that is so important to this main character that we have no idea about >> Yeah. And with them treating how like like this old dog that you know they're trying to retire kind of thing. >> I I wonder if we could see a scenario

[20:59] where he is tempted to like okay well they want to take the the green the I'll join Sinesttor. I'll be a yellow lantern. I wonder if that's a something that they could explore because the show is called lanterns. So maybe that is

[21:13] kind of implying that they're going to explore more than one. >> I you in our video too that the Red Lantern. So, let's talk about Anton and their origin is very similar to the Red Lanterns. We mentioned this in our

[21:27] >> but like basically the Manhunters destroyed um uh Atrocidus. Is that his is it? Yeah. >> So, I don't know. Do you guys think that that could be a thing, too? Like they're not wearing red rings, but they're

[21:41] definitely aliens. >> Yeah. I I will say the atrocities theory is fully just based on the fact that this guy in his character profile is

[21:54] cenamed Anton. That's an A. And it says that he's fueled by vengeance because his sector was, you know, harmed in the past. Just those two alone, it screams

[22:06] past. Just those two alone, it screams to me the massacre of Sector 666. And I feel like the fact that they're pulling a lot from the comic um the Jeff John's run, I think that's probably where they're going. Also, um perfect still

[22:21] right here. The fact that he is in the center and then has the five other members around him. >> Um he the >> Yeah, he's in the center and then there's the five others. Um and so it's

[22:35] the five inversions are the other survivors of the massacre. Um, so it just I don't know was all lining up. But again, he doesn't have a red ring. He's also not a big red guy. I don't know. Budget constraints maybe. But that just

[22:49] makes the most sense to me. >> I I also hope they don't go to God. Aren't there like nine [ __ ] like different land? There's the orange ones. >> There's 11. Sorry. I don't know my my colors. I

[23:03] >> That just seems a little excessive to me. I don't know. I think that you reach a point where it's like, Jesus Christ, how many different lantern things are of infinity stony. I don't know. >> Listen, how many kids are is Batman

[23:17] going to adopt and or have? It's just the DC way. >> They just be doing things. >> Speaking of DC, we've got a lot of super instance, Johnson uh Jay Johnson gave us two bucks and said, "Lantern should have

[23:30] been James Gunn's second movie." And we've got a lot of people saying that um you know debating whether or not they would rather have an HBO series or a

[23:42] movie when it comes to DC projects. You know this idea of doing your universe on two platforms. You know Marvel pretty much spearheaded the shared universe on TV platforms as well. Now they're pulling back or maybe not pulling back

[23:55] but they're definitely re-evaluating. So I'm curious what you guys think about telling some of this universe on TV screens. Is it too much? Is it going to give us too many things to follow? And just, you know, where I think we have at

[24:07] this point more projects on TV than we've had in the films. >> I think The Lanterns needed to be a TV show only because we've watched them show only because we've watched them attempt to tell how Jordan's origin

[24:22] like first big mission in a movie and it just all was too much. And like sure, something like they're doing on the show in a movie and it would work, but I think this is a much better way of introducing the lantern core just

[24:37] because I was like this is my brother's favorite superhero thing of all time are the lanterns. And so I've heard about it my whole life. And so like I think like this is the only way you could kind of introduce them in in a way to bring them

[24:51] whatever you want to bring them into because I think if you tried to just do now here are the guardians they're going to talk about Sinestro and then he's over here and now we're jump it would be way too much in a movie. And so I think

[25:05] this is the smartest move for at least the lanterns because that is, you know, this is the first big TV thing that hasn't started in a movie, right? Because Peacemaker obviously was introduced in a movie and

[25:19] now this is the first one that's like kind of on its own. as the first movie the DCU, I guess they've got three projects, not two. always talking about how certain things should be movies or TV shows or not.

[25:35] we're going to see the we're going to see John Stewart in Man of Tomorrow, right? So, we we'll see that that crossover there. I don't know. I There are certain characters I I don't think like big on I I don't think you do Star

[25:49] Wars on TV. Mandalorian proved me wrong on that. And proved me wrong on that. you can do it, but I feel like there's just this little much a little bit of a you're taking something away when you I hate to say downgrade because I mean HBO

[26:03] that is prestige television. So I I don't want to use you you don't put Spider-Man on TV, right? You don't put Batman on TV. You Wonder Woman on TV. I think a character like Green Lantern, I think a character

[26:19] like Flash, those are characters we we've seen Flash do well on television. I think those are characters that you can uh put on TV,

[26:32] the Guardians of the Galaxy and Doctor Stranger characters you exactly as well. So like you never I think it all comes down to the story you want to tell. >> I'd also like and Wonder Woman were on TV.

[26:44] >> Yeah. I was going to say some of the best Batman stories are the monster of the week based villain of the week based televised stories. Um so I I think that >> and the best Batman of all time is

[26:58] animated series. >> Exactly. Um, I I think that it it really >> Exactly. Um, I I think that it it really matters on the story instead of the character, on the format in my opinion, rather than

[27:12] are they big enough to be a marquee hero? Are they small enough to be in this series? I think that it just matters. Is this story worth breaking matters. Is this story worth breaking down into seven parts or can it be told

[27:26] down into seven parts or can it be told in an hour and a half to three hours, in an hour and a half to three hours, four hours now, I guess. Um, but yeah, I think it it really just depends. >> And it's not can it, it's where where is

[27:39] the story best served? That that that is what that's the question you need to ask is because I I agree with you. There are things like Guardians of the Galaxy that yeah, they were a very unknown thing, but then now it's a very successful film

[27:53] franchise. So, no, I don't think certain characters should be relegated to TV or whatever. No, it it's where does the story fit best? And I did did our commenters say that Lantern should have been James Gun's next movie. Is that

[28:07] >> One of them did. Yeah. >> I completely disagree. I having a show on on HBO that can explore these characters this way. I Why would you

[28:19] >> Well, and >> we should know too it's on proper HBO, the full marquee treatment just like Penguin did. Sorry, Rachel. Go ahead. like I was sitting over here thinking like listen, if you wanted to make a

[28:32] Batman show that felt like Columbbo, then I'd be like cool. Yes, that fits work. But then you have the Finchureesque Ba Batman series that Reeves is doing that is, you know, like a Zodiac kind of detective story which

[28:45] also works for Batman. And so it just really ne like depends on what you're doing where this was sold as the Green Lanterns but in like a True Detective >> And so if you put that in a movie, it

[28:58] wouldn't necessarily work the same way because True Detective was sold to us as a TV series first. >> Yeah. And speaking of Batman, go ahead. >> Yeah. I I just want to be clear. Of course you can do a badass Batman show.

[29:11] Of course you could do that. I I meant from just like a a business perspective. I would understand if there was like a rule, for example, at the studio, we don't put Batman. Wasn't that actually I think a rule for a little bit. They

[29:23] be >> They couldn't have Batman in like one of the CW things or something? >> No. Well, the CW had they started off like kind of expanding. They put the Suicide Squad and and Arrow,

[29:36] the mandate, hey, we're doing movies of these, so we don't want to confuse people and have the movie characters here, which is why they ended up doing Batoman and Supergirl at the same time they were trying to develop the DCU. And

[29:48] realized audiences can just kind of handle these things. another super chat here. This is Bryson32 said, "Carrie Kaine from about that in our breakdown video, but let's talk about Carrie Kane and the

[30:04] Gotham connection and all the wonderful possibilities of a connection to Batman >> Uh, I feel insane. I I'm so excited about that. The fact that I don't know,

[30:16] there's like so many it has opened so many different things. Um, the fact that she's a cane from Gotham in itself. Great. Like I I did say this in the breakdown that it it could of course just be a reference to Gil Kane um

[30:31] co-creator of Hell Jordan. That makes sense. But like you you don't say Kane from Gotham without meaning it I feel. >> Explain it to us for people who don't >> So yeah, the Canes are just a very affluent family in Gotham. Martha Kane,

[30:46] Martha Wayne, Bruce Wayne's mother, uh she is a cane. They are just like one of the founding families of Gotham. Um, and so Batwoman uh is a Kane and Kate Kane.

[30:59] It just it just you don't say Kane from Gotham without having a connection to Batman, I feel. And especially the fact that in the first episode she's on the phone with someone and says like give Babs Barbara my love or something. And

[31:15] you know, you're talking to a Barbara from Gotham or you're talking to someone who knows a Barbara from Goth. like what are we doing here? It's so clear. >> Yeah, exactly. Of all the names Barbara

[31:29] >> and like the fact that it could either be uh he doesn't have Barbara Gordon his be uh he doesn't have Barbara Gordon his daughter yet and it's uh Barbara his first wife. Um or or or Barbara his daughter. We don't know time.

[31:45] >> It's an older Batman supposedly. So I imagine that Batgirl might be doing her thing too. You know, we might not even see a Batirl origin. Yeah, I I don't know. I just think it it opened up a lot of different doors, especially the fact

[31:57] that they or no, I'm getting my universe is confused. They weren't talking about a GCPD show, but the fact that she knows someone who works in the force in Gotham. I don't know. Just Jim Gordon exists in this universe in my brain and

[32:13] >> Of course. Yeah. >> Yeah. Did you guys see Andy Machete confirmed that the Warner Brothers Paramount merger is placing Brave and the excuse they're using for the movie be on hold at this point.

[32:26] >> We're never getting that movie. I will say the thing about this show in particular that and I I don't agree with the complaints that it's not superheroy enough for people or it's not like comic booky enough. But I will say for the

[32:40] second time I watched this outside of my scooters when she said Gotham because I wasn't like just binge watching the whole show to review it when she said Gotham I was like oh l that's a funny joke forgetting that Gotham exists

[32:53] because this is a DC show and is not just like a joke and I was like oh no right like Gotham like she's actually from Gotham not like I'm joking around from Gotham not like I'm joking around with this man who's annoying me. Yeah.

[33:06] And I will say it did kind of I I felt like it threw me out of it for a second if I'm being honest because it's such a surprisingly grounded show that feels like it takes place in our world. Like they're in Nebraska. So when I heard her

[33:19] >> "Oh, okay. All right. We're we're going there." Okay. there." Okay. >> I love how the show has managed to >> speaking of the groundedness. The amount of times I like I'm like, "Oh, I I don't

[33:31] I'll look up a town name and I'm like, "No, that's just a town in the US that I I don't know of apparently like in Nebraska." Um, but yeah, no, it I do like the way that they've like been weaving Gotham in because we saw the

[33:46] road sign for Gotham in Superman. Um, so the way they're just >> kind of setting us up for Batman this casually and just building up Gotham as a town like how New York or New Jersey or California would be. Um, I don't

[34:02] know. I I love it. It just makes it feel like a regular show and not a superhero >> Yeah. Well, do we know where Gotham is? Because I know Metropolis is in Delaware, >> but do we know what state Gotham is in?

[34:16] >> Well, East Coast could be Delaware. Could be Yeah. go into details because like especially in the comics where New York City and Philadelphia still exist, the eastern seabboard of the United States is like

[34:29] got crazy population centers. >> Delaware being crazy. >> Jay Johnson gave us two bucks and said, "Build your world. Build your world on the big screens. Expand on TV." >> That doesn't

[34:43] have to be that. I think it just depends on the story you want to tell. like TV. >> W Division could only work on TV. Wision is expanding on TV, but then again, Wonderman is something that um because

[34:57] Wonderman is not an expansion, right? It takes in like one character from the MCU >> Um but that would not have worked as a movie nearly as well. The >> the only things when you're making a cinematic universe and it's so rare

[35:11] really when you think about it. So you cannot lean on anything unless it is a predecess unless you're making a sequel like Lantern season 2. Yes, of course

[35:23] can lean on Lantern season 1 and that be required viewing. But anything else you do, you cannot have a movie be required viewing for a show or the other way around. And if they just stick to that and make sure that when they are making

[35:36] a movie or show that they are, you know, presupposing that this is someone's first entry point and that they can just turn that on and enjoy it, then I I crossover and all that [ __ ] you want between movies and TV shows as long as

[35:52] you're making it in a way that those who haven't seen it don't feel like they need to do homework. >> And we we've seen them already uh do that with Peacemaker as well. They kept referring to Superman as the Metropolis

[36:04] Superman, >> you kind of get a feeling that something >> you kind of get a feeling that something had happened in Superman like that you >> as well. >> Exactly. And so I think that you can

[36:18] drop little Easter eggs like within the episode to Easter eggs like within the episode to tie into the movies, but I I do have a little bit of concern for the Salvation aspect when it comes to the shows and TV

[36:34] stuff with the DCU. >> Um because I was introduced in a TV >> Yeah. Let's Okay, let's get into the uh the larger story here and the villains ties in. Um before I do that, I do want to address like I want to say

[36:51] really really well. I just want to point out to people is if you replace the space stuff, right? If Howal wasn't a Green Lantern, if he was just like a cop who got really famous for like taking down a criminal ring, and if instead of

[37:06] aliens, it was a ring of criminals that were infiltrating this town, the show still works. And the best genre stories, I think, are the ones that always like build up a really good story where you don't it doesn't have to be space stuff

[37:18] characters and elements into a more grounded reality. But Lanterns does both. They blend both really well. And I think it's one of the reasons uh the every episode. So let's talk about this. So in the show in the show Peacemaker,

[37:32] the end of season 2 introducing this that Argus has another dimension called Salvation's what they call it in the comics. This is a planet they send all form their own society. And James Gun said this is a big part of the story

[37:47] this channel and lied right to our faces and said they weren't putting Dark Side as the main villain. I still maintain that James is a lion son of a [ __ ] when leading toward Dark Side, but I could be wrong because he probably knows what

[38:00] he's talking about more than me because it's his universe. Um, but I am curious because he did say lanterns was also going to build toward the big bad and >> I mean, that could be something as simple as Sinestro gets sent to

[38:14] Salvation and then that just keeps building up into a Salvation movie. It's kind of boring though. How do you guys think maybe this show is being integral into like this massive quilt that he's weaving for us? You know, weave a quilt,

[38:26] >> I think that quilt is constantly changing. I love James Gun. You know, I what what do we get called? Gunlazer. I'm a gun. I worship at the altar of >> It's a weird name, >> but he says a lot of he says a lot of

[38:41] [ __ ] I mean, look at that that announcement video he did like what is were doing with >> the DCU slate. It's a constantly evolving thing. So, I think whatever he has

[38:56] >> Yeah, of course. And I think what it's it's important to have a five-year plan, you're willing to change that fiveyear plan. So, I think yeah, he probably has something in mind, but I think wherever we end up landing in the next few years

[39:11] is going to be probably very different than what he has in mind right now. Especially if [ __ ] gets Warner Brothers, then this whole thing's >> yeah, that well that's a whole other thing, too, because there's also rumors

[39:23] about him much because they're a little unsubstantiated at this point that Gun a harder time working with other creatives like giving notes on Reeves's

[39:35] are rumors that we're hearing. Uh and also like in hindsight, Craig Gillespie Supergirl. You know, I think if I when I think back on that movie, I think the choices the director made and the script and the source material were both pretty

[39:50] solid. Um, but these are like the kind of it's interesting because Marvel didn't have as many of these growing pains because, you know, they brought on developed their house style and they were seasoned movie producers whereas

[40:03] the DCU is doing a little bit of that but on paper Supergirl should have been director, right? And Aggeras great writer like it should have worked out really well and it didn't and sometimes that happens too. I wonder if where

[40:16] James Gun's growing pains are are his relationship working with creatives or if it's just simply the Paradise Lost Show wasn't coming together and we arbitrarily to something that I said in a YouTube video in 2022.

[40:36] like I just said, gunlazer, I don't think this is the job for him. He is a phenomenal filmmaker, writer, and director. I don't think Kevin Feige would be a good writer and director. Kevin Feige is a phenomenal producer or

[40:50] more so studio head. Kathleen Kennedy, one of the best movie producers of all one of the best movie producers of all time. [ __ ] studio head. It's you have you have to stop thinking that it's all the same thing. A showrunner

[41:03] director job is very different than a studio head job. And I don't know that he is the right choice for the studio head. I want him to have full creative control of his cinematic universe, but you need Saffron and other people who

[41:19] are primarily producers and know how to work with other creatives to be the ones putting people in certain positions. >> You can do both though. I mean, like Spielberg and Ron Howard come to mind as two great producers who've like noticed

[41:33] know, great like development. Thank you, Ron Howard. You know what I mean? >> One show, one movie, one one thing, not >> at a time. Yeah. Not this ever growing >> That aside though, who do you guys think? How is this show going to build

[41:48] up to the overall plan, the overall villain? Is it going to be some space involved? Do you think it's going to be the Manhunters as the main villain? don't know yet because they're still figuring out how to get there. Like I'm

[42:04] not saying that they haven't figured out like where they want this to go, but I like, "Well, let's introduce these characters. Let's let people want to see more of them and then we'll go." That's what as much as the Marvel Cinematic

[42:17] Universe wants you to believe they knew that they were doing X, Y, and Z, they don't. And Kevin F even said it was like, "We didn't know we were doing Thanos until all of a sudden we were like, Thanos would work." And so I think

[42:29] >> "Let's introduce these characters. is let's give them their like one movie villains and then as we're building it out we can figure it out cuz it's like in reality all they have is Superman, John Stewart and Supergirl. They don't

[42:47] and I guess Peacemaker if he's a hero now but like they don't have the Justice >> Well, they have the Justice gang. Hold on. They're not the league yet, but they there's something there. >> Yeah. But they don't have like there's

[43:00] no Wonder Woman. There's no flat like they're not they don't have these Batman. So, it's like until they kind of build all that out, I think it's just going to be the the Marvel here's a movie, here's a movie, here's a show,

[43:13] >> I kind of think though that their schedule, which is great that they're screenplays, etc. But one of the reasons Marvel was able to do that, I mean, in Avengers, and it's because, >> yeah,

[43:27] a certain point you know you're making these movies so you can hit these stuff that comes from that but there was also a lot of great stuff that came from they developed for getting these movies done faster because at this pace that

[43:42] they're moving right now we wouldn't be getting their say Avengers movie until early at least until early next decade. What do you think? What do you think? >> I I think that the big bad in order for

[43:56] me to predict it right now ultimately I think it depends on where Sinestro ends up at the end of this series. I I think right now knowing that Sinestro is currently only in the

[44:12] science cells and how quick >> Mhm. or rather uh how like it wasn't that long ago that everything went down. So at the moment

[44:24] I kind of take back what I said I want to say a couple months ago about him you know leading to that being the big bad because I truly don't think it's I don't think he's that evolved yet. I think

[44:39] that we are seeing like we were seeing a Lex Luthther kind of becoming his own super villain. I think we're seeestro becoming his own super villain as well. becoming his own super villain as well. Um, so I I don't know if he is I don't

[44:53] want to say evil enough to be the big bad yet, but I don't know if we've seen enough development. Um, >> well, bring up that picture of Sinestro again real quick. So, one thing I love about this character design, he does

[45:05] just look like a guy. He He looks like he's at your deli, your local deli, and stool at the diner. >> I've seen this guy in doing a cross word now. And I >> pretty I love that. I love that he's not

[45:19] some weird looking alien with glowing eyes and made of CG [ __ ] because it But >> I don't think they're going to make him >> I really don't. >> Yeah. I I think that they're going

[45:33] >> His name's Sinestro. >> Yeah, but he's I'm saying he's I know, but he's already >> But he's already been the villain. I interesting relationship between him and Hal with this very layered history they

[45:47] already have. And sure, he might end up betraying him, but I don't think that >> I don't think they're setting up him to be this major

[46:01] villain, his fight with Green Lantern, that is part of the the history of the DCU. And I think we could see him have not a face turn, but maybe like uh we have the same enemy type thing happen between the two characters.

[46:16] a jail. It's very Silence of the Lambs, you know what I mean? Like you can tell us another two bucks and said, "What if they were doing the Legion of Doom?" I introducing various characters who are the ideological opposites or

[46:30] would be ground that Marvel hasn't done dark side with with Thanos. They've never done an evil villain team. >> What is the thumbs up doing there? I was gonna say, um, they also mentioned um

[46:43] happened. But, uh, they also mentioned >> Does it happen automatically? That's >> It's on. >> You have to shut it off your computer. >> Oh, no way. >> Sorry. They also mentioned um Oh my

[46:57] >> Sorry. They also mentioned um Oh my gosh. New Frontier as one of the comics gosh. New Frontier as one of the comics that influenced the show and the New Frontier also has Legion of Doom involved. So I I think that you know it

[47:10] involved. So I I think that you know it is building up to Legion of Doom. I think that Gun is also a big fan of that style um of that era of DC. I also think

[47:22] that Salvation, especially with um the new Gorilla Grod versus the people, um he is a big part of Salvation Run as well. So, I think the fact that all Yeah, the fact that all of these uh villains are popping up.

[47:38] coming to. >> I have a question, Lee. Is this connected to the the Doomsday, the Legion of Doom? >> Is that the >> All right. Next super chat. Star Star

[47:52] Global gave us 10 bucks and said, "What do we think the likelihood of John Senior will be part of the Manhunter? Will be part manhunter, part human?" Thanks, Zach, for that. Um, there is something weird about John's dad. John's

[48:04] dad is very much like, "You will be a Green Lantern." Like, he knows and I'm And Lee, you pointed out in our first breakdown, there were 26 bullet holes showing the growth. Like, that's how he marks the growth of his son's courage.

[48:18] Some weird [ __ ] going on. Like, and there's also the fact that John seems Lantern. Like, we didn't talk about the bird yet, but the fact that he's able to keep that bird and is essentially doing [ __ ] that no Green Lantern's ever done

[48:30] before. >> Yeah. I riddled with them and they're in places we don't even think to look for them. because I I didn't know until I watched

[48:42] our breakdown that that's like part of John's character that he has like what part of the that he can do Green Lantern stuff without the ring on. >> He himself is like the power ring. >> Yeah. When he took the ring off and the

[48:56] bird remained and Howal just does that subtle look, I was like, "Oh shit." It's little stuff like that that really makes me like this show. Just the attention to >> I >> I got a question for you real quick.

[49:11] Izzy verse NYC gave us two bucks and said, "I don't understand the question. Who would Laura Lynn be?" Ferris, meaning Carol Ferris, I guess. See you be at New York Comic- Con, but I'm not sure yet. Uh Laura Lenny, is that who

[49:25] show? >> Yeah, Laura Lenny was cast in the show. Yeah. >> Um it is not confirmed who she's playing yet. I don't believe. >> Um I'm not sure. She

[49:40] >> I think you're the right person. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah, I was conf I don't know. >> Yeah, she's a representative of the Lantern Corp, right? >> They have confirmed. >> Yeah, I saw her in my trailer for the

[49:54] stepped on your >> Yeah, not Ferris. No, you're good. So then she's not Ferris. Um I I do I don't think we will be seeing Carol, honestly. I think they're going to be replacing Hal's love interest with Carrie. That's

[50:09] Hal's love interest with Carrie. That's just kind of what the deal seems to be. Um, and I think that's okay. I think that if they were going more into the Star Sapphires and if they were going more into Hal's past, then we definitely

[50:23] would need to have that brought up and have someone beat Carol. But I think right now it's fine to not go into his past like that. I I could also >> Mike Ozenego gave us five bucks and said, "Sorry, Colton. Mike Oenego gave

[50:35] satisfied with the amount of green and constructs yet? >> me personally, yes and no. green cartoony stuff floating around

[50:48] green cartoony stuff floating around like it's confused. Uno is a tough game for me." Um, I I think that as long as it's John's not out there, that sorry, How's

[51:02] to move Earth around or big silly, you know, Jack in the Boxes just yet. I this story is about. >> You also have to think about when this show is being made. People are kind of over that. I think people are getting

[51:17] over that. I think people are getting really tired of the overuse of CG or as my my grandmother calls it that dog in Superman was very he was too AI. I'm Anyway, it

[51:30] >> I think this isn't the show for all that. This isn't the show for just you know, please don't make the super suit animated is is what I'm thinking when it comes to this show. >> They're taking the first movie to do

[51:42] that. Yeah, they're taking the right practical approach. It it fits with the story and it fits with the the era in which the this show is being made. I now. They want something that feels more real. We're seeing even stuff that's

[51:57] real. We're seeing even stuff that's filmed on digital now rerun through um they they'll print it on film and then rescan it to give it that feel. So, doing and it's smart. >> And we're gonna have to end it there,

[52:10] Rachel, where can the people find you these days? What are your socials? >> You can follow me at Rachel Leechman on Twitter and Rachel Leechman everywhere else. And you can see my work on a whole hodgepodge of websites that are linked

[52:25] in my bios and you can go there. >> All right. Thanks so much, Rachel. Thanks for joining us. Lee, you you're writing stuff for us every week here on below. Thanks so much. >> And Colton, you can find him on his own

[52:37] channel or here on Screen Crush all the time. brandishing. I can't tell what Lantern construct? >> Yeah, it's a Green Lantern middle finger. Yeah. >> Ah, see, I can't see green. All right,

[52:50] from you guys down in the comments below or are free to join Discord server. And subscribe. Smash that bell for alerts for Screen Crush. I'm Ryan Ary.