Ayahuasca: A Journey into the Mind

[00:26] the world's largest city inaccessible by road. The only way in and out is by air or by river, I'm about to head up the Amazon to a remote jungle retreat

[00:40] called Refugio Altiplano, the Refuge on the Higher Plain. to drink an ancient psychedelic drug, ayahuasca.

[00:57] Ayahuasca contains dimethyltryptamine, DMT, a neurotransmitter in our brains. leads to what many describe as spiritual experiences--

[01:13] a sense of oneness with the universe, even a sense of one's self dying. doesn't really seem relevant to scientific inquiry.

[01:26] However an understanding of the human mind everything the brain is capable of. What does it mean to feel at one with the universe?

[01:42] This isn't about having fun or taking a risk I want to learn what my mind is capable of.

[01:54] [theme music playing]

[02:16] that are structurally similar to neurotransmitters When we ingest them, they bind to receptors in ways we're still trying to understand.

[02:32] they think about people challenging societal norms to a particularly narrow slice of human history and culture.

[02:45] Fossil records, cave drawings, and archaeological digs have been using psychedelic compounds for thousands of years, and by "used," I don't just mean

[02:57] For instance, among the indigenous peoples of the Amazon rainforest, psychedelics were and, and totally mainstream experience.

[03:12] As a member of these groups, believing psychedelics can heal, is not some weird or New Age idea. But when psychedelics became associated

[03:27] the United States banned research on them in 1970. From then on, testing on humans was essentially gone,

[03:40] and a few researchers have started in what some have described as a psychedelic renaissance. comprehensive studies on the beneficial effects

[03:55] By approaching psychedelics scientifically, our understanding of the human mind.

[04:11] When I go to Peru, I will be accompanied British researchers in over 40 years on the human mind.

[04:26] don't increase brain activity, as previously thought. Instead, they decrease activity in certain areas. the greater the reported feelings

[04:38] of what is called ego dissolution or ego death. It's the part that separates you from everything else,

[04:50] and your story in it. and feelings don't cease like when you're unconscious. and all that's left is naked perception.

[05:09] that I find difficult to wrap my head around, an extremely frightening experience, one that makes them feel more connected

[05:23] Now, I knew that I might feel ego dissolution on ayahuasca, I decided to speak to some experts.

[05:35] from Imperial College, London, to meet with me. that anyone has scanned a healthy person's brain

[05:48] with FMRI before and after ayahuasca. -Yeah. -It's quite pioneering work, really. -Yeah. -I've heard you should know why

[06:01] Yeah, I would suggest that you think To make it emotional is a lot more frightening to me. and I don't want to ruin that, right?

[06:17] I don't want to drink ayahuasca and then think, "Oh, my gosh, or I don't show my wife I appreciate her enough, There's something to be said for sitting with those thoughts,

[06:32] And in so doing, they become less of a threat. All of a sudden, they reveal things to you, and their scariness seems to dissipate.

[06:47] by people who are all filming me, you know? Yeah, the most important thing is that intention to go in. You don't resist.

[07:02] while I'm on the trip. to be done in order to measure brain activity, and physiological changes to my brain.

[07:15] with functional magnetic resonance imaging, or FMRI. and how different parts connect and talk to one another. before his experience with ayahuasca

[07:31] I expect to see that one network of the brain will become more strongly connected after the ayahuasca.

[07:46] I still felt some trepidation about my trip, it was time to set off for Peru.

[07:58] involved a flight to Lima, Peru, followed by a 90-minute boat ride up the Amazon River.

[08:12] And every minute I got closer meant that it would be harder to turn back. The Refugio Altiplano retreat is in a very remote area

[08:24] and I thought it would be a great setting So, Kelly, what does the word "ayahuasca" mean? Ayahuasca's been used for possibly over 4,000 years

[08:42] plant medicine for healing in the villages. I met with José, the shaman who would be

[08:55] -Hola, José, Claudia. -Hola, amigo. [speaking Spanish] Welcome to Refugio Altiplano,

[09:10] José, how do you feel about someone like me coming in, who is not part of your culture, taking part in it [speaking Spanish]

[09:25] and for the medicine, it makes no difference. This medicine, all it wants is to make your life better we give them a very small medicinal dose

[09:39] to the medicine, and then tomorrow night, [Michael] It was great to speak with José I am nervous about the emotional part of it,

[09:53] like I've been disconnected from the real world. since its illegal status in many countries

[10:07] is dimethyltryptamine, or DMT, which is a hallucinogen DMT can create psychoactive effects

[10:21] But normally, DMT is broken down rapidly by enzymes in the brain. but ayahuasca is actually a brew made from two plants.

[10:33] and the second contains a chemical inhibitor allowing the effects to last as long as four hours.

[10:46] to compare how I change during this experience. and you're drinking ayahuasca, it has authenticity

[10:58] when you give psychedelics in the laboratory environment. after you drink ayahuasca, we need a control condition,

[11:10] a short list of questions about your journey here, on a scale here. and zero will be strongly disagree.

[11:27] to this retreat center about how past events -I got ideas areas during... -Two.

[11:40] With different psychedelic drugs to ayahuasca we've found some quite consistent changes We've seen that the brain activity

[11:55] Of course, we can't wheel an MRI scanner is pretty much the best possibility that we have to do this.

[12:10] to protect me from bad spirits during the ceremony. I didn't believe in such things, but I was glad to do it because it was a symbol of José's good intentions.

[12:38] [Michael] The initial smaller-dose ceremony with the effects beginning after 30 minutes. [José speaking Spanish]

[12:53] We'll begin with our ceremony tonight, asking God to guide us, to give us knowledge and intelligence. [Claudia] We're going to bless the medicine first.

[13:05] [music playing]

[13:22] Gracias. Maybe also a bit like fennel or something.

[13:38] I'd never tasted anything like it. It was the most nervous I would be all night. DMT from the ayahuasca was flowing

[13:51] [José chanting]

[14:04] or chants, which were meant to guide me [chanting continues]

[14:32] [José chanting] The effects began slowly and were mild.

[14:44] were swinging like a cradle. but it made me feel sick My imagination was more vivid.

[14:57] but almost always under my control.

[15:09] I was comforted by this because it was a sign Thank you, José.

[15:21] was surprised by something that I saw. like bamboo that had been cut so that it was at a slant,

[15:34] -But as soon as I did, it was gone. -Mm-hmm. is to kind of create a sort of chaos in the cortex. The second time I was like, "Oh, yeah, nature,"

[15:52] And I imagined trees, but only in this ring. and they were all right here in my head. I didn't intend for that to happen.

[16:09] if you, in a sober state of mind, just imagine something, Okay, now an image probably popped into your mind, If I asked you a specific question like,

[16:24] and then, like, basically fill in that detail. those details were already in these--

[16:36] They seemed only as real as an imagined image, but they came with more detail, and a few times-- things appeared that I did not feel like I had put there.

[16:54] But as soon as I was aware of that, they disappeared. Yeah, let's do that.

[17:10] my head was clearer, and I wanted to discuss -Hola, Michael. -Hola. You had a perfect introduction ceremony.

[17:23] the only sort of revelations I had than I needed to be beforehand and now I'm not as dominated

[17:37] I'm just kind of in this moment right now. Like, I feel much more open to mystical thinking. He recommends that you complete with more medicine tonight

[17:53] the insight into yourself. [speaking Spanish] Three-quarters. Okay.

[18:05] I experienced this But I'm fascinated by how I want it to have meaning.

[18:17] I feel like I didn't hit that oneness yet. [Robin] Michael's getting the higher dose tonight, and the experience is very likely to differ

[18:29] quite substantially from the dose that he had last night. I know that that's a big part of ayahuasca I'm open to it, for sure, but I do feel still

[18:46] some apprehension for a larger dose tonight. I'm here to pick you up for ceremony.

[19:07] -Buenas noches. -Buenas noches.

[19:26] was expected to last four hours with stronger and more vivid hallucinations. José smoked a cigar made of a tobacco plant

[19:41] that's indigenous to the Amazon called mapacho. and remove negativity from the ceremonial lodge. [exhales slowly]

[19:54] The second ceremony included another shaman, Daniel.

[20:07] [chanting]

[20:22] bright squares, like, stacked like Aztec pyramids, through these, like, repeating kind of, you know,

[20:36] I mean, too many things to really describe, music notes and colors and shapes and squares. this is going faster and faster, and this is too fast,

[20:49] and then I felt my body being covered with these blocks, and I, like, saw my body from above [José chanting]

[21:02] and I said, "Mm, this was very bad. This is not good." so loudly I couldn't ignore them.

[21:16] And I had to come up with ways to console myself and have a complete breakdown and panic attack.

[21:28] and I successfully brought myself back I'm not going to die, and everyone here can help me."

[21:47] They didn't feel like they were under my control. A note from the song would occur, because I wasn't-- I was, like, on a ride

[22:03] [distorted chanting]

[22:18] -I can do the EEG now. -Yeah, sure. about having to do these tests with Robin. and Robin talking to me and asking me questions,

[22:36] the more I realized it was just about me. "I'm here to do a show. We're filming this. Everyone will be happier if I do it.

[22:51] and that gave me the courage to do it. So being less selfish [Robin] Each time I read an item, if you could give me a number

[23:06] according to how you see yourself at this moment, okay? "I see myself right now as extroverted, enthusiastic." Okay.

[23:21] and on his pre-ayahuasca answer, "Extroverted, enthusiastic." [Robin] But now I'm seeing signs of withdrawal

[23:36] "I see myself right now as critical, quarrelsome." two.

[23:49] "I see myself right now as critical, quarrelsome." [Robin] The experience has led to a change It's in a way reflective

[24:03] [plucks notes] and it's only halfway through the ceremony.

[24:19] [Daniel singing in native language] spoken by only 5,000 people in the world.

[24:35] in explaining what it felt like It's a different state of mind, anger to someone who has never felt it

[24:50] [singing continues]

[25:14] [chuckles] I'd say about five minutes into that first song... really panicked.

[25:29] to make sure it wasn't beating as fast as I thought it was. or something near it before I stopped.

[25:41] Michael is describing what to me sounds like quintessential ego dissolution, the start of it, that his control over his mind and his body

[25:58] and he felt some resistance to that. My feeling is that the intensity of his experience

[26:11] transformative type experience. [Michael] I was there in that ego-dissolving state I wish I was able to surrender more fully,

[26:27] but I definitely got a good taste of it. So the dosage last night was much higher.

[26:42] Visions-- the visuals were really vivid, and the feeling of strangeness was really strong. I'd be curious to know what José was doing last night.

[26:57] What plants did he call forth and why? He knew you were going through an intense ceremony. But he said he was very happy because he knew

[27:13] I'm really interested in what the lessons were. I felt so small... and so humble. But-- but, honestly, I liked it. I wasn't afraid of it.

[27:29] I was glad to be reminded that I'm weak. everything I'm concerned about way above what would be

[27:42] But that made my fear and anxiety big enough The question is will I remember to apply that, Before leaving Peru,

[27:56] I'll place this on your head. after my higher dose of ayahuasca. I can't wait to see you back in L.A.

[28:10] [Robin] Being here in the jungle, it's more organic. Because of that, I feel that I've collected data and meaningful about how psychedelics

[28:25] and ayahuasca specifically work on the mind and the brain. I had my second MRI so that Robin could see

[28:40] Although my ego dissolved only for a brief few moments, and I was anxious to see what it looked like in my brain.

[29:00] Robin, welcome to my home. Thank you for coming back. -Yeah. -How did ayahuasca affect my brain? Okay, so we found something quite interesting.

[29:14] We found that your brain activity became more complex, under the ayahuasca than at baseline. in terms of how I experience things?

[29:30] Mm, I think we can understand it in terms of the richness of your imagination, of your ideas. more changeable, more dynamic.

[29:45] All right, you looked not just at my brain -Yeah. -What did you notice there? called the default mode network that seems to relate

[29:58] We've seen in other studies that network is dramatically compromised. that process relates quite strongly

[30:12] to people's ego dissolution, and yet after the experience, or a kind of rebooting of the network, as predicted, was that your brain reset.

[30:26] more integrated, more strongly connected within itself. much more interested -Yeah. -You asked me a lot of questions

[30:42] about my insight into experiences. Well, actually we saw something really nice in those data. the lower dose and then the higher dose with ayahuasca,

[30:58] what we saw was that there was a graded increase Your score at baseline was 27. After the low-dose experience, it was 39.

[31:11] Wow, I definitely felt like the larger -and learned about myself. -Yeah. to do such a, you know, in-the-environment-type study.

[31:27] I really appreciate it, and I hope that I helped. and I've learned a lot.

[31:39] I feel like my experience with ayahuasca Instead of surrendering myself to its effects, and I told myself, "It'll be all right.

[31:52] but I should've just gone in and through. that relinquishing control and selfishness can make it vanish, but perhaps in doing so,

[32:06] without the controls and dampening I'm so used to that I'm more comfortable with. tight legal restrictions surrounding these substances

[32:21] about the mind. of our understanding of these powerful compounds, about the mind and brain.

[32:36] And, as always, thanks for watching. [theme music playing